Rules Governing The Gift Of Tongues

[God's Truth]

You slander Gods word.

LA

False accuser.

 

[God's Truth]

John 14:12

Jesus Christ, who always spoke what the Father told him to speak, tells us that we can do the same works as he did and greater.

I believe him.

Therefore I can do the same works as Jesus Christ and not only the same works, and according to Jesus' own words as recorded in John 14:12 I can do greater works than Jesus Christ.

Is it only I that can claim what Jesus Christ promised in John 14:12? No, everyone who believes can do so, "if you can believe, all things are possible to him that believes" Mark 9:23

However, John 14:12 does not negate or override other truths.

In John 5:30 Jesus states, "I can of myself do nothing" and "I seek not my own will, but the will of the Father who sent me" Jesus Christ did not "do his own thing" he did not rebel against God and did what he did because "if it feels good do it".... Jesus Christ did not always feel good, but he submitted his own will to the Father, he always did the Father's will not his own.

Is there any record that states that Jesus raised everyone and anyone that he wanted to? No, but we do know that he raised those who his Father directed him to raise, if John 5:30 is truth, and it is. Does scripture record that Jesus raised those who were crucified with him from the dead? No, it doesn't. We cannot assume that Jesus raised all people who died during his ministry from the dead. Well, neither can I. I am to do the will of the Father, than I must learn from the Father and receive His go ahead to do the works of Jesus Christ even as Jesus Christ learned of the Father what to do and what to say.

John 5:19-21 likewise tells us that Jesus did what the Father showed him. Interestingly, it seems that in verse 21 Jesus is claiming he raised whoever he wanted to raise. that statement and John 5:30 cannot be true for they are contradictory at face value. Since Jesus chose to do the Father's will, he was in the Father's will when he was doing what he was doing. He chose to do the Father's will so whatever the Father said he had authority to do, he was free to do.

Doing the same works does not mean doing the identical works.

I am not going to raise Lazarus from the dead again after he was dead for 4 days. I cannot go back in time.

Likewise, even as the son was subject to the Father, which is why he could so such mighty works, any believer who chooses to do the works of God including similar works and greater works that Jesus did, must forego their own will and submit to the Father's will.

For instance, if we are to cast our devils, we must submit to God, James 4:7 is one verse that makes that plain. We first submit to God, He only is all wise and knows how to best spend our time. James 4:7 is not specifically about casting out devils but if we do not submit to God we will not have the power and character to successfully resist the devil sufficiently to cause him to flee.

Jesus Christ always did the Father's will, he did not do miracles, heal people, cast out devils, teach truth perfectly on a whim or randomly or because it felt good. He obeyed his Father, Philippians 2

Likewise, we must recognize that doing the same and greater works requires a similar level of commitment and obedience and submission to the Father's will as Jesus Christ as the son of God had to his Father and our Father.

For those who have so disciplined their lives to be faithful and obedient to God's word, ie, those who believe on him, shall do the same works and greater works.

Jesus Christ did not speak in tongues during his earthly ministry, he did not "pray in the spirit", that is one of the greater works that we can do.

If God told a believer to raise someone that had been dead for ten days, and that believer obeyed, then that ten day dead person would be raised to life. But that is God's prerogative, not ours.

We are not to be high minded or think out of bounds, we are to humble ourselves to do God's will if we are to live Christ like lives. Romans 12:1-3

Since you say you can do the same works as Jesus...

Tell me who you have raised from the dead after four days.

 

[God's Truth]

Are there pastors today?

Are there evangelists today?

Are there teachers today?

Then why not apostles and prophets?

That was during the laying of the foundation.

We only need God's words now and we all can find them.

 

[SimpleMan77]

Tongues have ceased.

You slander Paul when you speak for him.

Quote one verse saying that "tongues have ceased".
If you use 1 Cor 13:8 and say that has already been fulfilled, also address how knowledge has vanished away.


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[God's Truth]

Quote one verse saying that "tongues have ceased".
If you use 1 Cor 13:8 and say that has already been fulfilled, also address how knowledge has vanished away.


