ECT The First Commandment - You shall have no other gods before me

[Jacob]

Do idols take the place of God? Can anything but God be an idol?

Do idols take the place of God? Can anything but God be an idol?

The following verses are found simply through a search for idols. Probably better to put these under graven image (the command of the ten which is a prohibition against idols), but here I am thinking there might be a verse somewhere that describes idols being anything that takes the place of God in our lives. Such as an idea, a sin or seeking to satisfy your sinful desires. God can change a person (an unbeliever for example) and wash them clean by His Spirit. So seek to satisfy not your desires but to please God in what you do. If you do not know freedom from sin do everything you can... read the Bible talk to a friend or pastor about the truth found in the Bible of freedom from sin and its penalty and its power in this present life in and through Jesus God's only begotten Son, the Messiah.

1 Corinthians 12:2 NASB - You know that when you were pagans, you were led astray to the mute idols, however you were led.

2 Corinthians 6:16 NASB - Or what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For we are the temple of the living God; just as God said, "I WILL DWELL IN THEM AND WALK AMONG THEM; AND I WILL BE THEIR GOD, AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE.

1 Thessalonians 1:9 NASB - For they themselves report about us what kind of a reception we had with you, and how you turned to God from idols to serve a living and true God,

1 John 5:21 NASB - Little children, guard yourselves from idols.

Revelation 9:20 NASB - The rest of mankind, who were not killed by these plagues, did not repent of the works of their hands, so as not to worship demons, and the idols of gold and of silver and of brass and of stone and of wood, which can neither see nor hear nor walk;

 

[Jacob]

Do idols take the place of God? Can anything but God be an idol?

Not sure why I typed this, looking back. Maybe some people think God is an idol. He is not. Maybe other things take the place of God is some people's minds. Like an idol. I am completely against the worship of false gods. They are not God. And an idol cannot be God, being that it was made by men. Idolatry can be seen as worshiping anything other than God. So, God cannot be an idol. If a person thinks God is an idol they are not worshiping the one true God, the Creator of heaven and earth.

 

[Totton Linnet]

Jesus is God...

 

[Jacob]

Jesus is God...

Please explain what you are saying. What do you believe and why do you believe as you do?

 

[Totton Linnet]

You do not believe that Jesus is Jahweh God and so you should not post in the exclusive christian forum

 

[jamie]

Please explain what you are saying. What do you believe and why do you believe as you do?

I was watching in the night visions,
And behold, One like the Son of Man,
Coming with the clouds of heaven!
He came to the Ancient of Days,
And they brought Him near before Him.
Then to Him was given dominion and glory and a kingdom,
That all peoples, nations, and languages should serve Him.
His dominion is an everlasting dominion,
Which shall not pass away,
And His kingdom the one
Which shall not be destroyed.
(Daniel 7:13-14)​

Who do you think this is referring to?

 

[Jacob]

You do not believe that Jesus is Jahweh God and so you should not post in the exclusive christian forum

I believe Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. The translation I use says once that He is the only begotten God. I know from Colossians 2:9 NASB that all the fulness of Deity dwells in Him. I believe all of scripture. I am a Christian. I don't know where your question is coming from, but I have responded to it. Are you relating what you are, or asking what you are, because of the opening post or any other post in this thread?

I do not know what you are saying. That is why I asked. You can explain what you believe and why. You may have scripture or a Theological position. Of those who believe Jesus is God some believe that He is YHVH and some believe that He is the Son of YHVH and some believe both. I do not even know your position on this nor do I know the scriptures you might use to justify your position.

My position is that since all the fullness of Deity dwells in Him in bodily form that makes Jesus the Son of God or both the Son of God and God. If Jesus is God is He YHVH or the Son of YHVH?

See Psalm 110 NASB. Jesus is The Lord ('Adonay). His Father is LORD (YHVH, God).

I believe Jesus is God (from Colossians 2:9 NASB), but that Jesus is not the Father, and I have scripture to say Jesus is the only begotten Son of God.

