WHICH CHURCH WAS HEBREWS WRITTEN TO?

[Shasta]

False accusation.

I apologize for the comparison. I certainly did not mean to imply that what you believe is IDENTICAL to what the Gnostics taught.

All about the nation of Israel and their relationship with God.

The context is God's relationship with Israel.

As I said before, the new covenant promised:

• FORGIVENESS of sin
• Becoming GOD'S PEOPLE
• KNOWING God
• Transformation: HAVING the law written on our hearts (by the Spirit)

Although these promises HAD originally been made to the Jewish people, the mystery which was hidden from previous generations (but which was revealed to the NT apostles and prophets) was that the Gentiles would be fellow heirs [of these promises] ALONG WITH THE JEWS. Other prophecies say specifically that the Light [of life] which was to be sent to the Jews would also go out to the Gentile nations (goyim).

…4 In reading this, then, you will be able to understand my insight into THE MYSTERY of Christ, 5 which was not made known to men in other generations as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to God’s holy apostles and prophets. This mystery was that through THE GOSPEL [singular] the Gentiles are fellow heirs and fellow members of the body.
(Ephesians 3:5-6)

The body of Christ is not under the law. So why would we need the law written in/on our hearts?

The term “Law” does not always refer to the COVENANT of the Law. It can also refer to the moral content of the God’s commands which represents Gods will for all humanity
.
For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful man, as an offering for sin. He thus condemned sin in the flesh,For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful man, as an offering for sin. He thus condemned sin in the flesh, 4 so that the righteous standard of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not live according to the flesh but [but live] according to the Spirit. 5 Those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh; but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit
(Romans 8:3-5)

Those who are born after the flesh and live in the flesh cannot fulfill the “righteous intent of the law” Instead, they follow the dictates of the flesh and mind, a disposition which is naturally opposed to the holy nature of God. By His sacrifice, Jesus obtained forgiveness for us. This enabled the Holy Spirit to move inside of us and begin changing us from the inside out. Now if we we walk in the Spirit we will “not fulfill the lusts of the flesh”

16 So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the flesh craves what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are opposed to one another, so that you do not do what you want. 18 But if you are LED BY THE SPIRIT, you are not under the law.…(Galatians 5:16-18)

If we walk in the Spirit we are not under the condemnation of the law because we will be doing His will by His power.

 

[Right Divider]

Ishmael isn't called a Gentile and neither are the Samaritans.

Your logic is twisted (i.e., it's illogical).

​​The Samaritans are blood related to Abraham.

So is Ishmael. Is he a Jew?

 

[God's Truth]

Your logic is twisted (i.e., it's illogical).


So is Ishmael. Is he a Jew?

I have been explaining to you that the Samaritans aren't called Jews or Gentiles and there is no scripture calling Ishmael a Jew or a Gentile.

 

[Right Divider]

As I said before, the new covenant promised:

• FORGIVENESS of sin
• Becoming GOD'S PEOPLE
• KNOWING God
• Transformation: HAVING the law written on our hearts (by the Spirit)

Although these promises HAD originally been made to the Jewish people, the mystery which was hidden from previous generations (but which was revealed to the NT apostles and prophets) was that the Gentiles would be fellow heirs [of these promises] ALONG WITH THE JEWS. Other prophecies say specifically that the Light [of life] which was to be sent to the Jews would also go out to the Gentile nations (goyim).

…4 In reading this, then, you will be able to understand my insight into THE MYSTERY of Christ, 5 which was not made known to men in other generations as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to God’s holy apostles and prophets. This mystery was that through THE GOSPEL [singular] the Gentiles are fellow heirs and fellow members of the body.
(Ephesians 3:5-6)

In God's program for the earth, Israel will bless the gentiles and the gentiles will serve Israel.

The body of Christ is something different.

(Ephesians 3:6 [KJVPCE]) That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel​

NOTE: The PROMISE is SINGULAR. It's NOT the PROMISES that God made to Israel.