Sent from my iPhone using TOL

Aren't you paying attention to the people here you debate? I have already explained what you asked me to explain.

 

[SimpleMan77]

Rules Governing The Gift Of Tongues

Aren't you paying attention to the people here you debate? I have already explained what you asked me to explain.

Much of what you posted was true, but you never gave me a scripture to bridge between God using miracles to validate His word, and your statement that God no longer does that.
I'm asking you for one scripture that justifies that. It's not enough to say "God did that then" (which is historically and biblically correct), then to say "the foundation is complete, so God stopped doing miracles" (which is your interpretation, and is neither historically nor scripturally correct).

The Bible never says God used miracles and signs to validate the first revelation of His Word - it says he "confirmed His Word". Anywhere His Word is preached, He still can and does do miracles to confirm it.


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[God's Truth]

Much of what you posted was true, but you never gave me a scripture to bridge between God using miracles to validate His word, and your statement that God no longer does that.
I'm asking you for one scripture that justifies that. It's not enough to say "God did that then" (which is historically and biblically correct), then to say "the foundation is complete, so God stopped doing miracles" (which is your interpretation, and is neither historically nor scripturally correct).

The Bible never says God used miracles and signs to validate the first revelation of His Word - it says he "confirmed His Word". Anywhere His Word is preached, He still can and does do miracles to confirm it.


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God says He testified to what Jesus and the apostles said, He testified to it with signs and miracles.

It was testified to during the laying of the foundation.

The foundation has already been laid.

The message has already been testified to.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Are there pastors today?

Are there evangelists today?

Are there teachers today?

Then why not apostles and prophets?

Yes there are but GT does not need them.

She is truly a great person who needs nothing but her brain to work out that Paul was wasting his time giving instructions to the church on the use of tongues in the assembly.

1Co 14:34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law.
1Co 14:35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
1Co 14:36 What? came the word of God out from you? or came it unto you only?
1Co 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
1Co 14:38 But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.
1Co 14:39 Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.


Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:


LA

 

[God's Truth]

Yes there are but GT does not need them.

She is truly a great person who needs nothing but her brain to work out that Paul was wasting his time giving instructions to the church on the use of tongues in the assembly.

1Co 14:34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law.
1Co 14:35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
1Co 14:36 What? came the word of God out from you? or came it unto you only?
1Co 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
1Co 14:38 But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.
1Co 14:39 Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.


Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
LA

Do you know what an apostle is?

 

[oatmeal]

Since you say you can do the same works as Jesus...

Tell me who you have raised from the dead after four days.

Why didn't you understand what I posted?

Not only can I and any believer do the same works as Jesus Christ but I can do what Jesus Christ's believing predecessors did. Joshua had the sun and moon stop in the sky for about a day, Hezekiah had the sun dial move backwards ten degrees and slay a thousand of God's people's enemies with the jawbone of an ***.

Since Joshua had the sun and moon stop in the sky, why didn't Jesus Christ or Paul or Peter or Ananias do it?

Since Moses parted the Red Sea, why didn't Jesus Christ or Paul or Peter or Silas do it?

Why don't you raise some one from the dead? Why did Jesus raise Lazarus from the dead? Why not read what I posted in my previous post instead of asking what I already answered?

Is it the Father's will or your will that I raise someone that is four days dead?

If God wanted me to do that, He would be the one to tell me, your opinion on the matter is irrelevant.

Jesus was a prophet like unto Moses.

Why did Moses part the Red Sea?

Because God told him to.

Why did Moses lead the children of Israel out of Egypt?

Because God told him to.

Why did Moses do the ten plagues?

Because God told him to.

Why did Abraham leave his homeland?

Because God told him to

Why did Joseph believe that his family would bow to him?

Because God showed him that they would.

Why did Ananias go to minister healing to Saul of Tarsus?

Because God told him to

Why didn't Paul preach the word in Asia nor in Bithynia in Acts 16?

Because God told him not to.

Why did Paul go to Macedonia?

Because God showed him a vision of a man of Macedonia?

Who is it that I am supposed to obey?

You?

Or God?