 

[Jacob]

I was watching in the night visions,
And behold, One like the Son of Man,
Coming with the clouds of heaven!
He came to the Ancient of Days,
And they brought Him near before Him.
Then to Him was given dominion and glory and a kingdom,
That all peoples, nations, and languages should serve Him.
His dominion is an everlasting dominion,
Which shall not pass away,
And His kingdom the one
Which shall not be destroyed.
(Daniel 7:13-14)​

Who do you think this is referring to?

Jesus and His Father, the Ancient of Days.

 

[jamie]

Jesus and His Father, the Ancient of Days.

Yes, it is referring to Christ who was given a kingdom that will never pass away.

He came to the Father in the clouds of heaven and was given the power of God.

Everyone on earth will serve him which means he is God or the first commandment would be violated.

 

[patrick jane]

Please explain what you are saying. What do you believe and why do you believe as you do?

Idols can be smart phones or ice cream. Anything you love besides god can be an idol and a false god

 

[Jacob]

Yes, it is referring to Christ who was given a kingdom that will never pass away.

I believe this is correct. I don't know when it became correct. As prophecy or eternal truth it has always been true.

He came to the Father in the clouds of heaven and was given the power of God.

I don't know if this is correct. I do know that Jesus is at the right hand of God.

Everyone on earth will serve him which means he is God or the first commandment would be violated.

Have you read 1 Corinthians 15? Why do you say will?

 

[jamie]

Why do you say will?

Not everyone serves Christ at this time.

 

[Jacob]

Not everyone serves Christ at this time.

1 Corinthians 15:1-58 NASB - 1 Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain. 3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that He appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve. 6 After that He appeared to more than five hundred brethren at one time, most of whom remain until now, but some have fallen asleep; 7 then He appeared to James, then to all the apostles; 8 and last of all, as to one untimely born, He appeared to me also. 9 For I am the least of the apostles, and not fit to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. 10 But by the grace of God I am what I am, and His grace toward me did not prove vain; but I labored even more than all of them, yet not I, but the grace of God with me. 11 Whether then it was I or they, so we preach and so you believed. 12 Now if Christ is preached, that He has been raised from the dead, how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? 13 But if there is no resurrection of the dead, not even Christ has been raised; 14 and if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is vain, your faith also is vain. 15 Moreover we are even found to be false witnesses of God, because we testified against God that He raised Christ, whom He did not raise, if in fact the dead are not raised. 16 For if the dead are not raised, not even Christ has been raised; 17 and if Christ has not been raised, your faith is worthless; you are still in your sins. 18 Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished. 19 If we have hoped in Christ in this life only, we are of all men most to be pitied. 20 But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep. 21 For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ's at His coming, 24 then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power. 25 For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet. 26 The last enemy that will be abolished is death. 27 For HE HAS PUT ALL THINGS IN SUBJECTION UNDER HIS FEET. But when He says, "All things are put in subjection," it is evident that He is excepted who put all things in subjection to Him. 28 When all things are subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One who subjected all things to Him, so that God may be all in all. 29 Otherwise, what will those do who are baptized for the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why then are they baptized for them? 30 Why are we also in danger every hour? 31 I affirm, brethren, by the boasting in you which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily. 32 If from human motives I fought with wild beasts at Ephesus, what does it profit me? If the dead are not raised, LET US EAT AND DRINK, FOR TOMORROW WE DIE. 33 Do not be deceived: "Bad company corrupts good morals." 34 Become sober-minded as you ought, and stop sinning; for some have no knowledge of God. I speak this to your shame. 35 But someone will say, "How are the dead raised? And with what kind of body do they come?" 36 You fool! That which you sow does not come to life unless it dies; 37 and that which you sow, you do not sow the body which is to be, but a bare grain, perhaps of wheat or of something else. 38 But God gives it a body just as He wished, and to each of the seeds a body of its own. 39 All flesh is not the same flesh, but there is one flesh of men, and another flesh of beasts, and another flesh of birds, and another of fish. 40 There are also heavenly bodies and earthly bodies, but the glory of the heavenly is one, and the glory of the earthly is another. 41 There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; for star differs from star in glory. 42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown a perishable body, it is raised an imperishable body; 43 it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power; 44 it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. 45 So also it is written, "The first MAN, Adam, BECAME A LIVING SOUL." The last Adam became a life-giving spirit. 46 However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural; then the spiritual. 47 The first man is from the earth, earthy; the second man is from heaven. 48 As is the earthy, so also are those who are earthy; and as is the heavenly, so also are those who are heavenly. 49 Just as we have borne the image of the earthy, we will also bear the image of the heavenly. 50 Now I say this, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable. 51 Behold, I tell you a mystery; we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed, 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet; for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53 For this perishable must put on the imperishable, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 But when this perishable will have put on the imperishable, and this mortal will have put on immortality, then will come about the saying that is written, "DEATH IS SWALLOWED UP in victory. 55 "O DEATH, WHERE IS YOUR VICTORY? O DEATH, WHERE IS YOUR STING?" 56 The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law; 57 but thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ. 58 Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your toil is not in vain in the Lord.

