Of course I include it in the New Covenant, because the Bible does so.
not many Christians do include it...certainly not around here...is all
Paul's covenant of grace, however, does not include a requirement for following the law.
LOL...so what's the point? Of either His putting it into hearts and minds...or His grafting wild branches INTO the root and trunk with other branches NOT CUT OFF...
So they are NOT required because they were not listed? I mean Acts 15 only listed 5 3 dietary and 1 sexual and the Sabbath...but the those under grace CAN worship another god, make idols, blaspheme His name, dishonor parents, kill, steal, lie, covet? LOL
Lemme guess...kingdom of Israel and those grafted into it have ONLY these to keep: "You shall not commit murder; You shall not commit adultery; You shall not steal; You shall not bear false witness; Honor your father and mother." Then He adds, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself" (Matthew 19:18-19)
So cuz Yahushua left these out we CAN worship another god, make idols, do blaspheme His name, covet, oh and of course forget about da Sabbath? LOL
Oh wait...it gets even less inclusive...you claim that for the BOC the whole OT is “not for me”
The New Covenant was in effect after Christ rose and ascended. And then a year later, God put His plan for Israel on hold, and started working directly with the Gentiles.
So He lied here?
Matt 28:19
19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey all that I have commanded you.
Matt 25;32
All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate the people one from another, as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats.
Mark 16:15
And He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature.
Luke 24:47
and in His name repentance and forgiveness of sins will be proclaimed to all nations, beginning in Jerusalem.
I don’t see a one year delay...but right out the gate it was for the gentiles too...
as in the exodus when this ekklesia was already full of those NOT OF JACOB so too was that first Pentecost full of those NOT OF JACOB...neat eh?
"For where there is a testament, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.For a testament is in force after men are dead, since it has no power at all while the testator lives."
Hebrews 9:16-17
yes exactly what I was referencing...NO CHANGES so LIVE AS HE DID...and in your case NO CANCELLATIONS or POSTPONEMENTS of that covenant...you think His LAST WILL AND TESTAMENT can be suspended?
But there was no law given.
sure there was...before Sinai even...Sabbath for MAN not just Jews...what part of Eternal, Perfect, Immutable do you reject?...especially after Sinai FOR HIS PEOPLE...both THOSE OF JACOB AND NOT OF JACOB...ONE LAW...
Only admonishment for:
"that you abstain from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality."
Rules of thumb, not laws.
LOL...
again...you really think gentiles could still worship another god make idol blaspheme His name dishonor parents, kill, steal, lie, covet...even after hearing Moses read and taught every Sabbath in every synagogue? as James concluded Acts 15:21
Or do you think Paul was a hypocrite?
not at all...he was constantly concerned about the law...Love is the fulfilling of the law. Romans 13:10 and more...
"For though I am free from all men, I have made myself a servant to all,
SERVANT? how? by LOVE and AS He LOVED...you know copy me as I copy Christ...LOVE AS CHRIST LOVES
that I might win the more;and to the Jews I became as a Jew,
became a Jew? is there a switch that turns the Jew on and off? LOL
that I might win Jews; to those who are under the law, as under the law, that I might win those who are under the law;
who are under the Law? ALL OF US especially the sinner...who has sinned? DITTO
to those who are without law, as without law (not being without law toward God, but under law toward Christ),
see? UNDER THE LAW
that I might win those who are without law; to the weak I became as weak, that I might win the weak. I have become all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.Now this I do for the gospel’s sake, that I may be partaker of it with you."
so by this you mean to say that Paul went around and worshipped other gods, made idols, blasphemed His name, dishonored his parents, killed, stole, lied, coveted? LOL...HE ADMITTED THAT ONE...and TO STOP DOING IT...
all this lawlessness to you know...to win others? to do what MORE lawlessness?
Well, no. The 4 things that the Jerusalem Council, by their own decree, wanted the gentiles to follow so that there wouldn't be conflict between the believers in both groups. Don't forget the reason for the entire Council in the first place!
these 4 plus the Sabbath James concluded they would keep hearing Moses on Acts 15:21 WERE ALREADY IN THE OT for those coming into their gates...you know like the strangers also receiving Sabbath...
