What Does it Mean to be "Under the Law?"

[Robert Pate]

To be under the law is to be judged by the law and condemned.

Paul said to the Galatians,"Tell me that you desire to be under the law, DO YOU NOT HEAR THE LAW?" Galatians 4:21.

The law was given to the Jews to preserve the nation of Israel until the coming of Jesus Christ. The law, the Old Covenant, the temple, the sacrifices, all of the things that were used in the temple all pointed to Jesus Christ.

"Jesus is the end and the fulfillment of the law, the Old Covenant and the Jewish religion.

To live by laws, rules and religion is a denial that Jesus is the end and the fulfillment of the Old Covenant, the law and the Jewish religion. This is why Paul said that the "Just Shall Live by Faith" Romans 1:17. and not by laws, rules and religion that have been abolished.

Jesus took us out from under the law because it was contrary to us, "Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us and took it out of the way nailing it to his cross" Colossians 2:14. It was contrary to us because no one could keep it or do it.

The law is the very nature and character of God. To do or fulfill the law one would have to be Jesus Christ. Not like Jesus Christ, Jesus Christ. This is why Paul said, "But now the righteous of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets" Romans 3:21. Jesus is God's law incarnate in human flesh.

The law says do, The Gospel says done. In our name and on our behalf Jesus has victoriously fulfilled God's Holy Law. After he fulfilled it he abolished it. Christians are no longer required to live according to laws, rules or religion. Those that are still under the law are the unsaved, "Knowing this that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the..." 1 Timothy 1:9.

 

[genuineoriginal]

1 Timothy 1:8 8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;​

 

[daqq]

Jesus took us out from under the law because it was contrary to us

When exactly were you ever under the Law to begin with? :crackup:

The law is the very nature and character of God.

So then you also claim, by default, not to be "under" God any more because by default you have said that you have been taken out from under the very nature and character of God, (which you confess is the Law at the same time). However you never were "under" the Law to begin with so I suppose that by default you were also never under God and therefore how can you be now if you are not under His very nature and character? See what happens when you juxtapose the Son against the Father so as to chose one "person" over the other? You have essentially revealed that you perceive two Gods: an "Old Testament God of vengeance" and a "New Testament God" who shields you from the "Old Testament" God. You are essentially preaching that Jesus saved you from the Father! YIKES!

:luigi:

 

[jamie]

To be under the law is to be judged by the law and condemned.

Context. The law Paul was referring to was the Mosaic law which hasn't been around for almost two thousand years. That law was based on an altar and a priesthood both of which have been replaced.

Why don't you deal with God in the context of the 21st century?

Paul explained, "And this I say that the law which was four hundred and thirty years later cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ..." (Galatians 3:17 NKJV)

Why don't you ever talk about the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ?

You go on and on about an obsolete law that has never applied to anyone on TOL. Why?

 

[Robert Pate]

1 Timothy 1:8 8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;​

The preaching of the law convicts of sin and brings people to Christ, Galatians 3:24. That is the second use of the law.

"But after faith is come, we are no longer under the schoolmaster" (Law) Galatians 3:25.

 

[Robert Pate]

Context. The law Paul was referring to was the Mosaic law which hasn't been around for almost two thousand years. That law was based on an altar and a priesthood both of which have been replaced.

Why don't you deal with God in the context of the 21st century?

Paul explained, "And this I say that the law which was four hundred and thirty years later cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ..." (Galatians 3:17 NKJV)

Why don't you ever talk about the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ?

You go on and on about an obsolete law that has never applied to anyone on TOL. Why?

The New Covenant is the Gospel and Jesus Christ. It is not a new set of laws.

 

[Robert Pate]

When exactly were you ever under the Law to begin with? :crackup:



So then you also claim, by default, not to be "under" God any more because by default you have said that you have been taken out from under the very nature and character of God, (which you confess is the Law at the same time). However you never were "under" the Law to begin with so I suppose that by default you were also never under God and therefore how can you be now if you are not under His very nature and character? See what happens when you juxtapose the Son against the Father so as to chose one "person" over the other? You have essentially revealed that you perceive two Gods: an "Old Testament God of vengeance" and a "New Testament God" who shields you from the "Old Testament" God. You are essentially preaching that Jesus saved you from the Father! YIKES!

:luigi:

We are all born under the law, Romans 3:19. The rest of your post doesn't make sense.

 

[chair]

Pate- you need some historical context to improve your understanding of Christianity.

 

[Robert Pate]

Pate- you need some historical context to improve your understanding of Christianity.

I understand Christianity completely.

You are the one that does not understand Christianity.

You do not understand that Judaism has been abolished and has been replaced with Christianity.