 

[Mark M]

Everybody worships false idols

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[Jacob]

Everybody worships false idols

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I don't believe this is correct, and no one should. Do you know the first and second commandments?

 

[Jacob]

Idols can be smart phones or ice cream. Anything you love besides god can be an idol and a false god

Shalom.

You have a point!

Shalom.

Jacob

 

[daqq]

I believe this command includes that there is only one God. It does not mean there are other gods that could compare to the one true God.

Also, saying this makes me think of... or I think of this (following or verse following this (now) here) as I wrote these two sentences, prior to this one, especially the second sentence. Found Bible verse:

Exodus 15:11 NASB - "Who is like You among the gods, O LORD? Who is like You, majestic in holiness, Awesome in praises, working wonders?

Amen, except that there are indeed other gods, or elohim, even judges.

I believe Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. The translation I use says once that He is the only begotten God. I know from Colossians 2:9 NASB that all the fulness of Deity dwells in Him. I believe all of scripture. I am a Christian. I don't know where your question is coming from, but I have responded to it. Are you relating what you are, or asking what you are, because of the opening post or any other post in this thread?

I do not know what you are saying. That is why I asked. You can explain what you believe and why. You may have scripture or a Theological position. Of those who believe Jesus is God some believe that He is YHVH and some believe that He is the Son of YHVH and some believe both. I do not even know your position on this nor do I know the scriptures you might use to justify your position.

My position is that since all the fullness of Deity dwells in Him in bodily form that makes Jesus the Son of God or both the Son of God and God. If Jesus is God is He YHVH or the Son of YHVH?

See Psalm 110 NASB. Jesus is The Lord ('Adonay). His Father is LORD (YHVH, God).

I believe Jesus is God (from Colossians 2:9 NASB), but that Jesus is not the Father, and I have scripture to say Jesus is the only begotten Son of God.

You do not believe that Jesus is Jahweh God and so you should not post in the exclusive christian forum

That is the problem with the mainstream western mindset always assuming that Elohim always necessarily means "Almighty God" when that is not how it is used in the scripture. There are indeed other lesser gods, O ye gods, (lol), for the Master himself says so when he quotes Psalm 82:6, in John 10:34-36, and says that those to whom the Logos-Word of Elohim has come are called elohim-theoi-theous, (and he emphatically states that the scripture cannot be broken). Therefore, O ye gods, to whom the Logos-Word of Elohim has come; anyone who puts himself or herself and his or her ideas, dogmas, and mindset before the Father, exalts his or her own self above the Father and breaks the commandment, (O ye little "e" elohim, lol), and if you want to get technical the commandment actually implies "equal to", ("You shall have no other elohim to My face"). For the Master says, of those to whom the Logos-Word of Elohim has come, "Ye are elohim", "Ye are theoi", etc., and that is by way of his own clear statements as referenced above herein, (Psalm 82:6 and John 10:34-36), O ye elohim. :chuckle:

 

[daqq]

Amen, except that there are indeed other gods, or elohim, even judges.