So it was not exactly their “own decree” but one ALREADY in the OT
TWO GROUPS?...you made up the two groups...
no conflict was between both groups because ALREADY NO DISTINCTION was made...Gentiles already were keeping the law...they just had to realize that clean meats offered to idols made them unclean to eat after hearing Moses fellowships on Sabbaths...just as NOT draining the blood from CLEAN meats would defile the meat and make it UNCLEAN and NOT TO BE SERVED for after hearing Moses potlucks on the Sabbath...
but you think the gentiles could come in and kill everybody or lie or steal from them ...or worship their old gods their old ways...LOL...as these were "rules of thumb" LOL
Cite? (Maybe you've gotten this already, as I'm not caught up on every post yet.)
yup Acts 13:45 got so crowded cuz most of Antioch came to hear...and that made Jews jealous...and don't forget ALL Paul’s epistles were to synagogues filling up with gentiles...
Again, I'd like to point out Jeremiah 31:31 and Hebrews 8:8.
Paul's covenant of grace is for the whole world, not just Israel.
fine...point away...
who but His people Israel survive until the end?...overcome...
you just refuse to see that ALREADY when THIS EKKLESIA was in the OT wilderness HE WAS OUR HEAD of the BODY that followed Him...and until the end...as John writes "here are they"...
To those under the New Covenant...
He was talking about the gentiles "wherefore my sentence is" therefore "but that we" and concluded with "for Moses"
19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.
In other words THAT council did NOT RULE on anything that was NOT ALREADY COVERED BY MOSES already when this ekklesia was in the wilderness for the Gentiles to do..IS WHY James concludes MOSES will CONTINUE to be read to them...every Sabbath
Under the New Covenant, Gentiles were expected to become Proselytes and follow the law.
Under Paul's covenant of grace, all are expected to love God and love one's neighbor.
LOL...and with a love that INCLUDES worshipping another god? making idols? blaspheming His name? dishonoring parents? killing? stealing? lying and coveting? LOL
REALLY? How is that loving oneself and your neighbor?
BTW-This loving thingy was ALSO in the OT ALREADY...
God's commandment to men, even outside of the Mosaic law, the Old and New Covenants, is for man to leave his father and mother and cling to his wife. That, by definition, excludes sexual immorality.
"Husbands, love your wives..."
trust me the Greeks and Romans coming into the synagogues needed more clarity than that...original Greek has it as “PORNEIA” the root of Porno and you can be sure a lot of skilled artisans and craftsman needed reminders...but yes incest and homosexuality and well much to itemize and clarify...
but for the sake of brevity let's agree there is A LOT of clarity necessary as even Jews were still defiling "It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife." 1 Cor 5:1
In Acts 15?
The word Sabbath is only mentioned once in Acts 15, and it isn't as a command to the gentiles to keep it.
SUPRA...lol
"Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law.For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not bear false witness,” “You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law."
Romans 13:8-10
ummm...so we can still worship another god, make idols, blaspheme His name, dishonor parents?
Of course NOT!!...AS THERE ARE OTHER COMMANDMENTS
LOVING AS YAHUSHUA LOVED of course FULFILLS THE LAW...duh...is why John says if you claim to abide in Him you must LIVE AS HE DID...
and that DOES include any other commandment...festivals...clean diet...
oh good grief NOW WHAT? your rebellion is REEEAAAALLLLY deeply rooted...
Read again:
"And when we had come to Jerusalem, the brethren received us gladly. On the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present. When he had greeted them, he told in detail those things which God had done among the Gentiles through his ministry. And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord. And they said to him, “You see, brother, how many myriads of Jews there are who have believed, and they are all zealous for the law; but they have been informed about you that you teach all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children nor to walk according to the customs. What then? The assembly must certainly meet, for they will hear that you have come. Therefore do what we tell you: We have four men who have taken a vow. Take them and be purified with them, and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads, and that all may know that those things of which they were informed concerning you are nothing, but that you yourself also walk orderly and keep the law. But concerning the Gentiles who believe, we have written and decided that they should observe no such thing, except that they should keep themselves from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality.”
Then Paul took the men, and the next day, having been purified with them, entered the temple to announce the expiration of the days of purification, at which time an offering should be made for each one of them.
Acts 21:17-26
guess what king Jimmy added to the WORD HERE...
Hint it is in verse 25
As for
Περὶ (Peri)
Preposition
Strong's Greek 4012: From the base of peran; properly, through, i.e. Around; figuratively with respect to; used in various applications, of place, cause or time.
the
τῶν (tōn)
Article - Genitive Neuter Plural
Strong's Greek 3588: The, the definite article. Including the feminine he, and the neuter to in all their inflections; the definite article; the.
