What is the "plain reading" of this scripture?

OliviaM

BANNED
Banned
OK, then all these scriptures allude to a fictious story. If it isn't true, why is it there? I'd ask your pastor to see if he thinks its true or not.

Matthew 24:37-38 New King James Version (NKJV)

37 But as the days of Noah were, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. 38 For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark,

Luke 17:26-27New King James Version (NKJV)

26 And as it was in the days of Noah, so it will be also in the days of the Son of Man: 27 They ate, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all.

Hebrews 11:7 New King James Version (NKJV)

7 By faith Noah, being divinely warned of things not yet seen, moved with godly fear, prepared an ark for the saving of his household, by which he condemned the world and became heir of the righteousness which is according to faith.

1 Peter 3:20 New King James Version (NKJV)

20 who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited[a] in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.


2 Peter 2:5 New King James Version (NKJV)

5 and did not spare the ancient world, but saved Noah, one of eight people, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood on the world of the ungodly;

Don't read the bible like a recipe book to quote mine. It doesn't work for any literature and only makes one seem like a kids debating Harry Potter intricacies or Dungeons and Dragons. It is a figurative work meant to impart a moral.

It is impossible that we all were one race with one language until the tower of bable. There were people here speaking different languages. So that story isn't literal. It is impossible. To deny reality is illness and delusion. That isn't what God wants.

We have a brain to use it. We need to use it like rational adults.

Also, figurative literature isn't bad. Just because the bible is figurative doesn't' mean it is wrong. There are morals to the story we are supposed to pay attention to. You miss the forest for the trees.
 

Danoh

New member
I am sorry, but anything other than a figurative reading of the bible is delusion. It is fantasy. There never has been or will be a talking snake. The earth did not have a world wide flood 3,500 years ago that destroyed 99.9% of all life. It just didn't happen. There were actual cultures of people back then in China for example and they are still here.

We all didn't speak one language and we weren't' all the same race until the tower of bable. That is kids stuff and not rational in any sense.

We need sane and rational Christianity. Not magic and superstition.

In Genesis 3 "the serpent" is also refereed to as "beast of the field."

"Serpent" is in the sense of a shining being. Guess what "beast" is a reference to?

You are confusing your going against a thing because it does not makes sense to you, with its being off because you do not agree with it, because it does not make sense to you.

Ironic given the OP - you are taking what is clearly your own "circular" reasoning, as sound reasoning, because you think it is.

LOL, now I'm stuck in my own, about yours :chuckle:
 

Bright Raven

Well-known member
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
Don't read the bible like a recipe book to quote mine. It doesn't work for any literature and only makes one seem like a kids debating Harry Potter intricacies or Dungeons and Dragons. It is a figurative work meant to impart a moral.

It is impossible that we all were one race with one language until the tower of babel. There were people here speaking different languages. So that story isn't literal. It is impossible. To deny reality is illness and delusion. That isn't what God wants.

We have a brain to use it. We need to use it like rational adults.

Raising the dead is not rational. Jesus healing all the sick that were brought to him is not rational. The resurrection is not . None of these are rational. Do you believe them?
 

OliviaM

BANNED
Banned
In Genesis 3 "the serpent" is also refereed to as "beast of the field."

"Serpent" is in the sense of a shining being. Guess what "beast" is a reference to?

You are confusing your going against a thing because it does not makes sense to you, with its being off because you do not agree with it, because it does not make sense to you.

Ironic given the OP - you are taking what is clearly your own "circular" reasoning, as sound reasoning, because you think it is.

LOL, now I'm stuck in my own, about yours :chuckle:

Impossible things are impossible. 2,500 years ago People were already in China speaking a language. Therefor it is impossible for them to be invented as a race and language because of a tower.

3,500 years ago 99.9% of all life didn't die. It simply didn't happen.

To believe in things that a demonstratively false and outlandish like talking snakes and what not is childish and not what God wants.

