ECT "Ye search the scriptures, because . . .

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When you use the word 'flesh' here, do you mean the sinful nature or the physical body?

Since our body connects our soul to the world, the worlds influence is what the problem becomes when desiring to be found in Christ. Is our soul's touch point with God via our "human spirit><Holy Spirit" sufficient for the task at hand when our soul is tempted to yield to the "worldly influences"? Is our soul of a "fleshly nature" or "spiritual nature"? Which way we lean is the reason for our temptation that prove us..
 

Interplanner

Well-known member
Since our body connects our soul to the world, the worlds influence is what the problem becomes when desiring to be found in Christ. Is our soul's touch point with God via our "human spirit><Holy Spirit" sufficient for the task at hand when our soul is tempted to yield to the "worldly influences"? Is our soul of a "fleshly nature" or "spiritual nature"? Which way we lean is the reason for our temptation that prove us..



Right, so it is the sin, not the physical systems. There are several sins that beset us entirely apart from the body as a bio-system.
 

Faither

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You said
Permit me to go a little deeper in saying that my "act of obedience" is a demonstration of His life "within" my soul that when submitted to Him, my flesh will speak His Life..

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my reply
When you say submitt your soul to Him, do you mean your life? And do you make decisions continually based upon the surrendering of your life? Do you recognize your life is not your own anymore?
 

Cross Reference

New member
You said
Permit me to go a little deeper in saying that my "act of obedience" is a demonstration of His life "within" my soul that when submitted to Him, my flesh will speak His Life..

-------------------------------------------------------
my reply
When you say submitt your soul to Him, do you mean your life?


One's soul is who he is.

And do you make decisions continually based upon the surrendering of your life? Do you recognize your life is not your own anymore?

Can you say that you do? What seems to be the problem that understanding the scriptures on the subject, explains? What is the goal set before you, if you are a Christian? How is it accomplished if not by what I have already posted?
 

Faither

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you said,
One's soul is who he is.
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My reply,

But i'm not basing daily decisions on my soul. This is where the truth lies, are we serving Him or us? "IF" we have surrendered our life to Jesus, every decision we make every day is an epistle on whether we are Faithing towards God,(pisteuo) or faithing away from God.(apisteuo)

You said,
can you say that you do? What seems to be the problem that understanding the scriptures on the subject, explains? What is the goal set before you, if you are a Christian? How is it accomplished if not by what I have already posted?

My reply,
I can, i'm not talking perfection, but genuine effort. I have an intimate relationship with Christ, i make decisions that only Him and i know about. I may do the complete opposite of what "I" "want" to do only to show God i really have surrendered my life to Him. And i'm not talking about watching TV or not, i;m talking path changing decisions. This is "inner court" faithing which is what our first surrender will turn into if it's continuous.

You said,
How is it accomplished if not by what I have already posted?

My reply,
Because it's continuous.

Remember, if our initial surrender or faithing isn't accepted by Christ, Gods Word isn't ours to understand.
 
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Cross Reference

New member
you said,
One's soul is who he is.
---------------------------------------------------
My reply,

But i'm not basing daily decisions on my soul. This is where the truth lies, are we serving Him or us? "IF" we have surrendered our life to Jesus, every decision we make every day is an epistle on whether we are Faithing towards God,(pisteuo) or faithing away from God.(apisteuo)

You said,
can you say that you do? What seems to be the problem that understanding the scriptures on the subject, explains? What is the goal set before you, if you are a Christian? How is it accomplished if not by what I have already posted?

My reply,
I can, i'm not talking perfection, but genuine effort. I have an intimate relationship with Christ, i make decisions that only Him and i know about. I may do the complete opposite of what "I" "want" to do only to show God i really have surrendered my life to Him. And i'm not talking about watching TV or not, i;m talking path changing decisions. This is "inner court" faithing which is what our first surrender will turn into if it's continuous.

You said,
How is it accomplished if not by what I have already posted?

My reply,
Because it's continuous.

Remember, if our initial surrender or faithing isn't accepted by Christ, Gods Word isn't ours to understand.