That is the problem with the mainstream western mindset always assuming that Elohim always necessarily means "Almighty God" when that is not how it is used in the scripture. There are indeed other lesser gods, O ye gods, (lol), for the Master himself says so when he quotes Psalm 82:6, in John 10:34-36, and says that those to whom the Logos-Word of Elohim has come are called elohim-theoi-theous, (and he emphatically states that the scripture cannot be broken). Therefore, O ye gods, to whom the Logos-Word of Elohim has come; anyone who puts himself or herself and his or her ideas, dogmas, and mindset before the Father, exalts his or her own self above the Father and breaks the commandment, (O ye little "e" elohim, lol), and if you want to get technical the commandment actually implies "equal to", ("You shall have no other elohim to My face"). For the Master says, of those to whom the Logos-Word of Elohim has come, "Ye are elohim", "Ye are theoi", etc., and that is by way of his own clear statements as referenced above herein, (Psalm 82:6 and John 10:34-36), O ye elohim. :chuckle:

I suppose the passages may as well be quoted:

Exodus 20:1-3
1 And Elohim spoke all these words, saying:
2 I am YHWH your Elohim, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
3 You shalt have no other elohim against My face. [על־פני]

Psalm 82:6-7
6 I have said, You are elohim; and all of you are sons of the Most High:
7 But you shall die as adam, and fall as one of the princes.

John 10:30-36
30 I and the Father are one.
31 The Yhudim took up stones again to stone him.
32 Yeshua answered them, Many good works have I showed you from the Father; for which of those works do you stone me?
33 The Yhudim answered him, For a good work we stone you not, but for blasphemy; and because that you, being a man, make yourself Elohim.
34 Yeshua answered them, Is it not written in your Law, "I have said, You are theoi-elohim"?
35 If he called them theous-elohim, unto whom the Logos-Word of Elohim came, and the scripture cannot be broken:
36 You say of him, whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, "You blaspheme", because I said I am [a] Son of Elohim?

 

[Jacob]

Amen, except that there are indeed other gods, or elohim, even judges.





That is the problem with the mainstream western mindset always assuming that Elohim always necessarily means "Almighty God" when that is not how it is used in the scripture. There are indeed other lesser gods, O ye gods, (lol), for the Master himself says so when he quotes Psalm 82:6, in John 10:34-36, and says that those to whom the Logos-Word of Elohim has come are called elohim-theoi-theous, (and he emphatically states that the scripture cannot be broken). Therefore, O ye gods, to whom the Logos-Word of Elohim has come; anyone who puts himself or herself and his or her ideas, dogmas, and mindset before the Father, exalts his or her own self above the Father and breaks the commandment, (O ye little "e" elohim, lol), and if you want to get technical the commandment actually implies "equal to", ("You shall have no other elohim to My face"). For the Master says, of those to whom the Logos-Word of Elohim has come, "Ye are elohim", "Ye are theoi", etc., and that is by way of his own clear statements as referenced above herein, (Psalm 82:6 and John 10:34-36), O ye elohim. :chuckle:

There is only one God that we worship, the God of Israel, YHVH. As an Israelite or one who studies Hebrew I can see His name in the Hebrew. It is the Hebrew letters pronounced yod hey vav hey. It has been said that His name is not pronounced. I have heard different pronunciations, and rejected Yahweh as a valid pronunciation. You are correct that elohiym or elohim does not refer only to God.

Shalom.

Jacob

 

[daqq]

There is only one God that we worship, the God of Israel, YHVH. As an Israelite or one who studies Hebrew I can see His name in the Hebrew. It is the Hebrew letters pronounced yod hey vav hey. It has been said that His name is not pronounced. I have heard different pronunciations, and rejected Yahweh as a valid pronunciation. You are correct that elohiym or elohim does not refer only to God.

Shalom.

Jacob

Amen, (or Amein if you prefer, ).

John 17:1-3 The Scriptures (ISR 1998)
1 יהושע said these words, and lifted up His eyes to the heaven, and said, “Father, the hour has come. Esteem Your Son, so that Your Son also might esteem You,
2 as You have given Him authority over all flesh, that He should give everlasting life to all whom You have given Him.
3 “And this is everlasting life, that they should know You, the only true Elohim, and יהושע Messiah whom You have sent.
http://biblehub.com/isr/john/17.htm