We have brains to use. Not discard for magic fairy tale kids stories.
 

genuineoriginal

New member
Understanding that snakes and donkies can't talk isn't simplton. It is rational.

Knowing that there was no world wide flood with a giant boat is rational.

Knowing that Jesus taught us how to behave and that is what is important is rational. We didn't get any special forgiveness because of his animal body blood.

We need rationality to understand the bible. Not blind bible literalism worship. Sensible interpretation is best.

When I hear to literalists debating the bible it is like kids arguing over the specifics of Harry Potter. Did dumbledor do this specifically or this. If he cast this then bla bla bla would happen.

You miss the whole point and beauty of the book with such literalism.

If you do not believe that God created the world in six days and then rested on the seventh day, then you have missed the whole point of the book.
 

Jose Fly

New member
stop contradicting yourself in your atheistic view

Stop being so stereotypically tribal in your thinking.

If Matthew wasn't "thinking through the physics of it all" then he certainly wasn't thinking that the world is flat disc therefore we can see all the kingdoms from it. you can't have it both ways in your mindset.

No. If the typical Hebrew at the time thought of the world as flat and relatively small, then we would expect that to be reflected in their writings, even in passages that aren't specifically about the nature of the earth.

So, if the author of Matthew believed the world to be flat and relatively small, when he writes the story of Satan tempting Jesus by showing, and offering him all the kingdoms of the world, he would depict that temptation as occurring from the top of not just any mountain, but an "exceedingly high" mountain.

IOW, the belief in a flat, relatively small world is reflected in how the author described the setting. We see this all the time in literature.

Also, keep in mind the context of how this point was raised. In another thread, we were told that the Bible is to be read as is, in its "plain reading". When it says 6 days, it means 6 days. Thus according to the same interpretive framework, when Matthew 4:8 says Satan took Jesus to a very high mountain from which they could see all the kingdoms of the world, that means there is a mountain from which all the kingdoms of the world can be seen.
 

Danoh

New member
Impossible things are impossible. 2,500 years ago People were already in China speaking a language. Therefor it is impossible for them to be invented as a race and language because of a tower.

3,500 years ago 99.9% of all life didn't die. It simply didn't happen.

To believe in things that a demonstratively false and outlandish like talking snakes and what not is childish and not what God wants.

We have brains to use. Not discard for magic fairy tale kids stories.

There is only one race, meant to result in and comprise various nations.

Acts 17:

26. And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;

While, in Genesis 11: 1 thru 9, which is also Romans 1: 18 thru 32, the issue in both references is that of one, collective mind, against God.

Acts 17:

29. Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
30. And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to
repent:

31. Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

Romans 1:

21. Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23. And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24. Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25. Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

Again, the issue in both references is that of one, collective mind, against God.

Acts 1:

4. And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

Does that mean its time for, "well, what makes sense to me is such and so, therefore..." or that its time for "...what saith the Scripture?" Gal. 4:30.

Acts 2 continues with...

6. Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.
7. And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
8. And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?

What is this one language?

1 Corinthians 1:

10. Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

In this, are there people in China and Taiwan who apparently "speak the same thing" as to Christ that some of us do, and yet, not in English, or what have you, but in Mandarin?
 

Jose Fly

New member
For context, here's the image that was in Martin Luther's Bible...

picture.php


I wonder where he got the idea that that's how the earth is? :think:
 

OliviaM

BANNED
Banned
Raising the dead is not rational. Jesus healing all the sick that were brought to him is not rational. The resurrection is not . None of these are rational. Do you believe them?

I get you petulantly want to believe in magic like a child, however you are an adult and should find a way to communicate like one. If you have evidence for magic show it.

Otherwise like a rational person and sane adult I will continue to know magic isn't real.
 

OliviaM

BANNED
Banned
There is only one race, meant to result in and comprise various nations.

Acts 17:

26. And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;

While, in Genesis 11: 1 thru 9, which is also Romans 1: 18 thru 32, the issue in both references is that of one, collective mind, against God.

