They shall look upon Him who they have pierced and mourn for Him as for a firstborn son...ALL Israel, EVERY Jewish family. The rapture and the conversion of Israel will be simultaneous....
ECT Those of the Body of Christ Will Reign on the Earth With Christ
- Thread starter Jerry Shugart
- Start date
They shall look upon Him who they have pierced and mourn for Him as for a firstborn son...ALL Israel, EVERY Jewish family. The rapture and the conversion of Israel will be simultaneous....
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
if we are reigning in the kingdom on earth now then why is the Father's will not being done on the earth as it is being done in heaven. After all, the Lord Jesus told His disciples to pray in the following way:
"And he said unto them, When ye pray, say, Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, as in heaven, so in earth" (Lk.11:2).
If the kingdom is now here then the only people who would populate the earth are those who have been born again (Jn.3:3-5).
Certainly you would not argue that all people in the world today have been born again, would you?
I believe the same as you that the Mill is that kingdom of heaven...but Christ reigns in His church and God governs the world on behalf of the church or with the church in view.
genuineoriginal
New member
The SDA falsely claim that Christians spend the millenium in heaven whilst Satan treads an ash covered earth.
That is not what happens.
According to scripture, the nations that survive the return of Christ will have to come to Jerusalem every year for the feast of Tabernacles, or their land will receive no rain.
Also according to scripture, the Christians that reign on earth with Christ during the millenium will be given cities to rule over, some one city, some five cities, and some ten cities.
whitestone
Well-known member
"your saying" that they will see/be witnesses of the rapture and that it is what will convert them and make them say "blessed is he,ect",,,,Jesus said until they say it they wont see him.So we cannot be raptured until he comes,so they have to say it "first"
WonderfulLordJesus
New member
The SDA claims are false. There will be more of a paradise condition on earth during the millennium, though not perfection. There will still be death, albeit older age. There will be need for rod of iron rule. There is a drought curse for nations that refuse the annual feast, which shows the potential for sinfulness, still. The point, as to rule, one doesn't have to have permanent residence on earth to rule the earth. God can quite well execute His will on earth, without leaving heaven, has power over all things. Has it ever occurred to you glorified beings could travel between earth and heaven? Seems the Lord's body does just that.
genuineoriginal
New member
We could spend all day speaking about what God can do while avoiding speaking about what God said He would do.
God said that He would appoint the son of David, Jesus, as a king who would rule the nations (gentiles) from the throne of David in Jerusalem.
This happens when Jesus returns.
whitestone
Well-known member
And their days shall be as the tree,and an babe shall die an hundred years old for iniquity,,,
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
That is not what I said. There will be people close to the ones who will be caught up and many of them will know exactly what happened to them. In many instances Christians will tell some of their unsaved friends that they are expected to be caught up to meet the Lord in the air.
Then they will be open to believing the gospel and it will be people like these who will began preaching to the gospel to the unsaved.
The Lord's words at Matthew 23:39 were not in regard to the rapture, but instead to the time when the Lord Jesus will return to the earth to set up His earthly kingdom, an event which will follow the rapture.
WonderfulLordJesus
New member
One verse, then, where Jesus Christ is unequivocally, physically sitting on a throne in Jerusalem, bound to earth for 1,000 years. You may do well to study on "the prince" in OT millennium prophecy, things of David, himself.
whitestone
Well-known member
That is not the order given in the scriptures (1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 KJV) the order given is
(1,first)Jesus returns
(2, second) first resurrection of the dead
(3) rapture
But this cannot happen until Matthew 23:39 KJV is fulfilled. So since it begins with Jesus returning,and we know he wont until they say it,the things prophesied to happen will follow this order given by Paul.
And have made us kings and priests to our God and we shall reign on the earth. (Revelation 5:10 NKJV)
Hi , and where is there a verse that explains the above paragraph ?
Gen 1:1 says it clearly for me as he made :
#1 , He created the Heaven !
#2 , Then created the Earth !
How will you handle Eph 1:10 ?
Or handle Eph 1:4 as the Body of Christ is BEFORE God's earthly people !!
dan p
As long as you've been "Mid-Acts" you still don't know why the Mystery to begin with?
Hmmm, I wonder what O'Hair and Anderson might say?
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
No, nowhere in those verses does it say that Christ returns. Instead, it says that He descends from heaven and then at that time those believers who have passed away will be resurrected first. Then those who remain alive will meet Him in the air and put on bodies like his glorious body. The bodies which believers will put on will be heavenly bodies (1 Cor.15:49-50) because after meeting the Lord our destination will be heaven.
It is only later when the Lord Jesus will return to the earth to set up his earthly kingdom.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
"why the Mystery to begin with?"
As usual you make no sense.
The reason people like me believe that the BOC will return to the earth with the Lord Jesus when He sets up His kingdom is because what is said here:
"For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord" (1 Thess.4:16-17).
This passage is speaking of being in the "presence" of the Lord Jesus when those in the BOC meets Him in the air and therefore when it speaks of those in the BOC being with Him for ever it is His "presence" which is in view.
But according to your view those in the BOC will no longer be in His presence when He returns to the earth to set up His earthly kingdom.
As usual, you give no evidence from the Scriptures to support your assertion. All you do is to deny the truth of what is said at 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17.
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whitestone
Well-known member
So Jesus returns and ends the times of the gentiles before they say Matthew 23:39? I see that this is your opinion but your not giving scriptural proofs. Now though instead of guessing it would probably make more since to examine the many scriptures where it is written that they were "blinded in part",,,"minds were hardened" ect. (to many to list) so you can choose the one you like but they(the Jews) will be blinded until then and then when they are not they will confess him i.e. "blessed is he that commeth in the name ect." http://biblehub.com/2_corinthians/3-14.htm
Until you deal with the perspective you are not seeing this issue - and others you assert - until you deal with the perspective these things need to be viewed through - the Mystery - you will just continue to assert what you do about this, and whether you twist one passage or all of them, you will continue to prove nothing.
To use your own tactic on you - so you still don't know why the Mystery to begin with?
Hmmm, I wonder what O'Hair and Anderson might say?
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Since you think that you are an expert on the mystery then tell me which part of the mystery says that those in the BOC will not be in the presence of the Lord Jesus beginning at the rapture and continuing forever:
"For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord" (1 Thess.4:16-17).
This passage is speaking of being in the "presence" of the Lord Jesus when those in the BOC meets Him in the air and therefore when it speaks of those in the BOC being with Him for ever it is His "presence" which is in view.
But according to your view those in the BOC will no longer be in His presence when He returns to the earth to set up His earthly kingdom.
As usual, you give no evidence from the Scriptures to support your assertion. All you do is to deny the truth of what is said at 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17.