I saw this and missed its importance... but... this verse came to me... as I read it... (Mt. 7:22)
ECT All Things Are Lawful For Me
- Thread starter Jerry Shugart
- Start date
I saw this and missed its importance... but... this verse came to me... as I read it... (Mt. 7:22)
musterion
Well-known member
True enough but, again, Judas DID do as the others did.
Would I be close to say that to Do, is not "saving faith"? In other words... Judas knew that He was He, but hated His ways?
God's Truth
New member
Come on EE, you are getting closer.
The saved life comes by the righteousness and obedience of one. (Romasn 5:18-19)
PS .... that one ain't you.
Romans 4:2 KJV
(2) For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.
God's Truth
New member
Judas did as the others did?
EE, you are so close, don't be led further astray.
EE, you are so close, don't be led further astray.
musterion
Well-known member
In my opinion, the point is that there was some assumption upthread (on someone's part) that salvation back then was the same as salvation is today under the dispensation of grace. It isn't.
God's Truth
New member
Always remember this. Always remember what you just said.
And then when you come to the truth forget what was behind.
Utterly agreed. The Belief was in who He was... (John 6:29; 63 ... but John 6:66). I fully agree because the dispensation of Paul and the Gospel of the cross was not available. If it was me... I am not ashamed to be addressed by you. You correct out of Love and no gain to yourself.
The Jews were still under the Law and the true atonement hadn't occurred yet.
In this point... this would remove Judas from being an example for this thread all together... would that be a fair assessment in your opinion?
I will add this... I was responding to an idea that someone had thrown out and I now point people reading this thread to your correction on the matter. You are biblically correct here. (On the Judas Topic)
God's Truth
New member
Moses brought the law. Jesus didn't.
Since John the baptizer the new gospel was preached.
You lack both.
musterion
Well-known member
So when some people say Judas "was never saved" they're backfilling the definition of saved from under grace into the four gospels, which was still under Law.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
If Judas believed then received the gift of eternal life (Jn.5:24) and the Lord Jesus said that those to whom He gives eternal shall not perish.
So I do not think that He believed with the following words of the Lord Jesus is view:
"The Son of man indeed goeth, as it is written of him: but woe to that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! good were it for that man if he had never been born" (Mk.14:21).
God's Truth
New member
It has always been, and will always be about believe and obeying God.
Judas might have went around pretending to be saved and from Jesus, but he was not, because he did not repent of his sins.
Wise observation that I had totally missed. Thank you Musty... I will pray that lord Vader releases you from his choke hold... it is good to be with our Lord, God Jesus, but it profits us that you stay a little longer.
The law came from GOD.
Jesus is GOD.
God's Truth
New member
Judas did not repent of his sins. He kept being a thief.
God's Truth
New member
Moses came with the old law, which included works to do to clean oneself.
Jesus cleans those who repent of their sins.
musterion
Well-known member
Further evidence, thank you Jerry.
God's Truth
New member
EE, I see you giving thanks to those who go against obedience to Christ.
Do you really think that we should ignore the fact that we have to be saved by obeying God?
Judas went around casting out demons and healing people.
But what caused him to not be saved?
He did not obey and repent of his sins.
Do you really think that we should ignore the fact that we have to be saved by obeying God?
Judas went around casting out demons and healing people.
But what caused him to not be saved?
He did not obey and repent of his sins.