"|all you have to do is believe in Jesus".. Huh?

[heir]

I think you miss understood what I meant. I don't believe in works salvation in that we earn salvation through our works.

Yes, you do:

Yes, we are saved by faith, but faith alone or faith that works? It says, "not by works", it doesn't say without works. Our works can't save us but can we be saved without them?

14What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them

The above is just another typical MUD response applying that which James wrote to these James 1:1 KJV and wrongly applying it to anyone in the dispensation of the grace of God and someone who is clueless about just whose faith it is that justified us and saved us.

 

[Daniel1611]

:up: Yep! Romans 4:4-5 KJV

I guess Paul must've lied to the man that asked him how to be saved because he said believe on the LORD Jesus Christ and tho shall be saved. He forgot to tell him to obey commandments and do good works and get baptized... I guess, according to the works salvationist

 

[RevTestament]

Hi , and what commandments and verse is this found ??

dAN P

John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

 

[Foxfire]

Faith, by itself, is prerequisite to salvation. Works are an inevitable and inextricable extension of faith.

If one truly has faith, then one is inclined to strengthen and broaden that faith. To act in accordance with that faith.

The very act of adhering to faith, is in itself an expression of works.

ie: engaging in a discussion supporting the virtue of faith alone, is in itself a manifestation of works.

IMOFWIW

 

[RevTestament]

I think you miss understood what I meant. I don't believe in works salvation in that we earn salvation through our works.

I don't know if you realize you did this, but if you look at the passage you quoted, you ADDED to God's word because alone is not there.

8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.


Yes, we are saved by faith, but faith alone or faith that works? It says, "not by works", it doesn't say without works. Our works can't save us but can we be saved without them?

14What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them?

I wish the truth could be impressed upon them, but this "Pauline Christianity" has taken hold in America. It seems people like the idea of an effortless Christianity. Christ Himself said in effect to believe on Him was to follow Him - it is not just confessing one's belief with one's mouth - that may get one in the door, but to remain a Christian, one is called to follow Christ.
Matt 7:21 ¶Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

24 ¶Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

 

[turbosixx]

Yes, you do:

I could say the same for those that claim "faith alone". They will tell you faith that produces no works is not 'saving" faith.

Martin Luther, "faith that saves will never be alone" - Then it's not BY faith alone.

The above is just another typical MUD response applying that which James wrote to these James 1:1 KJV and wrongly applying it to anyone in the dispensation of the grace of God and someone who is clueless about just whose faith it is that justified us and saved us.

How convenient to be able to ignore inspired writing to make the bible fit your thinking. Rip James out of your bible and address the context of Romans and show me Paul is not talking about the law of Moses.

 

[turbosixx]

I guess Paul must've lied to the man that asked him how to be saved because he said believe on the LORD Jesus Christ and tho shall be saved. He forgot to tell him to obey commandments and do good works and get baptized... I guess, according to the works salvationist

He also forgot to tell him "ALL" you have to do is believe. Those who believe will act on the gospel.

True believers act on the word they have heard.

Acts 2:41 So then, those who had received his word were baptized; and that day there were added about three thousand souls.


Who were added? Those who believed the message and responded to it.

How do you reconcile James and Paul?
24You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.
Did James lie?

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

"If you love Me, you will keep My commandments"

Matthew 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:

Matthew 10:6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Matthew 10:7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.

 

[heir]

How convenient to be able to ignore inspired writing to make the bible fit your thinking. Rip James out of your bible and address the context of Romans and show me Paul is not talking about the law of Moses.

I do not ignore scripture. That's what you do. I rip nothing out of the Bible! I believe all scripture. It's all FOR us, but you must recognize that it's not all TO us. When you don't 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV you end up with MUD. You are making a MUDdy mess out of the word of God when you need to hold fast the form of sound words that you have heard of Paul (2 Timothy 1:13 KJV).

 

[turbosixx]

I wish the truth could be impressed upon them, but this "Pauline Christianity" has taken hold in America. It seems people like the idea of an effortless Christianity. Christ Himself said in effect to believe on Him was to follow Him - it is not just confessing one's belief with one's mouth - that may get one in the door, but to remain a Christian, one is called to follow Christ.
Matt 7:21 ¶Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

24 ¶Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

I see it as a scheme of the devil. He is the master at taking scripture and twisting it just enough so it's appealing. Peter even said it.