Since that is what God wants, i.e., abandonment to Him, why would you suppose that when one does, it would be rejected?
 

Faither

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Since that is what God wants, i.e., abandonment to Him, why would you suppose that when one does, it would be rejected?

Surrender is surrender. Right! half a surrender is half a surrender and falls short of what is required to have a relationship with Jesus.

Lets back up a little. I like some of the things your saying, but i need to know your thinking beyond that. That is why i try to talk about the "beginning:" of our relationship with God. WE are drawn or called first by the Father. Called to what? Called to Faithe into Him! (pisteuo) He is not ours yet, His Word is not ours yet. All that has happened is we are being drawn to Christ by the Father to make a decision. What is the decision? To surrender our lives to Him! When and if we do that, Jesus watches to see if we really have surrendered our lives to Him.. "IF" He deems our offering to Him to be genuine, we move forwards in the Salvation journey, always to another state of being and always to another testing by fire.

The easy answer to your question, is a half measure avails nothing! He's not a beggar on the street corner, hat in hand, saying, "will you please accept me" like todays christianity portrays Him.
 
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Cross Reference

New member
Surrender is surrender. Right! half a surrender is half a surrender and falls short of what is required to have a relationship with Jesus.

True, that is why I used the term abandonment.

Lets back up a little. I like some of the things your saying, but i need to know your thinking beyond that. That is why i try to talk about the "beginning:" of our relationship with God.

Redemption by Jesus Christ was the beginning of a new foundation upon which to build a new creation. Jesus authored that creation by His resurrection. His 11+1 Disciples were the first of first fruits (see John 20:22).

WE are drawn or called first by the Father. Called to what? Called to Faithe into Him! (pisteuo) He is not ours yet, His Word is not ours yet.

We are called to the Father by our understanding of what was accomplished by Jesus Christ. "No one comes to the Father but by Me".

All that has happened is we are being drawn to Christ by the Father to make a decision.

That as the result of seeking and finding God when searching for Him with all your heart, Jer. 29:13 KJV.


What is the decision? To surrender our lives to Him!

Yes!

When and if we do that, Jesus watches to see if we really have surrendered our lives to Him..

It will determine one's new birth from above by which the evidence will be life lived out in The Holy Spirit..

"IF" He deems our offering to Him to be genuine, we move forwards in the Salvation journey, always to another state of being and always to another testing by fire.

Salvation precedes the new birth from above..

The easy answer to your question, is a half measure avails nothing! He's not a beggar on the street corner, hat in hand, saying, "will you please accept me" like todays christianity portrays Him.

Indeed, salvation though free isn't cheap. Even more so, one's new birth from above.
 

Danoh

New member
?? Huh? Is that suppose to imply we [I guess me and Faither] have violated your understanding about something?

That foolishness "Faither" posted about Jesus watching to see if you keep your end of the bargain is Roman Catholic nonsense.

The Roman Catholic Santa Clause myth "he knows when you are sleeping, he knows when you're awake; he knows when you are bad or good; so be good, for goodness sake! O you'd better watch out..."

To which the Apostle Paul would have responded...

Notice PAUL's defnition of "obey the truth..." - to take a thing as certain.

Galatians 3:

1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?

2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

Look at the economy, household rule, stewardship, or dispensation on place in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John...

Matthew 8:1 When he was come down from the mountain, great multitudes followed him. 8:2 And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean. 8:3 And Jesus put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will; be thou clean. And immediately his leprosy was cleansed. 8:4 And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.

That was THEN...

Galatians 4:1 Now I say, That the heir, as long as he is a child, differeth nothing from a servant, though he be lord of all; 4:2 But is under tutors and governors until the time appointed of the father. 4:3 Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world: 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, 4:5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons. 4:6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. 4:7 Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ. 4:8 Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods. 4:9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage? 4:10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.

Check your mail box. See that letter "The Epistle of Paul to the Galatians" - its been sitting there for some two thousand years.

Put away your Strong's that you might...

Galatians 5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. 5:2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. 5:3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. 5:5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
 

Faither

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Banned
That foolishness "Faither" posted about Jesus watching to see if you keep your end of the bargain is Roman Catholic nonsense.

