sin/sins is not the issue today!

heir

TOL Subscriber
It may well be "nice", but it will probably be too nice to get the result one might hope for. Unfortunately, a homosexual doesn't see himself as a sinner. He's blocked the very idea from his thoughts. How can they believe unless they hear? Hear what? That Christ died for your sins?

"What sins? I'm not a sinner. If you mean my sexual preference, I was born that way, so God (if there is a God) already approves of me."
It's pretty simple to show someone by the scriptures that they are sinners, the wages of sin and the good news that will save them from the wrath to come.
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
It's pretty simple to show someone by the scriptures that they are sinners, the wages of sin and the good news that will save them from the wrath to come.

Yes, it's simple to show them, but that certainly doesn't mean they will see....or even want to see. There has to be a need that is recognized by the one being shown. First the person has to realize they are drowning.....
 

j4jesus09

New member
Sin/sins is NOT THE ISSUE today! All of the work necessary to save anyone today was accomplished by God through the faith and finished work of the Lord Jesus Christ in the WORLD'S place; that includes ALL MEN (no matter who they are, where they've been or what they were doing while they were there)!

2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

2 Corinthians 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

1 Timothy 2:4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. 5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; 6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

If you at this moment are an unbeliever, the only thing stopping you from being saved is your unbelief because even though the righteousness of God (the standard for heaven) is available UNTO YOU by the faith of Jesus Christ, it is not UPON YOU until that moment in your life when you trust the Lord believing Christ died for your sins and that He was buried and rose again the third day (1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV). Trust the Lord for salvation and the righteousness of God will be imputed to you (Romans 3:21-22 KJV, Romans 4:23-25 KJV).

Now, THAT ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^is the "nicest thing you can say to a homo"!

Isn't unbelief a sympton of sin, missing the mark?
 

Dan Emanuel

Active member
Yep, "and such were some of you". All things are become new really does mean something. ;)
2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.​
We are told to "mortify" though. Also. Colossians 3:5 KJV

So it must somehow be both, right?


Daniel
1.0
 

j4jesus09

New member
We are told to "mortify" though. Also. Colossians 3:5 KJV

So it must somehow be both, right?


Daniel
1.0

Through the renewing of the mind which is becoming like Christ we want to mortify the flesh. How would we know how to mortify the flesh once being born again without instructions? We must be taught.
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
We are told to "mortify" though. Also. Colossians 3:5 KJV

So it must somehow be both, right?


Daniel
1.0

Through the renewing of the mind which is becoming like Christ we want to mortify the flesh. How would we know how to mortify the flesh once being born again without instructions? We must be taught.

It's the Spirit. We through the Spirit. The Spirit causes us to "will and do" His good pleasure. That is what HE performs in and through us. Which is why boasting is excluded (in spite of what God's UNtruth claims).

Romans 8:13-14
For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

Philippians 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:​
 

j4jesus09

New member
It's the Spirit. We through the Spirit. The Spirit causes us to "will and do" His good pleasure. That is what HE performs in and through us. Which is why boasting is excluded (in spite of what God's UNtruth claims).

Romans 8:13-14
For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

Philippians 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:​

I agree. God has given us His spirit to work in us to do good. You know, it's the Spirit that leads us to understand this. We should all be in one accord with these things. This is a one sign that one has truly understood their salvation. Some are saved but haven't come to quite the mature understanding of how they have been saved as God hasn't revealed it in detail. The enemy is fighting hard against the truth. God is able!
 

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
We are told to "mortify" though.

Daniel, that is exactly right.

According to glorydaz when a Christian is saved he automatically becomes dead to sin.

But she has no intelligent answer as to why Paul would tell us to put to death the sins he mentioned if we were already dead to sin.

She also has no answer of to what is the source of the defilement mentioned here that stains Christians:

"Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God" (2 Cor.7:1).​
 

j4jesus09

New member
Daniel, that is exactly right.

According to glorydaz when a Christian is saved he automatically becomes dead to sin.

But she has no intelligent answer as to why Paul would tell us to put to death the sins he mentioned if we were already dead to sin.