2 Pt. 3:16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.

 

[WonderfulLordJesus]

The word of God is clear on salvation, no need for endless editorials that stray from simple and clear gospel truth. No need for philosophical human error, nothing confusing to debate. You believe this, or you don't, as simple as that.

John 6

28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

Romans 10

5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above)
7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Acts 16

27 And the keeper of the prison awaking out of his sleep, and seeing the prison doors open, he drew out his sword, and would have killed himself, supposing that the prisoners had been fled.
28 But Paul cried with a loud voice, saying, Do thyself no harm: for we are all here.
29 Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas,
30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.
33 And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and all his, straightway.
34 And when he had brought them into his house, he set meat before them, and rejoiced, believing in God with all his house.

 

[turbosixx]

I do not ignore scripture. That's what you do. I rip nothing out of the Bible! I believe all scripture. It's all FOR us, but you must recognize that it's not all TO us. When you don't 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV you end up with MUD. You are making a MUDdy mess out of the word of God when you need to hold fast the form of sound words that you have heard of Paul (2 Timothy 1:13 KJV).

I see harmony in all scripture. James agrees with Paul. James is written to Christians and applies to all Christians.

Please explain to me why the one talent man was sent to hell. What did he do wrong?

 

[turbosixx]

The word of God is clear on salvation, no need for endless editorials that stray from simple and clear gospel truth. No need for philosophical human error, nothing confusing to debate. You believe this, or you don't, as simple as that.

John 6

28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

Romans 10

5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above)
7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Acts 16

27 And the keeper of the prison awaking out of his sleep, and seeing the prison doors open, he drew out his sword, and would have killed himself, supposing that the prisoners had been fled.
28 But Paul cried with a loud voice, saying, Do thyself no harm: for we are all here.
29 Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas,
30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.
33 And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and all his, straightway.
34 And when he had brought them into his house, he set meat before them, and rejoiced, believing in God with all his house.

I believe all scripture and strive to have harmony. Paul agrees with James.

 

[heir]

I see harmony in all scripture.

Acts 10:35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.

says the exact opposite of

Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

You ignore one in favor of the other, but have no biblical reason by which to do so without rejecting one. You do not believe both verses. You are guilty of what you accuse me of.

 

[heir]

I believe all scripture and strive to have harmony. Paul agrees with James.

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Ephesians 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

vs.

James 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

James 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

 

[turbosixx]

Acts 10:35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.

says the exact opposite of

Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

You ignore one in favor of the other, but have no biblical reason by which to do so without rejecting one. You do not believe both verses. You are guilty of what you accuse me of.

Titus is talking about earning salvation. The only way one could earn salvation is to be perfect.

How does one REALLY KNOW they are in Christ? The bible tells us.

1 Jn. 2:3 By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments.

How do we know who does not have the truth and is a liar.

4 The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him;

What did the one talent man do wrong?

 

[turbosixx]

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Ephesians 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

vs.

James 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

James 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

I would suggest to you that Eph is not saying without works. Again, we can not EARN salvation by our works but without them are we saved?

James is written to Christians, yes they have a Jewish background, but the truth isn't different for different people. We are all one in Christ.

 

[Foxfire]

The assertion that "faith without works is dead" is not the same as asserting that works, in and of themselves, are a means of securing salvation.

Works are not a means of salvation, they are an intrinsic byproduct of faith.

Faith without works is not genuine. Ergo, faith without works IS dead.

The fact that so many "work" so diligently to proclaim faith as being the only means of salvation is testament to their faith. Works being the manifestation of faith and faith being the sole avenue to salvation.

 

[republicanchick]

I did not get from that who or which you believed, Christ or your works?

How long are you gunna keep up these works? they haven't saved you so far...will another 10 years of works save you?


When you lay on your death bed will you have done enough?

sorry to see you don't u/stand Jesus's words...

IF you don't u/stand him, no response of mine will do any good



___

 

[republicanchick]

It takes more than mere belief. It takes belief that causes action. That is what it means to believe. Saved by "faith alone" is a scheme of the devil. Just as he told Adam and Eve they would NOT surely die, today he says "faith without works is NOT dead."

yeh, how LIBERAL of people

to say it doesn't matter what you do...

biggst lie in the world...

then these liberal "christians" want to criticize and condemn liberals in poltics... ha ha... They have 3 fingers pointing back @ themselves




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