The Roman Catholic Santa Clause myth "he knows when you are sleeping, he knows when you're awake; he knows when you are bad or good; so be good, for goodness sake! O you'd better watch out..."

To which the Apostle Paul would have responded...

Notice PAUL's defnition of "obey the truth..." - to take a thing as certain.

Galatians 3:

1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?

2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

Look at the economy, household rule, stewardship, or dispensation on place in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John...

Matthew 8:1 When he was come down from the mountain, great multitudes followed him. 8:2 And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean. 8:3 And Jesus put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will; be thou clean. And immediately his leprosy was cleansed. 8:4 And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.

That was THEN...

Galatians 4:1 Now I say, That the heir, as long as he is a child, differeth nothing from a servant, though he be lord of all; 4:2 But is under tutors and governors until the time appointed of the father. 4:3 Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world: 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, 4:5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons. 4:6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. 4:7 Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ. 4:8 Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods. 4:9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage? 4:10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.

Check your mail box. See that letter "The Epistle of Paul to the Galatians" - its been sitting there for some two thousand years.

Put away your Strong's that you might...

Galatians 5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. 5:2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. 5:3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. 5:5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

I won't reject the Word of God or His ways as you do. The Word of God isn't yours yet! But it could be if you got out of your own way. Your still in the drawing of the Father part of your journey. All i can do is warn you, i think i've done that.
 

Danoh

New member
I won't reject the Word of God or His ways as you do. The Word of God isn't yours yet! But it could be if you got out of your own way. Your still in the drawing of the Father part of your journey. All i can do is warn you, i think i've done that.

Calvinist nonsense.

The drawing is not as you continually misrepresent it in your continued misunderstanding of it.

No surprise there; as both Strong and Vine held Calvinist views that crept into their "dictionaries."
 

Cross Reference

New member
Galatians 4:1 Now I say, That the heir, as long as he is a child, differeth nothing from a servant, though he be lord of all; 4:2 But is under tutors and governors until the time appointed of the father. 4:3 Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world: 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, 4:5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons. 4:6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. 4:7 Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ. 4:8 Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods. 4:9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage? 4:10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.


When that passage, which speaks of being born again upon being redeemed out of the world is understood AND ENTERED INTO, the new "child of God" [John 1:12 KJV] has reached the end of God's will for his life. It is the beginning of the journey Home to Father's House.
 

Interplanner

Well-known member
When that passage, which speaks of being born again upon being redeemed out of the world is understood AND ENTERED INTO, the new "child of God" [John 1:12 KJV] has reached the end of God's will for his life. It is the beginning of the journey Home to Father's House.


Most of it is not individualistic CR. It is about Judaism. There was neo-Judaism in the regions of Little Asia where Paul was writing this, worst case being Colossians. Colossians dealt with many specifics and Ephesians was modeled after it but dropped all the specifics.
 

Cross Reference

New member
Most of it is not individualistic CR. It is about Judaism. There was neo-Judaism in the regions of Little Asia where Paul was writing this, worst case being Colossians. Colossians dealt with many specifics and Ephesians was modeled after it but dropped all the specifics.

That is where you get all screwed up in your sorting out your conception of God.
The whole Jewish question is for our understanding of God's provision for us. God chose them, as a people, to example Himself for our benefit as the Body of Christ.. "First the natural, then the spiritual", [1Cor.15:46 KJV]. Israel was a "type" of God dealing with man that hasn't changed except for man now having access into the Holy of Holies. The exodus reveals that truth.
 

Interplanner

Well-known member
That is where you get all screwed up in your sorting out your conception of God.
The whole Jewish question is for our understanding of God's provision for us. God chose them, as a people, to example Himself for our benefit as the Body of Christ.. "First the natural, then the spiritual", [1Cor.15:46 KJV]. Israel was a "type" of God dealing with man that hasn't changed except for man now having access into the Holy of Holies. The exodus reveals that truth.


So you've never heard that the Judaism Paul grew up in was called 'the weak and miserable elements of the world' by him? Paul had problems with the shadow itself, not just the fact that people 'worshipped' the shadow, Col 2:17.
 
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