No, I wouldn't. But I can see your deficiency in reading comprehension from here.
ECT Wine Satan weapon of choice, and your favorite.
- Thread starter feneluscliff
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No, I wouldn't. But I can see your deficiency in reading comprehension from here.
What lesson do you mean? Perhaps you don't like wine?
feneluscliff
New member
I post a study called "wine satan weapon of choice and your favorite" if you didn't read it, please do so and if you did already, read it again. The study is very clear and I won't be taking question unless I'm impressed to do so.
Sure I read what you posted. I'm not impressed. You would accuse Jesus of providing satan's weapon to a wedding party? I think that is simply silly.
feneluscliff
New member
You didn't read it. If you did you would see what I said about the wine Christ gave at the wedding
Sure I read it. You bent the words of the Bible into a lie to support your position. Unfermented grape juice is not wine. The truth you want to deny is that Jesus not only drank wine but his first reported miracle was to produce it. He had the servants top up six huge pots used to wash the hands of those entering the festivities and then turned that dirty water into delicious alcoholic laden wine. Now by what is written these vessels ranged in size from 20 to 30 gallons each. Using 25 as the average calculates to 150 gallons or 600 quarts. That is very clear in the account. That means there must have been around 1,000 people at the party because it is recorded that they had been drinking previously and had run out of wine. Scripture even includes the testimony of the governor of the feast that the wine is excellent. I suppose you will say the governor of the feast was so blasted that he couldn't tell good wine from unfermented grape juice? You, dear sir, are in denial of some very plain Scripture..
This Charming Manc
Well-known member
You said
Well alcohol is very prevalent and often drunk at my house (3 or 4 times a week), i'm wanting you to show me where the poverty, depravity, and misery are?
I would agree with you if you had said
Whether a cause or an effect, there can be no doubt where alcohol and narcotics are abused, so is poverty, depravity, and misery.
This Charming Manc
Well-known member
I like Savannah dry and hunters gold, two south African ciders ( hard to get here ), generally ciders a little offbeat, strongbow is just to mass produced.
This Charming Manc
Well-known member
a little black puddings nice, too much is unappetizing, the best i've hard is in a salad or fritter with bacon for a starter.
Surprisingly I had veggie black pudding once and it was awesome.
Surprisingly I had veggie black pudding once and it was awesome.
This Charming Manc
Well-known member
I'm sure Gods going to care much more about how I believed on his son.
The its did I love and server the widow, the orphan and the oppressed, a discussion of choice in drinks may happen but probably not at the judgement seat.
I'm not sure that when in heaven discussing, with the father his preference in single malts whisky will be on the agenda or not.
lol this sillyness has created a casual thought,
We obviously gain pleasure from new and wider experiences, does God gain pleasure from new experiences of the things we create and is that why he made us creative so he could enjoy the new experiences of our creations?
The awesomeness of God is mind blowiing, but to have experienced everything in the second you create it must remove something from your experience of universe?
Mild pondering unsupported by scripture but any takers?
The its did I love and server the widow, the orphan and the oppressed, a discussion of choice in drinks may happen but probably not at the judgement seat.
I'm not sure that when in heaven discussing, with the father his preference in single malts whisky will be on the agenda or not.
lol this sillyness has created a casual thought,
We obviously gain pleasure from new and wider experiences, does God gain pleasure from new experiences of the things we create and is that why he made us creative so he could enjoy the new experiences of our creations?
The awesomeness of God is mind blowiing, but to have experienced everything in the second you create it must remove something from your experience of universe?
Mild pondering unsupported by scripture but any takers?
feneluscliff
New member
My work is done I have presented the truth. Like I said it will be a blessing or a curse you have decided. Have a nice day
Your brand of legalism is never a blessing.
So you would deny the very words of Jesus in Luke 7:34?
Jesus apparently drank enough wine that he was accused of drinking to excess. In his own words he proclaimed, "The Son of Man has come eating and drinking; and you say, ‘Behold, a glutton and a drunkard’" (Luke 7:34). So Jesus was accused of being a drunk.