Gentile
ἐθνῶν (ethnōn)
Noun - Genitive Neuter Plural
Strong's Greek 1484: Probably from etho; a race, i.e. A tribe; specially, a foreign one.
believers,
πεπιστευκότων (pepisteukotōn)
Verb - Perfect Participle Active - Genitive Neuter Plural
Strong's Greek 4100: From pistis; to have faith, i.e. Credit; by implication, to entrust.
we
ἡμεῖς (hēmeis)
Personal / Possessive Pronoun - Nominative 1st Person Plural
Strong's Greek 1473: I, the first-person pronoun. A primary pronoun of the first person I.
have written [them]
ἐπεστείλαμεν (epesteilamen)
Verb - Aorist Indicative Active - 1st Person Plural
Strong's Greek 1989: To write, send by letter to. From epi and stello; to enjoin, i.e. to communicate by letter.
our decision
κρίναντες (krinantes)
Verb - Aorist Participle Active - Nominative Masculine Plural
Strong's Greek 2919: Properly, to distinguish, i.e. Decide; by implication, to try, condemn, punish.
[that] they
αὐτοὺς (autous)
Personal / Possessive Pronoun - Accusative Masculine 3rd Person Plural
Strong's Greek 846: He, she, it, they, them, same. From the particle au; the reflexive pronoun self, used of the third person, and of the other persons.
must abstain
φυλάσσεσθαι (phylassesthai)
Verb - Present Infinitive Middle
Strong's Greek 5442: Probably from phule through the idea of isolation; to watch, i.e. Be on guard; by implication, to preserve, obey, avoid.
from [food]
τό (to)
Article - Accusative Neuter Singular
Strong's Greek 3588: The, the definite article. Including the feminine he, and the neuter to in all their inflections; the definite article; the.
sacrificed to idols,
εἰδωλόθυτον (eidōlothyton)
Adjective - Accusative Neuter Singular
Strong's Greek 1494: Neuter of a compound of eidolon and a presumed derivative of thuo; an image-sacrifice, i.e. Part of an idolatrous offering.
[from]
καὶ (kai)
Conjunction
Strong's Greek 2532: And, even, also, namely.
blood,
αἷμα (haima)
Noun - Accusative Neuter Singular
Strong's Greek 129: Blood, literally, figuratively or specially; by implication, bloodshed, also kindred.
[from]
καὶ (kai)
Conjunction
Strong's Greek 2532: And, even, also, namely.
the meat of strangled animals,
πνικτὸν (pnikton)
Adjective - Accusative Neuter Singular
Strong's Greek 4156: Strangled (i.e. killed without letting out the blood). From pnigo; throttled, i.e. an animal choked to death.
and [from]
καὶ (kai)
Conjunction
Strong's Greek 2532: And, even, also, namely.
sexual immorality.”
πορνείαν (porneian)
Noun - Accusative Feminine Singular
Strong's Greek 4202: Fornication, whoredom; met: idolatry. From porneuo; harlotry; figuratively, idolatry.
DID YOU SEE WHAT IS MISSING?
DID YOU SEE WHAT KING JIMMY ADDED?
"
that they observe no such thing, save only" The oldest texts omit all these words, and they appear merely to be a marginal comment...JUST LIKE your MADness from Scofield and Darby...the irony
And then Paul was purified with them...proving he walked orderly and kept the law...
well IF Paul was NOT teaching the OT LAW why would the Romans be annoyed he was teaching customs which are NOT lawful for Romans to receive or observe...
Which customs are those...”just love everybody”? LOL
and now you add insult to injury and claim Paul taught all that was for naught Paul was actually just grace and maybe a “rule of thumb” or two...LOL
I'm not sure why you think I made such an argument...
because you deny Sabbath was concluded for Gentiles in Acts 15...
Yes. And?
Having other gods before the one true God is not loving the one True God.
according to you that is NOT required or commanded for the New Program...certainly not in the Acts 15 list or in the Romans 13 one of what those in the BOC are suggested...LOL
Well, no. A violation of "love God and love your neighbor."
ok good NOW you see it...HalleluYah...
Yes exactly...making idols IS NOT included in how Yahushua loved others...or how He taught we love God or as He did...
CONGRATULATIONS...now please apply that same standard to the OTHER 9
ALL these are a violation of “love God and love your neighbor”
1. Worshipping another god
2. You JUST MENTIONED
3. Blaspheming His name
5. Dishonoring your parents
6. Killing
7. Adultery as per Acts 15 too
8. Stealing
9. Lying
10 coveting
Did I miss any? Oh yes...yes I did...
