Where are your tithes going?
- Thread starter Zakath
- Start date
:ha: By your twisted logic!Zakath said:
You admitted that what the priests did was moral relative to them therefore you cannot claim that their actions were immoral.
Feel free to explain to all of us what makes oath-breaking immoral.
Which action that the priests engaged in was more immoral....?Zakath said:
Sexually abusing little children.
Or...
Breaking an oath.
Caledvwlch
New member
Knight, if I may be so bold,Knight said::ha: By your twisted logic!
You admitted that what the priests did was moral relative to them therefore you cannot claim that their actions were immoral.
Feel free to explain to all of us what makes oath-breaking immoral.
You've masterfully weilded the same "no moral absolutes" argument my Dad taught me when I was but a wee lad. And as far as I'm concerned there are no moral absolutes any more than there is one absolute human language or one absolute human custom. But a lack of absolute right and wrong does not mean that I must place myself in a world devoid of consequences. I'm not saying thsat consequences are absolute, of course, simply that they are fairly universal to human culture.
Also, what the priests did couldn't have been moral to them. They were Catholic priests for God's sake. They have rules. Maybe some aboriginal orphan raised by monkeys might not know that it's not nice to molest little boys, but a Catholic priest has some moral groundwork to go by. But it's still relative.
That is not a description of relativity.fool said:
If there is an absolute standard (the end of my nose) then you reject moral relativism.
So what?Caledvwlch said:
The priests didn't start this thread a moral relativist did.
Had the priests started this thread you might have a point.
God provided a ram in a thicket as a substitution for Isaac this was an illustration that God would provide a lamb in a crown of thorns as a sacrifice to pay for our sin.fool said:
allsmiles
New member
absolutes to me are a moral cunundrum invented by christians with an equally ficticious solution, all the while you folks are expecting everyone to thank you.
some things shouldn't be done by decent, civilized people. some people are not decent nor civilized, their personal moral standards are in the gutter while good folks like ourselves have higher, personal moral standards. an aborigine may molest little children and have no idea that we think it is morally horrific, obviously his standards are lower than ours and had he been brought up in our society, he would never have had the excuse that he didn't know better. and likewise, had i been raised on a diet of bugs, fruit and little children the idea of right and wrong would probably be mind blowing.
this is a fictional dilemma. you don't hurt people (molest, steal from, murder, rape, etc.) because it is not practical to hurt people, because you do not want to be hurt in return, because you wouldn't wish it upon yourself or the people you love. it's just as much an issue of practicality as it is morality.
i have my personal moral standards squared away, i do not hurt and i expect the same in return. i'm not condemning or judging anyone else's moral code, even if their code includes rape as being :thumb:. what i am doing is promising a world of hurt upon anyone who violates the tranquility and comfort of my life. i would never seek to impose a code of morality upon a free thinking individual.
whether you get your morals from the bible or from yourself, we all share fundamental moral values: do not kill, do not rape, do not steal, etc. you don't need a divine mandate or convoluted ideas of moral relativism to share common sense ideals and actions that keep ourselves honest and decent.
some things shouldn't be done by decent, civilized people. some people are not decent nor civilized, their personal moral standards are in the gutter while good folks like ourselves have higher, personal moral standards. an aborigine may molest little children and have no idea that we think it is morally horrific, obviously his standards are lower than ours and had he been brought up in our society, he would never have had the excuse that he didn't know better. and likewise, had i been raised on a diet of bugs, fruit and little children the idea of right and wrong would probably be mind blowing.
this is a fictional dilemma. you don't hurt people (molest, steal from, murder, rape, etc.) because it is not practical to hurt people, because you do not want to be hurt in return, because you wouldn't wish it upon yourself or the people you love. it's just as much an issue of practicality as it is morality.
i have my personal moral standards squared away, i do not hurt and i expect the same in return. i'm not condemning or judging anyone else's moral code, even if their code includes rape as being :thumb:. what i am doing is promising a world of hurt upon anyone who violates the tranquility and comfort of my life. i would never seek to impose a code of morality upon a free thinking individual.
whether you get your morals from the bible or from yourself, we all share fundamental moral values: do not kill, do not rape, do not steal, etc. you don't need a divine mandate or convoluted ideas of moral relativism to share common sense ideals and actions that keep ourselves honest and decent.
Excellent! You should now see why Zakath is in error for starting such a thread.fool said:
You tell me.
What makes you "right" and the rapist "wrong"?allsmiles said:
Caledvwlch
New member
Ok fair enough.Knight said:
I'm not sure, on the other hand, if the morality of the priests' actions is really the point here, so much as whether or not the parishioners should have to pay the settlement bills. Although I suppose it would be similar to what happens if someone sues the federal government...
I think you just did.allsmiles said:
If what the priests did was not objectively immoral it should make no difference to the parishioners in regard to tithing.Caledvwlch said:
Agree?
In other words . . .
If the priests were being accused of being left handed (or anything morally neutral) there would be no issue in regard to tithing.
allsmiles
New member
Knight said:
i don't speak for rapists, i speak for myself.
i make me right.
how so? i tell people what i think, how i see the world and how i live my life but i've never tried to get anyone to play by rules, i don't tell people there's an invisible yard stick out there that they must measure themselves against.