I choose to believe and obey God.

 

[oatmeal]

That was during the laying of the foundation.

We only need God's words now and we all can find them.

You wouldn't know one God's ministers was talking to you face to face.

Why limit what God can do for you?

What God has done for believers in the past He is willing and able to do today.

 

[oatmeal]

Yes there are but GT does not need them.

She is truly a great person who needs nothing but her brain to work out that Paul was wasting his time giving instructions to the church on the use of tongues in the assembly.

1Co 14:34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law.
1Co 14:35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
1Co 14:36 What? came the word of God out from you? or came it unto you only?
1Co 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
1Co 14:38 But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.
1Co 14:39 Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.


Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:


LA

Those verses are as true and viable today as the day God had Paul write them down.

 

[SimpleMan77]

God says He testified to what Jesus and the apostles said, He testified to it with signs and miracles.

It was testified to during the laying of the foundation.

The foundation has already been laid.

The message has already been testified to.

I believe you are saying that the foundation is laid now that we have the written word of God.
What about missionaries to places where the Bible hasn't been translated into their language yet - can God not do signs and wonders there to confirm His word?


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[God's Truth]

I believe you are saying that the foundation is laid now that we have the written word of God.
What about missionaries to places where the Bible hasn't been translated into their language yet - can God not do signs and wonders there to confirm His word?


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Speaking in tongues were a sign to the Jews.

Jews were dispersed among many nations and they spoke the language of the nations they lived.

 

[God's Truth]

Why didn't you understand what I posted?

Not only can I and any believer do the same works as Jesus Christ but I can do what Jesus Christ's believing predecessors did. Joshua had the sun and moon stop in the sky for about a day, Hezekiah had the sun dial move backwards ten degrees and slay a thousand of God's people's enemies with the jawbone of an ***.

Since Joshua had the sun and moon stop in the sky, why didn't Jesus Christ or Paul or Peter or Ananias do it?

Since Moses parted the Red Sea, why didn't Jesus Christ or Paul or Peter or Silas do it?

Why don't you raise some one from the dead? Why did Jesus raise Lazarus from the dead? Why not read what I posted in my previous post instead of asking what I already answered?

Is it the Father's will or your will that I raise someone that is four days dead?

If God wanted me to do that, He would be the one to tell me, your opinion on the matter is irrelevant.

Jesus was a prophet like unto Moses.

Why did Moses part the Red Sea?

Because God told him to.

Why did Moses lead the children of Israel out of Egypt?

Because God told him to.

Why did Moses do the ten plagues?

Because God told him to.

Why did Abraham leave his homeland?

Because God told him to

Why did Joseph believe that his family would bow to him?

Because God showed him that they would.

Why did Ananias go to minister healing to Saul of Tarsus?

Because God told him to

Why didn't Paul preach the word in Asia nor in Bithynia in Acts 16?

Because God told him not to.

Why did Paul go to Macedonia?

Because God showed him a vision of a man of Macedonia?

Who is it that I am supposed to obey?

You?

Or God?

I choose to believe and obey God.

What don't you get that you are not doing any of that?

 

[SimpleMan77]

Rules Governing The Gift Of Tongues

Speaking in tongues were a sign to the Jews.

Jews were dispersed among many nations and they spoke the language of the nations they lived.

Only one time that was recorded the languages were understood as recognized languages. Only once.

What about edifying your spirit by praying in a language you don't know? 1 Cor 14:2 says that speaking in a tongue results in no man understanding. The Bible speaks of speaking in tongues of angels.

Don't confuse the tongues of Pentecost with other passages - passages that explicitly talk of tongues not understood by any man.


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[oatmeal]

What don't you get that you are not doing any of that?

Wow. Where did I claim that I am doing any of that?

What I did claim is that Jesus Christ said any believer, including me, can do it according to John 14:12

Why don't you believe what Jesus Christ said?

Did he lie or did he tell the truth?

He told the truth and I believe it.

 

[God's Truth]

Wow. Where did I claim that I am doing any of that?