The Greek word translated as "drunkard" in the above passage is oinopotes, which means a winebibber, one who drinks much wine. In fact, the first part of the word comes from the Greek word for wine, oinos, which occurs several times in the New Testament.
And thank you for the nice wishes. You also should have a nice day.
So you would deny the very words of Jesus in Luke 7:34?
Jesus apparently drank enough wine that he was accused of drinking to excess. In his own words he proclaimed, "The Son of Man has come eating and drinking; and you say, ‘Behold, a glutton and a drunkard’" (Luke 7:34). So Jesus was accused of being a drunk.
The Greek word translated as "drunkard" in the above passage is oinopotes, which means a winebibber, one who drinks much wine. In fact, the first part of the word comes from the Greek word for wine, oinos, which occurs several times in the New Testament.
And thank you for the nice wishes. You also should have a nice day.
Jesus stated that He has come that we might have life and have it abundantly.
The grape is one of God's gifts to us.
It is for our enjoyment.
nikolai_42
Well-known member
So you would deny the very words of Jesus in Luke 7:34?
Jesus apparently drank enough wine that he was accused of drinking to excess. In his own words he proclaimed, "The Son of Man has come eating and drinking; and you say, ‘Behold, a glutton and a drunkard’" (Luke 7:34). So Jesus was accused of being a drunk.
The Greek word translated as "drunkard" in the above passage is oinopotes, which means a winebibber, one who drinks much wine. In fact, the first part of the word comes from the Greek word for wine, oinos, which occurs several times in the New Testament.
And thank you for the nice wishes. You also should have a nice day.
Seems a stretch to believe the wine of the bible was not alcoholic. As you point out, the same word is always used. And its affects need not be doubted :
And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;
Ephesians 5:18
With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.
Revelation 17:2
And so it is no surprise the injunction Paul gives to Timothy :
Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre
I Timothy 3:8
....and Titus....
The aged women likewise, that they be in behaviour as becometh holiness, not false accusers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things.
Titus 2:3
In all these situations, it is clear that the affects of wine can be significant. But if we substitute "grape juice" (or some other non-alcoholic drink that is enjoyed by many), the verses simply do not hold water (or wine, for that matter).
That said, it is a two-edged sword. Because the very thing that makes wine potent is the same thing that causes Paul to write this :
Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.
I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ died.
Let not then your good be evil spoken of:
For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.
For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to God, and approved of men.
Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another.
For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence.
It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak.
Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.
And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.
Romans 14:13-23
It should be noted that the one who calls all wine drinking sinful is not in agreement with Paul either. But if someone cannot drink and maintain faith, then the stronger brother should not make his liberty an offense to the weaker brother. As Paul says earlier in the same chapter (and that is particularly appropriate given the beliefs of the original poster) with regard to which day one recognizes :
One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.
Romans 14:5-6
Note that this doesn't imply acceptance of SDAism. Just recognizing the issue of days and foods.
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HisServant
New member
No.. you have presented your opinion.
Anyone that says they have presented the truth (which is a lame attempt to rule out the Holy Spirit's guidance on readers and listeners) is a cultist and should be avoided at all costs.
It is the Holy Spirit that was sent to lead believers into "all truth"... not false teachers like you.
feneluscliff
New member
I'm making this one only statement since there seems to be a misunderstanding. The facts that the bible rebuke the practice of drinking wine or stronger drink show that in the days of Noah onward there was alcoholic wine and strong drinks. The bible use them interchangeably. We need to know when the bible is referring to the fermented wine or the pure grape juice which the bible also called wine according to Isaiah 65:8. If you love wine or strong drinks just say so but don't twist the bible to support your sinful damnable practice and say it is of faith. I challenge you to study this subject again with the guidance of the holy spirit and you'll see a vast difference it makes. A blessing and a curse you'll choose this day for you all have been warned. You are no longer ignorant but educated and accountable for your own action and course.
HisServant
New member
Been down that road before... what you are trying to say has no basis in scripture and voilates common sense.
Its the teachings of the SDA cult.
nikolai_42
Well-known member
Why would Paul exhort that deacons and respected elder women not be "...given to much wine" instead of totally abstaining from it?