The Myth of saying that Jesus Christ died for all men without exception !
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beloved57
Well-known member
He is the propitiation for our sins:
1 Jn 2:1-2
My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
This passage of scripture is most commonly used and abused by men, religionist, in their defense of unlimited atonement, which is a lie, or to say Christ died for all men without exception. Again this is a false claim by them, for the passage never states that Christ died for all men without exception. No its stating of believers to whom John was writing, that Christ was not limited to just being the propitiation for their sins, but for believers of the whole world, to include believers of different ethnicities and during different times, as to say the believers of all time !
Another thing that disqualifies this passage to be teaching that Christ died for all without exception, is that its talking about God being propitiated, His wrath that is. The greek word for propitiation is hilasmos and means:
a propitiation (of an angry god), atoning sacrifice.
properly, propitiation; an offering to appease (satisfy) an angry, offended party. 2434(hilasmós) is only used twice (1 Jn 2:2, 4:10) – both times of Christ's atoning blood that appeases God's wrath, . By the sacrificeof Himself, Jesus Christ provided the ultimate 2434/hilasmós ("propitiation").
For them Christ propitiated God for, His Blood appeased Gods wrath.
However this doesnt apply to all men without exception, because Paul informs us that Gods wrath is actively and presently against some sinners Rom 1:18
For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; The word revealed is in the present tense, its presently being revealed against men !
So obviously for them Gods Wrath has not been appeased, propitiated, hence they cant be part of that whole world of 1 Jn 2:2 ! Christ could not have died for them !
1 Jn 2:1-2
My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
This passage of scripture is most commonly used and abused by men, religionist, in their defense of unlimited atonement, which is a lie, or to say Christ died for all men without exception. Again this is a false claim by them, for the passage never states that Christ died for all men without exception. No its stating of believers to whom John was writing, that Christ was not limited to just being the propitiation for their sins, but for believers of the whole world, to include believers of different ethnicities and during different times, as to say the believers of all time !
Another thing that disqualifies this passage to be teaching that Christ died for all without exception, is that its talking about God being propitiated, His wrath that is. The greek word for propitiation is hilasmos and means:
a propitiation (of an angry god), atoning sacrifice.
properly, propitiation; an offering to appease (satisfy) an angry, offended party. 2434(hilasmós) is only used twice (1 Jn 2:2, 4:10) – both times of Christ's atoning blood that appeases God's wrath, . By the sacrificeof Himself, Jesus Christ provided the ultimate 2434/hilasmós ("propitiation").
For them Christ propitiated God for, His Blood appeased Gods wrath.
However this doesnt apply to all men without exception, because Paul informs us that Gods wrath is actively and presently against some sinners Rom 1:18
For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; The word revealed is in the present tense, its presently being revealed against men !
So obviously for them Gods Wrath has not been appeased, propitiated, hence they cant be part of that whole world of 1 Jn 2:2 ! Christ could not have died for them !
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musterion
Well-known member
Thanks for demonstrating that God is incompetent and untrustworthy and can't say what He actually meant without a Calvinist speaking for Him. The Bible is completely worthless and dangerous without people like you to read it to us.
Nanja
Well-known member
Amen! And God is Just in punishing those who are permanently remaining under His Wrath, because for them, Christ was not their propitiation: He did not die for them. So they, themselves, must stand accountable to God for their sins.
Eph. 5:5-6
5 For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
Rev. 21:8
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
They must pay the wages for their own sins.
"For the wages of sin is death!"
Ben Masada
New member
It was a myth indeed for two reasons: First, the Prophets of the Most High state that no one can die for the sins of another. (Ezekiel 18:3,20) And second is that, if they don't care for whatever is said to the opposite, they can never say again that Jesus was the Suffering Servant of Isaiah 53 because "The Suffering Servant makes the MANY righteous as it is their punishment that he bears." (Isaiah 53:11) (The many, not all men without exception.)
beloved57
Well-known member
Amen!
beloved57
Well-known member
You believe that the golden calf died for your sins don't you ?
beloved57
Well-known member
Who shall lay anything to the charge of God's Elect?