What I did claim is that Jesus Christ said any believer, including me, can do it according to John 14:12

Why don't you believe what Jesus Christ said?

Did he lie or did he tell the truth?

He told the truth and I believe it.

You are playing games.

No one is doing those things but it was done in the New Testament times.

 

[God's Truth]

Only one time that was recorded the languages were understood as recognized languages. Only once.

In the Old Testament, we read this about tongues...

Isaiah 28:11 Very well then, with foreign lips

and strange tongues God will speak to this people,

12 to whom he said, "This is the resting place, let the weary rest";

and, "This is the place of repose"—

but they would not listen.


Now read what the New Testament says about tongues...


1 Corinthians 14:21 In the Law it is written:

"Through men of strange tongues

and through the lips of foreigners

I will speak to this people,

but even then they will not listen to me," says the Lord.

22Tongues, then, are a sign, not for believers but for unbelievers; prophecy, however, is for believers, not for unbelievers.


In Acts 2:5 we see that there were JEWS from EVERY NATION. The Jews are the people God said that He would speak to through men of strange tongues...

Acts 2:5 Now there were staying in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven.

In addition, in Acts 2:6 we see that the Jews from every nation spoke in many different languages...

Acts 2:6 When they heard this sound, a crowd came together in bewilderment, because each one heard them speaking in his own language.

Just look at the list of places the Jews had come from...

Acts 2:8-Then how is it that each of us hears them in his own native language? 9Parthians, Medes and Elamites; residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, 10Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya near Cyrene; visitors from Rome 11 (both Jews and converts to Judaism); Cretans and Arabs-we hear them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues!"

We can see from the scriptures that speaking in tongues was prophesied about in the Old Testament, that the Lord would speak to the Jews, as stated in Isaiah 28. In the New Testament, we can see that this is a fulfilled prophecy, as confirmed by Apostle Paul in 1 Corinthians 14:21. Since the biblical speaking in tongues were for a sign, and God gave the sign for the purpose as prophesied in the Old Testament, it would make sense to believe that speaking in tongues is a gift that would stop.

This scripture tells us that tongues “will be stilled”:

1 Corinthians 13:8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away.

Tongues did not stop during the time Jesus Christ, the Apostles and Prophets were laying down the foundation because the Apostles were still writing the scriptures. Imagine if tongues had stopped in the people who had the gift, others would erroneously believe that God also took salvation away from them, since the Jews believed God accepted Gentiles as was evident by their speaking in words of God in different languages.

However, tongues have since ceased. Jesus, the prophets and the apostles have laid the foundation; the Bible is finished. New prophecies and new knowledge have ceased also, just as the Bible says they would, for you know you cannot add new prophecies and new knowledge to the Bible.

 

[God's Truth]

=
What about edifying your spirit by praying in a language you don't know? 1 Cor 14:2 says that speaking in a tongue results in no man understanding. The Bible speaks of speaking in tongues of angels.

Calling the false tongue speaking a "prayer language" is from an error in understanding of the scriptures explaining speaking in tongues when no one is around who understands. It is important to realize that after the believers in the bible had the gift of speaking in tongues for the sign to the Jews...they kept the gift even when the Jews of other languages were not around. Therefore, the tongue speakers spoke only to God when they spoke in tongues they did not understand and when no Jews from other languages were there, because, God, of course, can understand all the earthly languages.

Again, if there were no one of other languages around to understand the tongue speaker, and if the tongue speaker themselves cannot interpret what they say, then they are speaking only to God, and this speaking edified (nurtures) only the tongue speakers themselves.

Tongue speaking edifies (nurtures) only the tongue speaker when no understands; they are edified in knowing that God gave them an amazing gift (the real tongues is an amazing gift). How edifying it is for oneself just to have a gift such as speaking in tongues; that alone is what edifies. It is a false edification when one is performing nonsense babbling.

Nowadays tongue speakers, while trying to copy cat the real tongue speaking as is in the Bible, they discount completely that if they do not interpret what they say, even when praying in tongues to God only...then their mind is fruitless. Surely, a fruitless mind is not something one should be aiming for in personal prayer times.