ALSO: It's BY THE GOSPEL and NOT "by the new covenant".

The new covenant is CLEARLY show in scripture to be with the SAME people as the old.

(Jeremiah 31:31-33 [KJVPCE]) [31] Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: [32] Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: [33] But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.​

Completely unambiguous.

 

[Shasta]

In God's program for the earth, Israel will bless the gentiles and the gentiles will serve Israel.

The body of Christ is something different.

(Ephesians 3:6 [KJVPCE]) That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel​

NOTE: The PROMISE is SINGULAR. It's NOT the PROMISES that God made to Israel.

ALSO: It's BY THE GOSPEL and NOT "by the new covenant".

The new covenant is CLEARLY show in scripture to be with the SAME people as the old.

(Jeremiah 31:31-33 [KJVPCE]) [31] Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: [32] Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: [33] But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.​

Completely unambiguous.

You did not answer any of the points I made in my previous post from the scriptures. You just restated your beliefs insisting that it was unambiguous (without any explanation, I suppose). The scriptures I cited Jesus showed that He would initiate the prophesied new covenant by instituting the Communion supper. Indicating the wine, Jesus said: "this is the CUP OF THIS NEW COVENANT IN MY BLOOD. Although the new covenant was prophesied by Jeremiah the MYSTERY revealed to NT "apostles and prophets" was that the Gentiles would be fellow heirs of the promise.

…5 which was not made known to men in other generations as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to God’s holy apostles and prophets. 6 This mystery is that through the gospel the Gentiles are fellow heirs, fellow MEMBERS OF THE BODY ,and fellow partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus.
(Ephesians 3:5-6)

The New Covenant was a blood covenant. As with Abraham and the Patriarchs there was no bond with God without a blood sacrifice. There is no salvation no redemption unless we partake of Christ's blood atonement. Only this can abolish our record of sin and RECONCILE us to God. This event is visibly re-enacted in the performance of the communion supper. In the Jewish Passover, the wine represented the blood of the Passover Lamb which delivered ISRAEL from death. At the Lord's table, the wine is the blood of the LAMB of God who "takes away the sin of the world." After Jesus said: "this [cup] is the new covenant IN MY BLOOD" He did not say "this cup is prophetic of what you will one day have in some distant age." He then told them to drink it then and regularly. In this post, you have attempted to separate two inseparable things: the GOSPEL and the blood of the NEW COVENANT. Paul did not He called the Gospel the word of the CROSS

Everyone who believes in Christ is forgiven by the blood and joined to Him by the New Covenant. The blood of the new covenant is the means by which God procured our salvation. Without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sin.

7 In Him we have redemption through His blood,the forgiveness of our trespasses,according to the riches of His grace, (Ephesians 1:7)

Partaking of the blood and bread also showed that Jews and Gentiles were joined into one body.

…16 Is not the cup of blessing that we bless a participation in the blood of Christ? And is not the bread that we break a participation in the body of Christ? 17 Because there is ONE LOAF,we who are many are ONE BODY;for WE ALL PARTAKE of the one loaf.
(1 Corinthians 10:16-7)

 

[Right Divider]

You did not answer any of the points I made in my previous post from the scriptures.

I'm not going to follow every rabbit trail you want to throw at me.

You just restated your beliefs insisting that it was unambiguous (without any explanation, I suppose).

The definition of the new covenant in Jeremiah is completely unambiguous and clear. God will make a new covenant with ISRAEL.

The scriptures I cited Jesus showed that He would initiate the prophesied new covenant by instituting the Communion supper. Indicating the wine, Jesus said: "this is the CUP OF THIS NEW COVENANT IN MY BLOOD. Although the new covenant was prophesied by Jeremiah the MYSTERY revealed to NT "apostles and prophets" was that the Gentiles would be fellow heirs of the promise.

What "promise"? Not the new covenant that CLEARLY and UNAMBIGUOUSLY says that the new covenant is between God and Israel.

