You lost, friend. My extensive post earlier pretty much deflated you entire argument.
Instead of a rebuttal, you claim Catholics think Christ is an alien.
Then, when I defended the Christian premise of Christ (not being an extraterrestrial), you reply in defense of Christ being an alien? Adding with it some really random (and fringe) claims about Joseph, Isaac, Isaac's location of sacrifice.
All of your additions are not found biblically, or even in early Christian writings. Interesting tactics and theories, to say the least.
Also, all Christians believe in the Virgin Birth. Catholics, Methodists, Baptists, Pentacostals, Fundamentalists, etc. Even cults like JW's and Mormons believe that. And they aren't even Christians. So to say that believing in the Birth makes one Catholic; you are right. But I meant my original intent: Believing in the Virgin Birth is an essential belief of Christianity.
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Jsanford108 wrote.........You lost, friend. My extensive post earlier pretty much deflated you entire argument.
S-word..........No my friend, it is you who have been deceived into believing that Jesus was born of the flesh from some supposed ever virgin, who has been lost, and I am here to put you back on the right track.
Jsanford108 wrote..........Instead of a rebuttal, you claim Catholics think Christ is an alien.
S-word..........You catholics believe that the man, before whose image you bow, was an immortal and eternal non physical, non human, life form, which existed even before the Cosmos was created. Now if such a life form came down to earth, without a human like body as a disguise, which body was not of the seed of Adam, what do you think the world would call that life form? Answer------An Alien.
Jsanford108........Then, when I defended the Christian premise of Christ (not being an extraterrestrial), you reply in defense of Christ being an alien?
S-word.........So, you believe that before he created the cosmos, he was a terrestrial being, was he? Hmmm I can't imagine a terrestrial being existing before the cosmos was created. Now then, can you tell us all what you would call an immortal and eternal, non physical, non human, life form that existed before the creation of the entire cosmos?
jsandford108 wrote.........Adding with it some really random (and fringe) claims about Joseph, Isaac, Isaac's location of sacrifice.
S-word...........So you reject the scriptures which state that Jesus was the son of Joseph the son of Heli/Alexander Helios, and that Isaac was born of God’s promise according to the workings/power of the Holy Spirit, and you reject the fact that Mt Moriah, where Abraham offered his son Isaac, and the Temple Mount where Jesus was crucified, are the same place, do you?
Jsanford108..........All of your additions are not found biblically, or even in early Christian writings. Interesting tactics and theories, to say the least.
S-word...........I suppose others, who like yourself have never studied the scripture, might believe as you do.
Jsanford108 wrote..........Also, all Christians believe in the Virgin Birth. Catholics, Methodists, Baptists, Pentacostals, Fundamentalists, etc. Even cults like JW's and Mormons believe that. And they aren't even Christians. So to say that believing in the Birth makes one Catholic; you are right. But I meant my original intent: Believing in the Virgin Birth is an essential belief of Christianity.
S-word...........The virgin birth might be an essential belief of the Roman church of Emperor Constantine and all her denominational daughters, who were spawned of her lying spirit, before breaking away from their mother body, to establish families of their own, after the Roman church of Constantine had lost its power to ban all other religious institutions.
From the book, “Jesus The Evidence,” by Ian Wilson. P. 144.
The Middle Ages, for the Jews at least, began with the advent to power of Constantine the Great. He was the first Roman Emperor to issue laws which radically limited the rights of the Jews as citizens of the Roman Empire, a right conferred on them by Caracalla in 212 AD. As (The so-called Christianity of Constantine’s church) grew in power it influenced the emperors to limit further the civil and political rights of the Jews.
But if times were again difficult for the Jews, for the Christian Gnostics and other fringe groups they were impossible. The books of Arius and his sympathizers were ordered to be burnt, and a reign of terror proclaimed for all those who did not conform with the new official (So-called) Christian line.
"Understand now by this present statute, Novatians, Valentinians, Marcionites, Paulinians, you who are called Cataphrygians. . . . with what a tissue of lies and vanities, with what destructive and venomous errors, your doctrines are inextricably woven! We give you warning . . . .Let none of you presume, from this time forward, to meet in congregations. To prevent this, we command that you be deprived of all the houses in which you have been accustomed to meet . . . . and that these house should be handed over immediately to the catholic/ i.e. universal church."
Within a generation, hardly leaving a trace of their existence for posterity, the great majority of these groups simply died away as successive Christian emperors reiterated the politics that Constantine had pursued.
But the virgin birth is definitely not the belief of those who accept the Jesus as taught by the apostles, and not ‘YOUR’ Jesus who was taught by one of your Saints who said;
“It would be ridiculous to imagine that the redeemer, in order to exist, had the usual needs of man. He only took food and ate it in order that we should not teach about him in a Docetic fashion."