This is another text of scripture that specifies who Christ died for, Gods Elect.
Rom 8:33-34
Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
You see, nothing can be charged to Gods Elect because their sins against the Law of God hath already been laid to the Charge of Christ so that He would die for them instead of God's Elect!See we can't preach Christ died truthfully if we never specify exactly whom He died for, Gods Elect.
This is another text of scripture that specifies who Christ died for, Gods Elect.
Rom 8:33-34
Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
You see, nothing can be charged to Gods Elect because their sins against the Law of God hath already been laid to the Charge of Christ so that He would die for them instead of God's Elect!See we can't preach Christ died truthfully if we never specify exactly whom He died for, Gods Elect.
Hebrews 2:9
Nanja
Well-known member
Amen! Christ died exclusively for all God's Elect.
They are the only portion of mankind that were Chosen in Christ to be His Adopted Children Eph. 1:4-5, and the only ones which were given Grace in Christ Eph. 1:7 before the world began:
2 Tim. 1:8-9
8 Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God; 9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began
But the non-elect children of the devil, the tares Mat. 13:38-39, have no part in God's Grace !
Christ died for His Sheep John 10:11,15: SALVATION!
Christ did not die for the goats; they were condemned already John 3:18,36: John 10:26: NO SALVATION!
beloved57
Well-known member
One of the most neglected truths of the Gospel is stating exactly for whom Christ died, Gods Elect!
Nanja
Well-known member
And the Church says, Amen!
The Church has nothing to say about who is God's elect. The elect are those who freely choose Jesus as Saviour.
Nanja
Well-known member
O foolish man!
The Church is God's Elect which Christ died for Eph. 5:25.
It's not their choosing of Christ that makes Him their Saviour.
But that God has Chosen them in Christ to have Eternal Life
before the foundation of the world Eph. 1:4-11!
beloved57
Well-known member
Wow, see that big lie he told ?Without no shame!
Nanja
Well-known member
Yeah, his freewill is the god that gets him saved!
Acts 16 provides one example of the many adventures and challenges faced by the early Christian church. It recounts the preaching of Paul and Silas, their persecution, and their imprisonment. Rather than feeling discouraged, while in jail the two Christians prayed and sang hymns. An earthquake shook the prison, the doors opened, and the chains of all the prisoners were loosed. The jailer, greatly concerned, approached the two, falling before them and pleading, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" Paul and Silas replied, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved …" (Acts 16:30-31, NIV).
The passage is important in relation to the topic of salvation or, technically, soteriology. In everyday language, salvation has to do with how we are saved or delivered from our fallen condition. We are, as noted in another article in this series,[1] rebels in God's image, fallen and in need of restoration. In Christian terms salvation refers to this restoration - setting right what is wrong.
What Salvation is Not
Before clarifying salvation in biblical terms, it will be helpful to look at ways of "salvation" that are not in line with Christian theology. Probably the most common approach is works-based. As the name suggests, this approach to salvation relies on human works and what we can do in order to save ourselves. But when it comes to salvation Christianity is Savior-centered, not self-centered: "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so that no one can boast" (Ephesians 2:8-9 NIV). Good works are the natural outcome of following salvation through Christ.
Neither is salvation universal, meaning that not everyone will be saved. This does not mean that God does not love everyone. Indeed, He "wants all men to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth" (1 Timothy 2:4 NIV). But only Christ is "the way and the truth and the life" (John 14:6 NIV).
Salvation is not found in legalism, either. Strict adherence to a list of do's and don'ts is not what Christian salvation is about. Romans 3:20 reads, "no one will be declared righteous in his [God's] sight by observing the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of sin." We all "fall short of the glory of God" (Romans 3:23 NIV).