4. Forgetting about the seventh day Sabbath also per Acts 15
Now add the WAY YAHUSHUA ATE
You know clean meats prepared clean...ALSO PER ACTS 15
Oh and the festivals...you know His calendar...as Paul did copy me as I copy Christ...as He kept the festivals too...
So you IF YOU ACTUALLY DO LOVE OTHERS JUST AS YAHUSHUA LOVED YOU...well you will fulfill the Law...as Paul taught...
New Covenant != Paul's covenant of grace.
CITE
if it is NOT as He lived you do NOT follow Him...but another...
Yes, at the beginning of his ministry, before God told him to focus on the gentiles.
you started this post claiming the NEW PROGRAM was introduced 1 year after ascension...
Paul converted 34 and is before Agrippa in 59...and continues with “Therefore having obtained help from Yah to this day I stand witnessing both to small and great saying no other things than those which the prophets and Moses said would come 23 that the Christ would suffer, that He would be the first to rise from the dead, and would proclaim light to the Jewish people and to the Gentiles”. Acts 26:22-23
Nothing about a NEW PROGRAM...you ADD to the word...like king Jimmy or commentary notes...and create another gospel another christ...
Love God, love one's neighbor.
awww cute...love like pizza and puppies? Love like Buddha or Muslim? Love like Hindu or Pagan? How about LOVE like you did before you were SAVED?
Ironic that this COMMANDMENT IS IN THE OT...for ISRAEL...so what is new?
Yes, we establish the law.
HalleluYah...
Why?
Because the law is a tutor to bring people to Christ.
right but then we go against that tutor...do otherwise than what it taught? Or not at all? LOL
How?
To show them that they are INCAPABLE OF KEEPING the law of God, but Christ did it for them.
LOL...His doing it for them is why they should want to...
Imagine teaching a new game to someone who really WANTS TO PLAY...teach its rules and strategy but then proclaim “but you CANT DO IT...it is IMPOSSIBLE....ONLY X did it for you...so now you don’t even have to try...” LOL
right 10/10 or 9/10 or...maybe not the drain the blood or maybe drain the blood from pigs and claim it is clean...LOL
I have no idea what you're talking about.
Acts 26:24 Festus claims too much learning has driven Paul MAD...the irony...which you and yours do claim Paul is MAD...
He denied it...verse 25
Acts wasn't written until after the events contained within happened... so...
so what...MAD began a few centuries ago with Jesuit Scofield and Darby...
yay we agree...
I recommend you read 1 Corinthians 5 again.
is about one in their midst being sexually immoral... Paul doesn’t sound to nonchalant about it...as you claimed “no laws” about it or it being just “rule of thumb”
Paul doesnt seem to be too “without law to win those whiteout law” about it all...in fact Paul instructs to kick him out and have NO FELLOWSHIP with those WITHIN THE CHURCH...as you cant avoid all of them in the world...Paul says to judge those inside
He doesn't say to keep the feast described in the Mosaic Law.
oh? which other feast is unleavened bread used?
Yes, the Sabbath made for man, not the other way around.
ok...good so don’t reject it...because Paul did NOT nor did those grafted into the BODY OF CHRIST that first century...and beyond...Heb 4:9
Meaning the Sabbath is an arbitrary commandment based on the Creation week.
Arbitrary? LOL
Tell you what:
You stick with believing Jews when they claim Stephen/Paul taught “Jesus changed the customs Moses delivered”...which Luke clarified was false witness and wrote of Paul’s refutation that those charges were NOT proven...
And I will go along with their claim as to when the seventh day Sabbath has been since that time...
LOL “Paul’s covenant of grace, however, does not include a requirement for following the Law”...oh my
“Only rule of thumb” LOL
I will stick to what the finger of Yah wrote...thanks...as He did...and Peter...and Paul...yup...
Read Titus one of Paul’s last letters...surely your no laws rule of thumb NEW PROGRAM should be CLEARLY apparent yes?
Instead we find:
Titus 1:
16 ”They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.”
Titus 3:
8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.
14 And let our's also learn to maintain good works for necessary uses, that they be not unfruitful.
15 All that are with me salute thee. Greet them that love us in the faith. Grace be with you all. Amen.
love us how?... Like the world loves?
In the faith...which faith? Buddhist Muslim Hindu Catholic Protestant?
Eph 4:4There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; 5
one Lord, one faith, one baptism;6one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.
1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether
we be Jews or Gentiles, whether
we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
1 for 10:4 and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.
already when this ekklesia was in the OT and already full of those NOT OF JACOB...ONE LAW...native and foreigner...