She also has no answer of to what is the source of the defilement mentioned here that stains Christians:

"Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God" (2 Cor.7:1).​

Because the Holy Spirit will guide us into these truths. Once we are saved what must we do? Once you are born again you know something is different! But you are still battling the flesh. The bible is our instruction manual. Once born again and given the Spirit of God the Holy spirit will teach you how to live these things out. Yes, the bible does say once you are saved you are dead to sin and that is the ultimate truth that you grow into, but this is a process not an overall mindset from day 1. A born again believer will show lots of progess from day 1 to day 365. God didn't ask you to be Jesus in one day. It's growth.
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
Yes, the bible does say once you are saved you are dead to sin

Yes, it does, so why don't you believe it? You might not feel dead to sin, but it's a fact because God said it is.

Romans 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.


and that is the ultimate truth that you grow into, but this is a process not an overall mindset from day 1.

We "grow into" being dead? Are we not crucified with Christ? Are we slowly crucified? I ask because Jerry seems to be trying to get you to believe that being dead to sin is a matter of slowly being made holy. That's his misunderstanding.


A born again believer will show lots of progess from day 1 to day 365. God didn't ask you to be Jesus in one day. It's growth.

You're talking about our being conformed into the image of the Son. That is another matter, altogether.
 

Shasta

Well-known member
Why would a saved person want to do that?

The same reason anyone would want to - because they love the pleasures of sin. I have known many who I believed were saved at one time in their lives but they yielded to temptation and began living in sin. We can say things like that ought not to be but all to often they are.
 

Shasta

Well-known member
We weren't saved by anything that we did, why would you think we can be unsaved by anything that we have done?

So a person could be saved and exhibit no change whatsoever. This is not a good testimony to the changing power of the Holy Spirit. If we were to speak this antinomian gospel openly and honestly we give an invitation like this "Say the sinners prayer, believe in Jesus and then you can do anything you want however often you want." I am sure many would respond to such an offer. It is so much like the broad easy highway that leads to destruction rather than the straight and narrow way that leads to life.

However, in the word faith in Christ is incompatible with a life of sin.

The way Paul taught turning AWAY from sin (repentance) and turning TO Christ (in faith) are opposite sides of the very same coin. Therefore, one cannot put their faith in Christ without departing from a lifestyle of sin.

John acknowledged this in his first Epistle

No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God (1 John 3:9 ).

No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God’s seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God (1 John 3:9 ESV).

In Greek these highlighted words refer not to committing sins but to living a lifestyle of sin. John wrote this letter to combat the Gnostics who among other things went around claiming to be sons of God in a special way, even while living in immorality. John says the mark of a believer is that they walk in the light and not in darkness.

When someone comes to me saying they have been saved but nothing has changed I assume they have not been. When a person is born again a radical change process begins.
 

Grosnick Marowbe

New member
Hall of Fame
So a person could be saved and exhibit no change whatsoever. This is not a good testimony to the changing power of the Holy Spirit. If we were to speak this antinomian gospel openly and honestly we give an invitation like this "Say the sinners prayer, believe in Jesus and then you can do anything you want however often you want." I am sure many would respond to such an offer. It is so much like the broad easy highway that leads to destruction rather than the straight and narrow way that leads to life.

However, in the word faith in Christ is incompatible with a life of sin.

The way Paul taught turning AWAY from sin (repentance) and turning TO Christ (in faith) are opposite sides of the very same coin. Therefore, one cannot put their faith in Christ without departing from a lifestyle of sin.

John acknowledged this in his first Epistle

No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God (1 John 3:9 ).

No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God’s seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God (1 John 3:9 ESV).

In Greek these highlighted words refer not to committing sins but to living a lifestyle of sin. John wrote this letter to combat the Gnostics who among other things went around claiming to be sons of God in a special way, even while living in immorality. John says the mark of a believer is that they walk in the light and not in darkness.

When someone comes to me saying they have been saved but nothing has changed I assume they have not been. When a person is born again a radical change process begins.

So, you're the one who decides if a believer is changed enough to pass your test?
 

Grosnick Marowbe

New member
Hall of Fame
When the Holy Spirit seals, indwells, and baptizes a "True Believer"
into the Body of Christ, it is a, Spiritual act performed on the believer.

It is done "within" that person. Just because YOU can't see it, doesn't
mean it hasn't transpired.
 
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