 

[Danoh]

We are all born under the law, Romans 3:19. The rest of your post doesn't make sense.

You've misread that passage, Rob.

Paul has just proven the Gentile - who had not the law - under sin. Followed by proving the Jew - who had the law - under sin.

He is now basically relating, the Gentile, who had not the law, has nevertheless been found guilty.

But so has the Jew, even though he had been able to boast he that was a Jew; that he had the Law; that he knew the way of God; that this, that, the other.

What Paul has been doing up to that point is cleaning up house in one indictement!

Law, or no Law, all are all together become unprofitable!

This towards serving up the righteousness of God in His Son ALONE!

The exclamation point is my spirit rejoicing in that!

Marvellous contrast - MATCHLESS GRACE!

Anyway, hope that helps

 

[Bradley D]

The Law's purpose is make us aware of sin.

"What shall we say, then? Is the law sinful? Certainly not! Nevertheless, I would not have known what sin was had it not been for the law. For I would not have known what coveting really was if the law had not said, 'You shall not covet" (Romans 7:7).

Jesus said to obey the commandments.

"Why do you ask me about what is good?" Jesus replied. "There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, keep the commandments" (Matthew 19:17).

 

[Danoh]

The Law's purpose is make us aware of sin.

"What shall we say, then? Is the law sinful? Certainly not! Nevertheless, I would not have known what sin was had it not been for the law. For I would not have known what coveting really was if the law had not said, 'You shall not covet" (Romans 7:7).

Jesus said to obey the commandments.

"Why do you ask me about what is good?" Jesus replied. "There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, keep the commandments" (Matthew 19:17).

Apparantly, you do not see the contradiction you have just made of those passages.

Step back a bit further; take in a bit more of Romans 6:14.

 

[turbosixx]

The New Covenant is the Gospel and Jesus Christ. It is not a new set of laws.

Paul is talking about the law of Moses which we are not under but Paul said he is under law.

If Paul is not under law, then why would he have to appear "as without law"?
1 Cor. 9:21 to those who are without law, as without law,

He goes on to say he isn't without law but under the law of Christ.
21.... though not being without the law of God but under the law of Christ, so that I might win those who are without law.


Are we given no commandments or instructions on how to live as a Christian?
1 Thes. 4:1 Finally then, brethren, we urge and exhort in the Lord Jesus that you should abound more and more, just as you received from us how you ought to walk and to please God; 2 for you know what commandments we gave you through the Lord Jesus.

 

[chair]

I understand Christianity completely.

You are the one that does not understand Christianity.

You do not understand that Judaism has been abolished and has been replaced with Christianity.

You need to understand when and how your own religion developed. How it started as a Jewish cult, whose members (including Jesus) obeyed the Law, then later turned into a religion for the Gentiles.

You are busy fighting the battles that were relevant in the time of Paul.

 

[jamie]

The New Covenant is the Gospel and Jesus Christ. It is not a new set of laws.

Right, what we have is a new testament based on God's covenant with Israel. Do you know that covenant?

 

[genuineoriginal]

The Law's purpose is make us aware of sin.

Let's think about this for a moment.

God chose Abraham's descendants out of all the people on the earth, even though they were small in number.
When God led the children of Israel out of the land of Egypt, He gave them the Ten Commandments and the rest of the Law.
Once the children of Israel were in the land, they only had 490 years before they were kicked out of the land for repeatedly breaking the Law.

If the purpose of the Law is to make us aware of sin, then what happened to the children of Israel because of breaking the Law makes no sense.

If, on the other hand, the purpose of the Law is to provide guidelines to teach the children of Israel how to Love God and Love Thy Neighbor, then what happened to the children of Israel for breaking the Law makes more sense.

 

[chair]

...
Once the children of Israel were in the land, they only had 490 years before they were kicked out of the land for repeatedly breaking the Law.
...

Funny how history stopped in 586 BCE.

 

[Robert Pate]

Funny how history stopped in 586 BCE.

History started with the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Jesus is God's new Israel and God's new Creation.

"If any man be in Christ he is a new creation" 2 Corinthians 5:17.

The Old Covenant, the law and the Jewish religion were abolished when Jesus died on the cross, Hebrews 8:8.

Your religion is obsolete.

 

[chair]

...

Your religion is obsolete.

It was never meant for you. So leave it alone. Why do you keep harping about it?

 

[genuineoriginal]

Funny how history stopped in 586 BCE.

History hasn't stopped.
I used the time frame of the giving of the Law and the original possession of the land of Israel to show that the concept that, "The Law's purpose is make us aware of sin," is a flawed concept.