Republicans should let Mueller, Rosenstein finish the job

[The Barbarian]

From the Des Moines Register:

Justice and the pursuance of ultimate truth have long been key to the United States legal system. These principles are central to what makes America great: freedom, justice, and equality for all.

The current investigation into potential collusion with Russia during the 2016 election is necessary. Special Counsel Robert Mueller and Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein are upholding the processes of justice that have made this nation great for more than two centuries.

Firing either would undermine our country’s responsibility to uphold the rule of law, a responsibility that is fundamental to our heritage and strength as a country. The Russia investigation is also needed to ensure that one of our country’s longtime rivals has not infiltrated our most precious freedom: democracy through free elections.

The attacks on our institutions could harm the strength of our justice system for generations to come. Attacks by Republicans on an investigation introduced by Republicans, ran by Republicans, and overseen by Republicans seems bizarre. Mueller is one of the most highly regarded men in our nation’s legal system. Questioning his commitment to the cause of justice and the pursuit of truth with the ultimate result of firing him would go against everything the Republican Party has exemplified for nearly 50 years.

History has shown Republicans what happens when the pursuit of justice is interfered with. President Richard Nixon fired Archibald Cox, the special prosecutor investigating Watergate, in 1973 in an attempt to curb or end that investigation. That decision marked the imminent end of Nixon's presidency. An attempt to end the Mueller investigation would have the same disastrous outcome for President Trump.

The Republican Party on a national level has been known as the “Law-and-Order Party” for decades, but Iowa Republicans have also been known for transparency in government and clarity of purpose. Those staples for Iowa Republicans are being put to the test. Our institutions must be upheld. Iowa Republicans must hold our leaders accountable. An investigation into potential collusion with Russia should not create fear or be taken as an attack, but as the government being transparent with voters. We have the right to know what occurred during our free, democratic election.

Because of the need to uphold our time-honored tradition of justice and transparency, I am calling on all Iowans, including our representatives in D.C., to support Sen. Chuck Grassley’s efforts to protect Special Counsel Mueller and Deputy Attorney General Rosenstein. Let them finish the job.

We as a people and a party will be better knowing what happened and be reassured that transparency in government is secure.

 

[Rusha]

Unfortunately, that won't happen. Trump and everyone in the GOP do NOT want the American people to see the proof of his guilt. They seem to have this oddball idea that people actually believe his lies rather than *defend* his lies.

 

[Idolater]

What is their time table? Is there some estimated completion date? I'm just concerned that this project has been going on for so long, but maybe I'm just to used to projects that don't take so long. I'm wondering if they'll be done even by the 2020 election.

 

[rexlunae]

What is their time table? Is there some estimated completion date?

That's not how investigations work. You investigate until you've looked everywhere that you have to look, and then you proceed to whatever is appropriate.

I'm just concerned that this project has been going on for so long, but maybe I'm just to used to projects that don't take so long.

Ken Starr investigated Bill Clinton for 4+ years. Issued a report with 11 possible grounds for impeachment, none of it related to his duties as president, and the House impeached. He was acquitted.

Watergate went on for 2 years, Nixon resigned when it became obvious he would be impeached.

Trey Gowdy spent 2 years investigating Benghazi, for transparently partisan reasons, found absolutely nothing.

We're a little past the one-year mark for Mueller, with 19 indictments, several guilty pleas, and obvious important work ahead of it. It's been incredibly fast. Republicans are demanding timetables because they know they're in trouble if the investigation is allowed to complete.

I'm wondering if they'll be done even by the 2020 election.

They'll be done when they're done. Mueller's mandate is to investigate an attack on our election by a hostile foreign power and any Americans who might have aided it. It speaks to our nation's ability to govern itself, and our ability to choose our leaders. It deserves as much time and as many resources as it needs.

Not only are Trump's efforts to shut the probe down obvious signs of consciousness of guilt, but his whole party is behaving as if they are just as culpable. If they've got nothing to fear, they should let it be, and let it run its course. Can you explain why they see such a need to mess with it if they are innocent?

