ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
would you agree then, that those who cause "distress" and "emotional/psychological abuse", not necessarily intentionally, should be labelled as a "hate group"?
Southern Poverty Law Center - Irresponsible Lying Scumbags?
- Thread starter ok doser
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would you agree then, that those who cause "distress" and "emotional/psychological abuse", not necessarily intentionally, should be labelled as a "hate group"?
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
i like to use Black's as the authoritative source for legal definitions
they don't have an entry for "hate group"
in fact, what they do say is rather revealing:
| Which Laws Govern Hate Speech? In the United States, there are no laws against hate speech. Due to rights protected by the U.S. Constitution’s First Amendment, a person can say just about anything he or she wants to another person or group. By itself, such speech is allowed to take place without penalty under the law. A person hurling insults, making rude statements, or disparaging comments about another person or group is merely exercising his or her right to free speech. This is true even if the person or group targeted by the speaker is a member of a protected class. According to U.S. law, such speech is fully permissible and is not defined as hate speech. Under the First Amendment, American citizens have the legal right to say whatever they’d like to. While much ado is often made about so-called “hate speech”, no satisfactory definition for this type of speech exists within the confines of the law. Not to be confused with “hate crimes,” a person’s speech does not affect another person’s physical condition or personal property and is, therefore, not punishable by law. https://thelawdictionary.org/article/the-legalities-of-hate-speech/ |
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
How clearer could I have been? A group doesn't necessarily have to be causing harm in public in order to fall under the category.
For example, if Westboro kept their views for the benefit of their "congregation" they'd still be espousing hate due to the demented nature of their "religious views".
The fact that they've gained notoriety for their public "protests" and picketing isn't the sole thing that identifies them as such.
Until you have the courage to answer the following question then I'm through with the transparency going on here.
Do you agree with Westboro where it comes to celebrating the deaths of American soldiers and those on 9/11, yes or no?
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
you could say "yes, i agree with that"
and that's what i'm going to assume you did
ok, that's a new criteria - i'll add it to the list
btw - there is no such "category", except in the minds of people who think they should be the self-appointed arbiters of behavior, and there's no clear public consensus on what should be included in that "category"
and another criteria
let's see what we have so far
according to artie, any of the following criteria are sufficient to label someone a "hate group"
1. those who cause "distress"
2. those who cause "emotional/psychological abuse",
3. not necessarily intentionally
4. not necessarily in public
5. potentially including statements made in private, as long as they are deemed by artie to be representative of the "demented nature of their (views/beliefs)"
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
Um, no, not according to me, that's just you obfuscating and you really are a coward where it comes to your convictions aren't you? Why can't you answer this very simple question:
Do you agree with Westboro where it comes to celebrating the deaths of American soldiers and those on 9/11, yes or no?
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
then make your own list, or correct the one i made
what specific criteria do you believe should be met in order to label someone a "hate group"?
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
You answer the question posited a few times now and I'll address yours:
Do you agree with Westboro where it comes to celebrating the deaths of American soldiers and those on 9/11, yes or no?
Now if you have the courage of your convictions then it should be very easy for you to do so. Otherwise, why do you continually avoid it?
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
no deal artie
looks like your answer to "what specific criteria do you believe should be met in order to label someone a hate group?" is "i don't know"
which is what i've suspected all along
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
I would rather work from the legal definition as seen above, and only attach the "hate group" label to those organizations who deliberately call for harming another person’s physical condition or personal property
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
Of course you weren't going to answer it. It took you an age to address Phelps as it was and we both know why. Agreeing with the likes of celebrating American soldiers dying in war and those who died on 9/11 isn't going to fly on here. There's threads commemorating 9/11 here and respects paid to all the victims of the atrocity and those who died in battle so you were never going to be so open as to admit that on this forum.
You venerate Phelps and call him a "Godly man" but when put on the spot you're just a coward and won't stand by your convictions.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
right - i like to keep these discussions focused and not to go off on too many bunnytrails
if you want, start a new thread
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
meanwhile, this direct, specific, clear question put to artie goes unanswered:
Artie - what specific criteria do you believe should be met in order to label someone a "hate group"?
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
Well no, you're just that much of a coward that you won't answer a very simple and straightforward question because you know how it'll make you look and one that you could have so easily answered by now if it didn't make you so uncomfortable.
I understand, it's not exactly easy to admit that you go along with a guy you venerate who publicly celebrated the deaths of American soldiers and the victims of 9/11 but that was your call once you described him as a "Godly man". Yet now you back away from it when put on the spot.
Go ahead and report and try to get me booted from the thread if you like. I'll give this much to Phelps, he didn't hide away or make excuses for his views as contemptible as they were. You? You can't even answer one simple question.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
This sums it up pretty well and I've no disagreement:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_group
I'll wait while you cowardly deflect from the above question or find myself removed from the thread or something.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
The SPLC doesn't call for that or condone violence so what was the point of this exactly?
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
| A hate group is a social group that advocates and practices hatred, hostility, or violence towards members of a race, ethnicity, nation, religion, gender, gender identity, sexual orientation or any other designated sector of society. |
so you're a member of a hate group?
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
Why so reticent? If you venerate the guy as much as you do then you shouldn't be embarrassed or ashamed to admit that you go along with his ideology.