the church

[chrysostom]

His kingdom is not of this world
-that is what the bible says

 

[chrysostom]

Yesterday we learned that at least 600 year's went by with no mention of a Mary apparition.

where did all these marian apparitions come from?

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

His kingdom is not of this world
-that is what the bible says

What is the kingdom of heaven?

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

I guess that it has escaped their notice that the Bible does NOT describe any succession of leadership for the 12 nor the handing down of the keys.

Judas was replaced (Acts 1); James was not (Acts 12 to the end of the Bible, barring their man-made "tradition").

P.S. Only the 12 get their names on the 12 foundations (Rev 21:14).

Ye shall sit on twelve thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

:up:

 

[Nihilo]

All the scriptures that say 'believe'---those scriptures do NOT nullify the scriptures that say 'obey'.

:doh:

All the scriptures that say 'obey'---those scriptures do NOT nullify the scriptures that say 'believe'.

 

[Nihilo]

You incorrectly suggest people to use self powered free will to desire something spiritually. How free is the will? The fact is, free will is a myth & a human invention. Let's explain. Say I want to lose weight, but I also want a 20oz prime rib with a baked potato, lots of butter. I also want the cheese fries with the oh so important extra bacon. I want two contradictory things. Which one will my will choose?

What other animal besides humans would ever voluntarily fast, when food is abundant. None. This is just one example. Therefore, humans have free will.

My will will choose the one I desire the most. If my desire to lose weight exceeds my desire to eat fattening foods I will choose that. But if my desire for that prime rib exceeds my desire for losing weight I will choose the Prime rib. So in reality my will is in subjection to the thing I desire the most.

That's indistinct from saying that you will choose what you want, which just means that you have free will.

 

[Nihilo]

Augustine interpreting Matt 16:18 like a Protestant and not like the popes religion claiming the Rock is Christ and the church is built on Peter's confession and not on Peter.
"For before he was called Simon. Now this name of Peter was given him by the Lord, and that in a figure, that he should signify the Church. For seeing that Christ is the rock (Petra), Peter is the Christian people. For the rock (Petra) is the original name. Therefore Peter is so called from the rock; not the rock from Peter; as Christ is not called Christ from the Christian, but the Christian from Christ. Therefore, he says, You are Peter; and upon this Rock which you have confessed, upon this Rock which you have acknowledged, saying, You are the Christ, the Son of the living God, will I build My Church; that is upon Myself, the Son of the living God, will I build My Church. I will build you upon Myself, not Myself upon you.
2. For men who wished to be built upon men, said, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas, who is Peter. But others who did not wish to be built upon Peter, but upon the Rock, said, But I am of Christ. And when the Apostle Paul ascertained that he was chosen, and Christ despised, he said, Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were ye baptized in the name of Paul? And, as not in the name of Paul, so neither in the name of Peter; but in the name of Christ: that Peter might be built upon the Rock, not the Rock upon Peter."
Augustine--Sermon 26 Ch. 1 & 2

Interesting that after all that, Augustine not once questioned the valid authority or supreme pastorship of the papacy. It's almost like he didn't know what he was writing according to you. He didn't know that he was anti-Catholic?

When your conclusions oppose the conclusions of the author, you know you didn't read them right.

 

[Nihilo]

You trust unbiblical traditions.

So do you. Yours are considerably younger, which ought to give you pause, because why wouldn't the Church's ancient traditions be more trustworthy than your novel ones?

 

[Nihilo]

Traditionalists have simply not comprehended just how devastating it is that Jesus never appealed to his own authority in his 40 days temptation in the wilderness with the Devil.

As if this is relevant in any way.

Matthew 16:18-19 (KJV)
Matthew 28:18 (KJV)
Luke 10:16 (KJV)
John 20:23 (KJV)
1st John 4:6 (KJV)

 

[Nihilo]

What's more, congregations chose their own elders for the first few centuries, as even Catholic author Garry Wills admits in his useful book "Papal Sins." Bishops were not appointed by the pope until much later.

So what? Before Nicaea there were a lot of Arian bishops, so we can see how well that policy turned out.

 

[Right Divider]

His kingdom is not of this world
-that is what the bible says

The "world" that Jesus was talking about was the corrupted cursed world. Jesus was NOT denying an earthly kingdom.... See Matt. 6:10

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

The "world" that Jesus was talking about was the corrupted cursed world. Jesus was NOT denying an earthly kingdom.... See Matt. 6:10

John 8:23 (KJV)

The LORD Jesus standing on the earth. :up:

 

[john w]

What is this that Paul is saying?

2 Corinthians 2:9 Another reason I wrote you was to see if you would stand the test and be obedient in everything.

Quite irrelevant.

"We must always obey Jesus....We must always obey everything Jesus says...I always obey Jesus..."-you


Sell all you have-"everything...always..."


Scammer. Fraud.

 

[chrysostom]

The "world" that Jesus was talking about was the corrupted cursed world. Jesus was NOT denying an earthly kingdom.... See Matt. 6:10

that is your interpretation not ours

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

that is your interpretation not ours

:chuckle:

 

[Right Divider]

Quite irrelevant.

"We must always obey Jesus....We must always obey everything Jesus says...I always obey Jesus..."-you

Sell all you have-"everything...always..."

Scammer. Fraud.

She doesn't even notice that Paul calls them saved as he recommends their obedience.

 

[Right Divider]

that is your interpretation not ours

My interpretation is correct; yours is wrong. Simple as that.

 

[Eagles Wings]

For the Catholics at TOL - I believe it was in a Catholic church that I first heard the Lord's Prayer sung:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR4PQ30VkBk&feature=youtu.be

 

[chrysostom]

For the Catholics at TOL - I believe it was in a Catholic church that I first heard the Lord's Prayer sung:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR4PQ30VkBk&feature=youtu.be

yes we sing the Lord's prayer but not at all masses and not at all churches
-many churches have a parking problem and need to keep the mass as short as possible so they say it instead of singing it

 

[Cruciform]

You just cannot break from letting others TELL you what to believe can you !

Neither can you, as has already been shown.

God gave you a brain correct ?

Yes, so that I can understand his teachings as delivered in and through Christ's one historic Church.

God promised to send the Holy Spirit correct ?

Yes, whom he said would guide Christ's one historic Church into all truth.

God promised to lead His children correct ?

Yes, by means of the authoritative teachings of Christ's one historic Church.

Show me one scripture where it Says we need an earthly "priest" after-Jesus' resurrection .

See THIS.

Scripture says God is our Abba Father scripture NEVER says a man called pope is our Father NEVER.

The apostles refer to themselves as "fathers" and to lay believers as their "children."

...you brag on the supposed one true church, not Jesus...

Merely a False Dilemma Fallacy on your part, since the two are identical according to Jesus himself (Lk. 10:16). One cannot claim to embrace the Head (Jesus) while simultaneously rejecting the Body (Church).



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+