toldailytopic: Is human cloning immoral?

Nathon Detroit

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
The TheologyOnline.com TOPIC OF THE DAY for February 6th, 2012 09:40 AM


toldailytopic: Is human cloning immoral?



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PureX

Well-known member
All that results from cloning is a twin, born later, and by technological means. A clone would be no more "immoral" than any other twin, or any other child conceived with the help of bio-technological processes.

Clones are not human duplicates.
 

1PeaceMaker

New member
Assuming it is perfectly safe, no. God is the maker of us all, whether or not primitive technology is employed.

Safety would have to include the overcoming of isolation related problems if the baby grows in an artificial environment. Babies grow in a sealed "pouch" within another person that they can feel, hear, be influenced emotionally by, and so on. In other words, they are constantly carried for those nine months. Given that babies instantly crave their mother's company and want to be carried for another nine months, I can't imagine an infant being happy with fetal isolation.

As an attachment parenting parent, I think it would be cruel to isolate a baby in a test tube or artificial womb for 9 months. That's not how I would want anyone to carry me as a fetus. We should do unto others as we would have them do to us.
.....

But is cloning safe? No. Not by a long shot. I don't like letting my babies out of my sight. Why would I want to trust strangers with my unprotected embryos? I don't have any motivation to desire a cloned child more than a child the way God naturally gives them.
 

MrRadish

New member
I think the biggest problem with human cloning is how they'd research and develop it in a way that didn't create lots of 'failed experiments' with horrific birth defects and no chance of living a normal life. There are also some ethical issues to do with how somebody might use it to create a clone and attempt to live vicariously through what they see as a younger version of themselves, when actually a clone would be an independent human being who just happened to share their DNA. That said, lots of parents do that already using their children, so I don't think that genetic similarity is really the problem here so much as some people's tendency toward objectification.

I don't think human cloning would be immoral per se.
 
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Buzzword

New member
Just for specificity's sake, are we only referring to cloning complete, separate human beings?

Or are we including the practice of organ growth in this?

I'm totally fine with the latter, especially for individuals in need who must have an exact match or die.

For the former, don't we already have test-tube babies?
What's the difference?
 

1PeaceMaker

New member
All that results from cloning is a twin, born later, and by technological means. A clone would be no more "immoral" than any other twin, or any other child conceived with the help of bio-technological processes.

Clones are not human duplicates.

I don't think that's the worry, is it? I would imagine most people think it's immoral because it's genetically unsafe for children born this way.
 

LadyGreenEyes

New member
There are a lot of reasons this isn't a good idea.

One, the methods are far from certain, and failures in the "process" means loss of life. Two, there isn't anything like enough research to know what long-term issues a clone could face. Dolly the sheep lived only half as long as the average sheep. Now, this could have been because she was inside, and other sheep in the flock had similar issues, but the fact is, they do not KNOW. She died at six, the age the sheep from whom she was cloned was when they took the material to clone Dolly. IN this respect, cloning people would be immoral because we cannot know, without a lot more research, what problems those cloned people would face.

Two, there is the matter of the legal status of a clone. Would they be considered the same as ordinary people? Or, would they be used as "organ farms", so that some rich person could live longer by taking from a clone when they had some organ failing? We would like to think this couldn't happen, but an honest look at history shows that it could.

Three, we have no way to know what long-term effects this would have on humanity as a whole. If the clones were treated as ordinary people, and they produced children, would this cause issues? Not knowing what issues the clones themselves would have, we can't say.

Four, and this is where things could get, well, weird. What about the many known and accepted links between identical twins? There are reports of all sorts of links between them, that are not explained, but very real. Know about a set of twins myself who, as high school girls, decided to shop alone for prom dresses. They bought identical dresses, shoes, and accessories. College, they decided to do alone as well. No discussion with one another at all, yet they ended up registering for the same college, same classes, everything. If you haven't heard about this stuff, do some online searches; the results could prove fascinating. The point is, if these links are caused by identical genetics, would the same thing happen with a clone? We don't know.

These are only a few reasons that cloning could be considered immoral. With thought, I am sure we could come up wit more.

Well, didn't address the issue of cloning just an organ. That would depend on how they develop the process to do it. If no human life is lost in the process, that would be alright. Assuming, of course, you really could clone JUST an organ, without any supporting system. Of course, even this should wait until we knew how safe this was, and if cloned tissue would cause unforeseen medical issues.
 

Alate_One

Well-known member
For the former, don't we already have test-tube babies?
What's the difference?

Difference being that a clone is an exact copy of a person. A "test tube baby" is just produced by uniting sperm and egg in a lab rather than the "natural way" of baby making.

I don't think there's anything wrong with cloning someone in the abstract, the problem comes in the actual practice which so far has proven itself to be rather messy with far more failed attempts than successful ones.

That said the technology for cell reprogramming is improving. I'm sure human cloning will be accomplished sooner or later.
 

Thunder's Muse

Well-known member
Difference being that a clone is an exact copy of a person. A "test tube baby" is just produced by uniting sperm and egg in a lab rather than the "natural way" of baby making.

I don't think there's anything wrong with cloning someone in the abstract, the problem comes in the actual practice which so far has proven itself to be rather messy with far more failed attempts than successful ones.

That said the technology for cell reprogramming is improving. I'm sure human cloning will be accomplished sooner or later.




That's the part that creeps me out. Spiritually, how would that work?
 

Lon

Well-known member
Interesting discussion, I'm clueless. I know of no verse for or against. Has anybody done a biblical study on this question?
 
Is cloning immoral? I don't know, why would you want to clone people? To come with a perfect army of 7 footers? to clone geniuses? that stuff could lead to trouble.

I kind of like the fact we are all different because then we can actually celebrate differences. 1 of me is truly enough.
 
Interesting discussion, I'm clueless. I know of no verse for or against. Has anybody done a biblical study on this question?

how many of you would you like Lon? 10? lol just kidding. If people are naturally born with idiosyncrasies physically and mentally, then one view might say that is how God intended it - so that we might master the contradiction of us all being different from eachother.

Although it is also true that a perfect twin is a totally different person from their sibling mentally, nature has good reasons to not make too many physical clones I think so that we all don't start marrying relatives, catch the same disease, and can tell eachother apart.
 

LadyGreenEyes

New member
Jeremiah 1:5 states, "Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations."

Clearly, we are told that God forms us, that He chooses how we are made. The traits we inherit aren't random, but chosen by God Himself. In the case of twins, He chooses for that to happen. With a clone, we would be choosing instead, and for that reason alone, it's wrong. Cloning is, in effect, trying to play at being God, which is what Satan has been trying to do from the beginning.
 
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