Some beliefs claim that salvation in a biblical sense is not required. Instead, terms such as "spiritual liberation" or "enlightenment" are used. Most of the time this is found in variations of Eastern worldviews such as pantheism. Usually the core idea is that human beings need only realize that they are perfect and divine, resulting in "salvation." But we are far from perfect and deep down everyone knows this fact. God exists, but He is not us and we are not Him.
Biblical Salvation
What then is biblical salvation? It's not by works, legalism enlightenment, and it's not universal. What, then, must we do to be saved? It's important to keep in mind that salvation encompasses what God has done for us, not what we can do for Him. God has taken the initiative in His plan of redemption, reaching out to us through Christ. Hence, the answer regarding the question of salvation as given by Paul and Silas is, "Believe in the Lord Jesus …" (Acts 16:31 NIV). The Greek word translated "believe" in the passage is pisteuo, meaning "to believe, put one's faith in, trust, with an implication that actions based on that trust may follow."[2] Belief, then, encompasses more than just knowing about Jesus. One must also act on this knowledge, combining faith and trust and acting on it.
Salvation also entails repentance - a sincere willingness to radically change our behavior (see, for instance Matthew 3:2; 4:17; Mark 6:12; Luke 13:3-5; Acts 2:38). There is a certain degree of humility that is also required on our part in order to submit to Christ and receive salvation. In the story of the jailer, for instance, we are told he "fell trembling before Paul and Silas" (Acts 16:29 NIV). He also addressed them as "Sirs," using a term of respect and acknowledging the authority of Paul and Silas in Christ. In other words, the roles are reversed. Rather than the Christian prisoners being under the authority of the jailer, it is the jailer who now humbly submits to them, sincerely seeking God's salvation.
Salvation: Simple But Deep
The Christian message of salvation is simple enough for everyone to understand, but deep enough to entail a lifetime of study. Salvation is very much interconnected to other aspects of theology such as the meaning of Christ's Atonement, the human condition, God's attributes such as His justice and holiness, our eternal destiny and more. "Jesus is Lord" is a simple statement of faith, but in relation to salvation it's important to know who Jesus is, who He claimed to be and what it means to believe and follow Him.
The Apostle Paul summarized the message of salvation - the Gospel - in 1 Corinthians 15, where he wrote, under divine inspiration: "Now, brothers, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand. By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain. For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, and that he appeared to Peter, and then to the Twelve" (1 Corinthians 15:1-5 NIV).
In this passage Paul stresses the literal death and resurrection of Christ, "for our sins," the biblical foundations for this (acknowledging the authority of the Bible), and the proof provided by Christ's many post-resurrection appearances.
Christ: The Center of Salvation
But we are not expected to "just believe" and be saved, without any appeal to proof or reason. Certainly faith plays a part in salvation, but there is a difference between blind faith and justified faith. Even Acts 1:3, for instance, observes of Christ, "After his suffering, he showed himself to these men and gave many convincing proofs that he was alive," while in Acts 26:25, Paul states that his Christian beliefs are "true and reasonable."
When Paul and Silas said to the jailer, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved …" (Acts 16:31 NIV), they understand the centrality of Christ in salvation. The word translated as "saved" is charged with deep theological implications, meaning "to save, rescue, deliver; to heal … to be in right relationship with God, with the implication that the condition before salvation was one of grave danger or distress" [3]
Christ's death and resurrection offers every one of us an opportunity for salvation. When is the right time to accept His offer? As C.S. Lewis said, "Now, today, this moment, is our chance to choose the right side. God is holding back to give us that chance. It will not last forever. We must take it or leave it."[4]
From Focus on the family
Nanja
Well-known member
As if your false teachings aren't enough, but you find other false prophets who you are in agreement with and post them as if they are truth!
2 Tim. 4:3-4
3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
You believe that Focus on the Famil is full of false prophets????? Shame on you!!!!!
Nanja
Well-known member
Yep, just more false prophets!