Has the ever occurred to you that the blood could cover more than just the new covenant?

We in the body of Christ are saved by grace through faith without a covenant of any kind.

 

[God's Truth]

I'm not going to follow every rabbit trail you want to throw at me.


The definition of the new covenant in Jeremiah is completely unambiguous and clear. God will make a new covenant with ISRAEL.


What "promise"? Not the new covenant that CLEARLY and UNAMBIGUOUSLY says that the new covenant is between God and Israel.

Has the ever occurred to you that the blood could cover more than just the new covenant?

We in the body of Christ are saved by grace through faith without a covenant of any kind.

...but Paul says he is the minister of the new covenant.


2 Corinthians 3:6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant--not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

 

[God's Truth]

We in the body of Christ are saved by grace through faith without a covenant of any kind.

When Jesus had his earthly ministry, he came with grace, he taught faith in him for the forgiveness of sins, he explains how the people have to be in him, and he in them.

That is the same thing Paul preached to all.

 

[Right Divider]

...but Paul says he is the minister of the new covenant.

2 Corinthians 3:6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant--not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

Not in the sense that you try to FORCE upon the text.

Also note that one does not need to be in the covenant to minister it to others that are.

AGAIN.... this is what SCRIPTURE says about the new covenant:

Jer 31:31-33 KJV Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: (32) Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: (33) But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.​

God says that His new covenant is with Israel... the SAME Israel that came out of Egypt (their fathers).

You can continue to fight with God, but I will not.

 

[Right Divider]

When Jesus had his earthly ministry, he came with grace, he taught faith in him for the forgiveness of sins, he explains how the people have to be in him, and he in them.

That is the same thing Paul preached to all.

Not completely accurate... you are a Bible masher that looks only at similarities and ignores differences.

 

[God's Truth]

Not in the sense that you try to FORCE upon the text.

Also note that one does not need to be in the covenant to minister it to others that are.

AGAIN.... this is what SCRIPTURE says about the new covenant:

Jer 31:31-33 KJV Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: (32) Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: (33) But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.​

God says that His new covenant is with Israel... the SAME Israel that came out of Egypt (their fathers).

You can continue to fight with God, but I will not.

Paul says he is the minister of the new covenant. There is NOTHING forced about the scripture.

 

[Right Divider]

Paul says he is the minister of the new covenant. There is NOTHING forced about the scripture.

2Co 3:6 KJV Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.​

That has a meaning that you cannot comprehend and that does not surprise me.

 

[God's Truth]

Not completely accurate... you are a Bible masher that looks only at similarities and ignores differences.

What I said is completely accurate.

 

[God's Truth]

2Co 3:6 KJV Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.​

That has a meaning that you cannot comprehend and that does not surprise me.

JESUS taught about that SPIRIT when he walked the earth.

John 6
⁶³ It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

 

[Right Divider]

What I said is completely accurate.

No, it was not.

 

[Right Divider]

JESUS taught about that SPIRIT when he walked the earth.

John 6
⁶³ It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

There you go again.... off on a dictionary search; no clue what it actually means.

 

[God's Truth]

There you go again.... off on a dictionary search; no clue what it actually means.

What you just said about me is not true and you gave no defense for any truth.

 

[God's Truth]

No, it was not.

See how that works. Your mere denial and insults without scripture and explanation is no defense for anything.

 

[Right Divider]

What you just said about me is not true and you gave no defense for any truth.

I gave you a scripture that you do not and apparently cannot understand.

This is exactly what happens when you already have your story made up and will not let scripture interfere.

Paul never claimed to be under the new testament. He made it clear that God had revealed a way to be saved by grace through faith apart from any covenant, law, nation, etc. etc. etc. But you don't like the truth.

 

[Right Divider]

See how that works. Your mere denial and insults without scripture and explanation is no defense for anything.

You cannot handle the truth, no matter how many times we show it to you.