 

[Foxfire]

What is their time table? Is there some estimated completion date? I'm just concerned that this project has been going on for so long, but maybe I'm just to used to projects that don't take so long. I'm wondering if they'll be done even by the 2020 election.

Compared to either the Bengazzzzzzi or $hillery's E-mail investigations, the Mueller investigation is going at breakneck speed; it also dwarfs both of the former in indictments, guilty pleas and convictions, to put it mildly.

I can certainly understand the sense of anxiety and foreboding from the right though.

 

[Foxfire]

They need to keep the Mueller investigation going at least until they run out of convictions, and that's gonna take a while.

:chuckle:

 

[Idolater]

...the Mueller investigation is going at breakneck speed...

That's good news, and a possibility for which I allowed.

I can certainly understand the sense of anxiety and foreboding from the right though.

I don't know what you're talking about.

 

[Idolater]

That's not how investigations work. You investigate until you've looked everywhere that you have to look, and then you proceed to whatever is appropriate.



Ken Starr investigated Bill Clinton for 4+ years. Issued a report with 11 possible grounds for impeachment, none of it related to his duties as president, and the House impeached. He was acquitted.

Watergate went on for 2 years, Nixon resigned when it became obvious he would be impeached.

Trey Gowdy spent 2 years investigating Benghazi, for transparently partisan reasons, found absolutely nothing.

We're a little past the one-year mark for Mueller, with 19 indictments, several guilty pleas

Thank you for the context, providing better perspective.

, and obvious important work ahead of it.

What obvious important work?

It's been incredibly fast.

That's good news.

Republicans are demanding timetables because they know they're in trouble if the investigation is allowed to complete.

I don't know about that. I myself was asking for a timetable, not demanding one, and you've done a good job putting this investigation into context.

They'll be done when they're done. Mueller's mandate is to investigate an attack on our election by a hostile foreign power and any Americans who might have aided it. It speaks to our nation's ability to govern itself, and our ability to choose our leaders. It deserves as much time and as many resources as it needs.

Not only are Trump's efforts to shut the probe down obvious signs of consciousness of guilt, but his whole party is behaving as if they are just as culpable. If they've got nothing to fear, they should let it be, and let it run its course. Can you explain why they see such a need to mess with it if they are innocent?

Because it might be a witch hunt. That all sounds noble and wonderful, but it still might just be a witch hunt.

 

[Foxfire]

I don't know what you're talking about.

Not really surprising, so just settle back and enjoy the ride. :chuckle:

 

[ok doser]

I can certainly understand the sense of anxiety and foreboding from the right though.

Me too


If there was any in evidence, that is

 

[Idolater]

Not really surprising, so just settle back and enjoy the ride. :chuckle:

lain: Ha.

 

[annabenedetti]

 

[annabenedetti]

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Strozk already spilled the beans when he said that there is no big there there!

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Special Counsel Robert Mueller and Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein are upholding the processes of justice that have made this nation great for more than two centuries.

If Mueller cared about justice he would have recused himself from the beginning because of his close friendship with Comey!

Anyone who thinks that this witch hunt is about justice doesn't know the meaning of the word justice.

This is about TREASON!

 

[Foxfire]

This is about TREASON!

:think:

 

[rexlunae]

What obvious important work?

They have 20 open indictments, the most prominent currently underway being the Manafort indictments. There are a number of others who seem likely to be indicted before this is done. There are prosecutions to run. A separate investigation is going through documents numbering in the millions from the raid on Michael Cohen, and some of those might be kicked back to the Mueller Russia investigation. And at the end of the day, they have to issue a report, fulfilling their core mandate.

Some have complained that Manafort is only being prosecuted to get to Trump. That may be true, but it's also true that Manafort is a huge land of his own accord. He's a guy whose spent his life helping dictators rob their countries and get away with it. That's his career. Taking him down, all by itself, regardless of Trump, would be huge, and well worth our efforts. But think what it says that this is a guy Trump hired to run his campaign.