And in another instance, who, in support of the great lie, speaks of the time that some imaginary midwife, (Which is not supported by scripture) who was supposed to be at the birth of Jesus, told some woman by the name Salome, that the mother was still a virgin after the birth and that her hymen was still intact, (Which is not supported by scripture) and that this supposed Salome, stuck her finger into the mother's vagina to check, and her hand immediately withered up, but the baby Jesus reached out and touched her hand and healed it.
His teachings were believed by the Roman Church right up until the 17th century, when the church finally kicked him out and stripped him of his sainthood, but it was too late, the filthy lies had been entrenched in the minds of the gullible.
Constantine appointed his mother Helena as Augusta, and gave her unlimited access to the imperial treasury in order to locate the relics of early Judeo-Christian times.
According to the traditions of the Church of Constantine, Mary and her child rested in a cave, called the Milk Grotto (la Gruta de la Leche), near the place where today stands the Church of the Nativity (la Iglesia de la Natividad). There, (Or so it is said) their supposed Virgin Mary breastfed the child. A drop of milk fell on a stone of the cave, and the stone turned white. During the early centuries, this white rock, diluted in water, took the appearance of milk and was used as a religious relic.
Both Christians and Muslims believe scrapings from the stones in the grotto boost the quantity of a mother’s milk and enhance fertility. Mothers usually mix it in their drinking water; would-be mothers place the MAGICAL rock under their mattress.
Go to the church of the Nativity in Bethlehem of Judaea, which was originally financed and built by Constantine, the founder of the Catholic church and his mother Hellena, who have both been deified as saints by the church that they established in 325 AD.
The church of the Nativity, was originally built over the Milk Grotto, which was discovered by Hellena, of which it is said, that just after the wise men were supposed to have left Bethlehem where Hellena reckoned that they had visited the BABY in the manger, (
Which, according to the scriptures, they didn’t) Herod’s men came storming in, butchering all the boys who were two years and below, while Mary hid in a cave trying to keep her baby quite by breast feeding, him and she happened to spill some milk on the rocks which then miraculously turned white. (or so the story of Helena goes.)
Today, any woman who is having trouble falling pregnant or lactating, can go there and pray to their heavenly queen, who they believe is the mother of God and the co-redeemer of the human race, who was supposedly taken bodily into heaven after her death and before her body began to decompose, and for the price of a small bag of white dust from those MIRACULOUS rocks, they can be cured.
Immediately after that, according to the belief of their St Hellena, whose belief was in accordance to the supposedly infallible teachings of the church that was established by her non Christian son, the holy family fled from Bethlehem of Judaea into the land of Egypt. But not according to the word of God.
Not a bad story, hey? What a pity that it is not supported by the scriptures, which states in Luke 2: that the BABY was born in a stable and while it was in the manger, the shepherds came to see the BABY,
(No mention of the wise men) eight days after the birth of the BABY, it was circumcised and then named Jesus.
Luke 2: 22; The time came for Joseph and Mary to perform the ceremony of purification as the law of Moses Commanded.
When, according to the law of Moses, was the ceremony of purification to be performed?
Leviticus 12:3-4; Concerning a male child; "On the eighth day the child shall be circumcised, then 33 days later, the mother will perform the ceremony of purification."
Then 33 days after the baby Jesus had been circumcised, Mary openly carried the BABY the few miles from Bethlehem to the temple in Jerusalem,
(Still no mention of the wise men or the slaughter of the innocents) and there, In the temple at Jerusalem, Mary performed the ceremony of Purification.
According to Leviticus 12: 6-8; the woman performing the ceremony of purification, was to offer to the priest, a one year old unblemished lamb for a burnt offering and a pigeon or dove for a sin offering, then in verse 8, it is said that if the woman could not afford a lamb, she should bring two doves or two pigeons, one for a burnt offering the other for a sin offering, which was the offering of Mary.
This plainly reveals that she had not yet received the gifts of Gold, frankincense and Myrrh: If she had, she could have afforded and would have offered the one year old unblemished lamb, but we see that she couldn’t afford a lamb, as she could only offer a pair of doves or two pigeons. Luke 2: 24.
Luke 2: 39; After the ceremony of purification was completed, and when Joseph and Mary had finished everything that was required of them by the Law of the Lord, they returned to THEIR home in Nazareth which is only about 2 miles from Bethlehem of Galilee, which town today, is call ‘Beitlahm’ and is about 4 miles from the beautiful Hellenistic city of Sepphoris, a burgeoning Greco-Roman metropolis boasting upward of thirty thousand inhabitants.
It was to their
'HOUSE' in Nazareth that the wise men came to do obedience to the child, who had to travel from their country in the east, which would have taken them three to four months.
You must continue to believe Your saint Helena and the teachings of her son's Church. While I will continue to believe the words of the Lord.