Acts 17:

29. Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
30. And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to
repent:

31. Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

Romans 1:

21. Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23. And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24. Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25. Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

Again, the issue in both references is that of one, collective mind, against God.

Acts 1:

4. And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

Does that mean its time for, "well, what makes sense to me is such and so, therefore..." or that its time for "...what saith the Scripture?" Gal. 4:30.

Acts 2 continues with...

6. Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.
7. And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
8. And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?

What is this one language?

1 Corinthians 1:

10. Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

In this, are there people in China and Taiwan who apparently "speak the same thing" as to Christ that some of us do, and yet, not in English, or what have you, but in Mandarin?

Could you paraphrase the point you were trying to make because that was undecipherable.
 

bybee

New member
I get you petulantly want to believe in magic like a child, however you are an adult and should find a way to communicate like one. If you have evidence for magic show it.

Otherwise like a rational person and sane adult I will continue to know magic isn't real.

You will continue to give your opinion. It is no more valid nor invalid than anyone else's opinion.
 

OliviaM

BANNED
Banned
You will continue to give your opinion. It is no more valid nor invalid than anyone else's opinion.

Oh magic being not real isn't an opinion. It is sane reality. If you have evidence of magic demonstrate it. Otherwise like any other outlandish claims I just scoff. Time to grow up and deal with reality Christianity.
 

OliviaM

BANNED
Banned
Silly that God created everything like He tells us?
Or is it silly to believe that nothing caused everything and that life came from non life?

Who says nothing caused everything? I sure didn't. Magic still isn't real.
 

Grosnick Marowbe

New member
Hall of Fame
So many problems come when we try to force a literal historical fact type reading of the bible. It can't be read that way as it makes it silly and not true. The bible is analogy, parable, metaphor and symbolism.

Stuff like Genesis didn't literally happen. They impart a moral. Hence the saying the moral of the story. That is the only sane way to read the bible.

Your church has you on an, "Un-Spiritual" diet, evidently. The Bible is
a "Spiritual Book." In order to understand it, it takes, Spiritual
Discernment and the leading of the Holy Spirit. During the "miracle
signs and wonders" period, God was dealing with mankind one way.

Today, He sent/uses The Holy Spirit, and His holy inspired Word
(The Bible) to speak to the hearts and minds of man. Faith pleases
God. If God says He created a "Special fish" to swallow up Jonah,
then, that's to be taken "literally." If He says He mixed the languages
at the Tower of Babel, that's to be taken literally. However, in order
to accept the truths of Scripture, one must be indwelt by the Holy Spirit,
and have the Holy Spirit's guidance. Otherwise, one will look
at the Scriptures and see, contradictions, confusion, metaphors,
falsity, etc.

Are you a member of the "Body of Christ?" Are you a "Child of God?"
Can you testify how you became such?
 

OliviaM

BANNED
Banned
Your church has you on an, "Un-Spiritual" diet, evidently. The Bible is
a "Spiritual Book." In order to understand it, it takes, Spiritual
Discernment and the leading of the Holy Spirit. During the "miracle
signs and wonders" period, God was dealing with mankind one way.

Today, He sent/uses The Holy Spirit, and His holy inspired Word
(The Bible) to speak to the hearts and minds of man. Faith pleases
God. If God says He created a "Special fish" to swallow up Jonah,
then, that's to be taken "literally." If He says He mixed the languages
at the Tower of Babel, that's to be taken literally. However, in order
to accept the truths of Scripture, one must be indwelt by the Holy Spirit,
and have the Holy Spirit's guidance. Otherwise, one will look
at the Scriptures and see, contradictions, confusion, metaphors,
falsity, etc.

Are you a member of the "Body of Christ?" Are you a "Child of God?"
Can you testify how you became such?

If the holy spirit gives the interpretation and not the individual then where are there so many interpretations?

Also, if it is just a literal fact book there is no interpretation needed. It is to be read like a car manual. Which it obviously is not.

Literalism is a tool to control. Churches that use this tool are cults.
 
Top