I don't know about that. I myself was asking for a timetable, not demanding one, and you've done a good job putting this investigation into context.

Thanks.

Because it might be a witch hunt. That all sounds noble and wonderful, but it still might just be a witch hunt.

I'm quite certain that it's not. There are just so many odd coincidences that can't be easily accounted for otherwise, too many clear indications of cooperation, and honestly, too little evidence of misconduct by prosecutors. So far, the Republicans have turned up one text that looks pretty bad from one guy...who Mueller fired from his investigation.

I think a lot of Americans are so unaccustomed to processing attacks on our own country that pose an existential threat that they just have a hard time accepting what has happened to us. And some of the main sources of information have turned into outright collaborating disinformation sources. Fox News, in its prime-time programming, is akin to a Soviet propaganda outfit run by the politburo, and they play to the biases of conservatives against liberals to keep them in the Trump camp.

What we're facing is no less than the demolition of democracy worldwide by Russia and its agents. We might really have had our last free and fair election. Most conspiracies theories are false, but this sure seems to be a real live conspiracy run by the Russians to unite the conservative parties of Europe and the US as subordinate organs of their government. In some cases, they've been quite explicit about that agenda.

If you'd like to go over some of this evidence, I'm game. I'm leaving it off now for the sake of brevity, but there's lots.

 

[Idolater]

Spoiler

They have 20 open indictments, the most prominent currently underway being the Manafort indictments. There are a number of others who seem likely to be indicted before this is done. There are prosecutions to run. A separate investigation is going through documents numbering in the millions from the raid on Michael Cohen, and some of those might be kicked back to the Mueller Russia investigation. And at the end of the day, they have to issue a report, fulfilling their core mandate.

Some have complained that Manafort is only being prosecuted to get to Trump. That may be true, but it's also true that Manafort is a huge land of his own accord. He's a guy whose spent his life helping dictators rob their countries and get away with it. That's his career. Taking him down, all by itself, regardless of Trump, would be huge, and well worth our efforts. But think what it says that this is a guy Trump hired to run his campaign.



Thanks.



I'm quite certain that it's not. There are just so many odd coincidences that can't be easily accounted for otherwise, too many clear indications of cooperation, and honestly, too little evidence of misconduct by prosecutors. So far, the Republicans have turned up one text that looks pretty bad from one guy...who Mueller fired from his investigation.

I think a lot of Americans are so unaccustomed to processing attacks on our own country that pose an existential threat that they just have a hard time accepting what has happened to us. And some of the main sources of information have turned into outright collaborating disinformation sources. Fox News, in its prime-time programming, is akin to a Soviet propaganda outfit run by the politburo, and they play to the biases of conservatives against liberals to keep them in the Trump camp.

What we're facing is no less than the demolition of democracy worldwide by Russia and its agents. We might really have had our last free and fair election. Most conspiracies theories are false, but this sure seems to be a real live conspiracy run by the Russians to unite the conservative parties of Europe and the US as subordinate organs of their government. In some cases, they've been quite explicit about that agenda.

If you'd like to go over some of this evidence, I'm game. I'm leaving it off now for the sake of brevity, but there's lots.

If you could give me a handful of quality links? that would be worthwhile taking a look at. It's good to get plain language about the matter, and this is plain language. And thanks again.

 

[rexlunae]

If you could give me a handful of quality links? that would be worthwhile taking a look at. It's good to get plain language about the matter, and this is plain language. And thanks again.

This might be a good place to start:

https://www.vox.com/2018/6/11/17438386/trump-russia-collusion

It's a little old, but there's a lot in it.

 

[Idolater]

This might be a good place to start:

https://www.vox.com/2018/6/11/17438386/trump-russia-collusion

It's a little old, but there's a lot in it.

Where is the best source for following up directly on this following sentence, which grabbed my interest right away when I first read it: You wrote that Russia is trying to "unite the conservative parties of Europe and the US as subordinate organs of their government"---where can I learn more about that plan? That is interesting. :think: