Jesus was a Jew. These are pillars of Judaism and the Hebrew Scriptures.
Why Do We Believe Paul?
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Jesus was a Jew. These are pillars of Judaism and the Hebrew Scriptures.
marhig
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I do agree with some things you have said here, especially where Jesus doesn't teach that he died for our sins, as I don't believe that it's Jesus' natural death that saves us. Jesus tells us that we must take up our cross, yet were not to be crucified on a wooden cross, so the word cross doesn't always mean the wooden cross and I believe that this is the cross that Paul means when he mentions the cross of Christ, meaning what Christ bore, not meaning the wooden cross. Etc.
But I do believe that Paul is an apostle of God and, I don't believe that Paul taught that Jesus's natural death saves is either. I haven't seen it anyway where Paul says that Jesus died on a wooden cross to save us. He talks about the blood, but again I don't see this a the natural blood of Christ but as his life, as my mum put it, we need a blood transfusion, our blood taken away and replaced with the blood of Christ in our veins, so that we have his life running through us. Blood brings oxygen to all is members, and through Christ we receive the breath of life to keep us alive in God.
Jesus came by water and by blood, meaning he came by the word of God and he lived it out. And that life that he showed us an example, has to be within us, flowing through our veins and bringing us from death to life, darkness to light, seeing and hearing clearly the word of God. Jesus was dead to the flesh, and through that death he was able to reconcile us to God and bring us into a new and living way, but we are saved by his life, by his life within us and by living it out, being doers of the word and partaking in the sufferings of Christ.
Death doesn't save, life saves. The only death that God wants to see, is the death of sin and the death of the lusts of the flesh and for this world to mean nothing to us for it and Satan to be dead to us. And all this is done by the life of Christ within, through the holy spirit.
I also agree about the churches, I wouldn't believe in any church that collects money in the name of God and then fills a bank account. To me, any money given to any church should be given to those who need it. I don't believe in building up in this world, so for a church who says they follow Christ to build up in this world and have swelling bank accounts is wrong. Jesus came with nothing he didn't take, he gave. And anything that was given to him he shared. Even every word that was given to him from God. He broke the bread in both ways, naturally and spiritually.
He was a sacrifice, but he sacrificed his whole life for God, he was a living sacrifice, laying down his life doesn't mean dying on a wooden cross, it means not living please his flesh and living by his will, but denying those things and living by will of God. He laid down his life so that he could bring us a new and living way, he came as an example, and if we truly follow him, then we are to follow that example and live it out.
1 Peter 3
Having a good conscience; that, whereas they speak evil of you, as of evildoers, they may be ashamed that falsely accuse your good conversation in Christ. For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing. For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
Christianity is Paul. Without Paul, the followers of Jesus would have remained yet another Jewish sect, and Jesus just one more failed messiah. Why does anybody believe Paul? Mostly due to Church tradition.
Prizebeatz1
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I generally agree. Jesus was definitely a great example. I feel there is something missing, however. Namely the soul. It has been overlooked for centuries in favor of the more traditional version of Jesus. Yet being born pure of a virgin, miraculous, rejected and buried, yet still lives, applies to both Jesus and the soul. It's not a coincidence. The soul is misunderstood, treated with contempt, trampled upon, not part of the Blessed Trinity, kicked out of the party. Unfortunately it is the source of our self-worth and there is no replacement. The literal translation of the story of Jesus does not include anything about the soul and thus the key ingredient of self-worth is not taken into consideration. No one can feel good enough about themselves. We depend on religion, beliefs, careers, trophies, and relationships to fill the gap.
Notice the personality is always dependent on something but the soul is one with infinite freedom and liberation which is tied into our self-worth. The personality tries to imitate the genuine unconditional self-worth of the soul by over-compensating with belief in Jesus for example. It judges itself as bad, wrong, shameful and guilty for feelings of unworthiness, emptiness, sinfulness and judges others in the same way. It doesn't know this to be a problem. This kind of judgment is unconsciously embedded in the collective identity. Judgment is man's downfall. This is the moral to the story of the Garden of Eden.
The back-side to the story of Jesus has been lost in favor of something more digestible to the common population. It is a metaphor or extended allegory for the soul. The personality avoids the soul at all costs with disastrous effect. Many wars have been fought as the result of disconnection from this essential part of ourselves. The soul is not profitable for business and enterprise. How else would anyone be able to control people and make a dollar? Yet what profits a man if he gain the whole world and loses his soul?
HisServant
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Except for being the largest example of total failure in scripture? Why would any sane Christan want to hitch a ride on that fail train?
The Jews had everything! They had the promises, God actually lived with them. But they turned their back on him every chance they could. God eventually divorced most of them after his long suffering of their infidelity.
Seriously! I don't hate or despise the Jews... I view them for what they are (Jesus taught this, God inspired it to be written in the Old Testament.. it is not uniquely Pauline).
A thorough understanding of scripture shows that all the festivals and customs (and the need for them) have been rendered unnecessary. Jesus came only as a Jew to fulfill prophesy, which he did in the flesh, after that he poured his spirit onto all the chosen.. including a multitude of non-Jews.
Seriously, Christian fascination with the Jews.. and trying to bend scripture to show 2P2P is one of my biggest frustrations as being a Christian. There is only one Gospel and we are all one people (there is no Jew or Greek, no male or female). God will fulfill things in the way he sees fit, and much like how the Jews did not recognize Jesus, the Dispy's etc. will fail to recognize the fulfillment of prophesy and remain in their ignorance. Simply because they lean on their intellect instead of God.
dodge
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Paul taught the very same things Jesus taught.
Jhn 6:28
Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
Jhn 6:29
Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
That wasn't their fault.
HisServant
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It was absolutely their fault! They coveted the gods of their neighbors and adopted them time and time again.. not to mention the golden calf, etc.
Zeke
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This isn't fulfilled to carnal eyes looking for a earthly kingdom John 11:25-26, Luke 17:20-21, John 18:36 the spiritual covenant of liberty 2Cor 3:6 isn't of this world and the birth and resurrection is an on going event told in allegory Galatians 4:20-28, The main canard within historic traditions is it prevents most from graduating from the observational kingdom mode run on emotional goose bump power that keeps the worldly minded students divided.
No man ascends who hasn't first descended from Heaven, the prodigal son is based on the awakened divine seed Luke 15:17 in all men, Luke 15:35, Galatians 4:1. Jesus represented us as a seed that fell from the Divine Grainery , a prototype of the inward divine birth in man that passes all understanding that theology and intellectual prowess can grasp, Romans 11:34-35, none of them while serving two masters can fully except or fathom God is within them 1Cor 3:16 or they wouldn't be divided from one another, in the mean time their majoring in futuristic cloud watching based on this worlds fictional play, which is the veil that prevents spiritual enlightenment, instead their busy following egocentric personalities 1Cor 3:3-4 instead of the still small voice of the more excellent way 1Cor 13:1-13.
You are correct.....Christianity is Paul. That's what bothers me. The claim that he saw and heard Jesus on a dessert road and then proceeded to overturn many of the commandments that Jesus held dear without there being any corroboration of the events on that Damascus road. I live in Florida. If I told you I was walking at midday and I saw Jesus and he talked to me....would you believe me or would you think I may have hallucinated from sunstroke? Why give Paul a pass under the same circumstances?
There are also problems with Paul's testimony which make me wonder.
Why did Paul doubt the gospel he preached?
Paul said that he received his gospel directly from Jesus.
11 For I would have you know, brethren, that the gospel which was preached by me is not according to man. 12 For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but I received it through a revelation of Jesus Christ. Galatians 1:11-12
But when Paul met the Apostles in Jerusalem he had doubts concerning his gospel.
1 Then after an interval of fourteen years I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, taking Titus along also. 2 It was because of a revelation that I went up; and I submitted to them the gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but I did so in private to those who were of reputation, for fear that I might be running, or had run, in vain. Galatians 2:1-2
Don't you think it is strange that on the one hand, Paul claimed that he received his gospel directly from Jesus. But on the other hand he found it necessary to submit his gospel to the Apostles in private for fear that he had been preaching in vain?
If Jesus wanted to get rid of unnecessary stuff why didn't he? Why did he allow the Hebrew Scriptures to say these would be forever? How do we really know Paul had the authority to change established policy?
Jesus lived the Jewish life being careful to observe all the commandments. Paul tossed the Law into the trash heap.
According to Paul.
False Prophet
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Peter believed in Paul's testimony. Remember that Paul and Barnabas went first to the apostles in Jerusalem before he went forth unto the Greeks.
[14] Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
[15] And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
[16] As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
[17] Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
[18] But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen. 2 Pet 3
[14] Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
[15] And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
[16] As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
[17] Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
[18] But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen. 2 Pet 3
It is often hard to know if you have been mislead and fooled. Adam had the best of intentions and look how things turned out for him. The Jews messed up but doesn't the Bible prophecy that Christians will be victims of apostasy?
What I find troubling is that Jesus picked PETER as the head man of his church....yet PAUL took over and became the head man. This makes me Skeptical of Paul.
17 And Jesus said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal this to you, but My Father who is in heaven. 18 I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it. 19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven.” Matthew 16:17-19
2Peter is believed to be spurious by many scholars.
dodge
New member
Rev 22:14
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
If you are correct then Jesus was a sinner and did not die for your sins.
See what Jesus said about the Pharisees.....
Matthew 23:2-3 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
saying: “The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the chair of Moses; 3 therefore all that they tell you, do and observe,
You get it wrong. With support from Peter, what Paul was fighting against is those Christians with a Jewish root tried to say that the gentiles need to observe Mosaic Law in order to be saved.
Unlike today's church where there are no longer the Jews keeping the Jewish customs, back then there was a serious conflict between the Jewish Christians and the gentile Christians in terms of what to do in order to be saved.
Paul not only needs to set up regulations but also has to make compromises with the Jewish Christians. That's why you can still find like "women should cover their hair inside the church" which no longer practiced today.
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