Do you believe the eyewitnesses who claim they saw the Lord Jesus ascend from the Mount of Olives into the clouds and were told that same Jesus would return in the same way that He left?
Rapture Ready
- Thread starter serpentdove
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Do you believe the eyewitnesses who claim they saw the Lord Jesus ascend from the Mount of Olives into the clouds and were told that same Jesus would return in the same way that He left?
dontaskmeidontknow
New member
it seems when He returned it was not as they said, He appeared on beaches and out of thin air. so the scriptures say.
my point is this, do you think the devil is in the core of the earth,and Jesus up in the clouds?
my point is this, do you think the devil is in the core of the earth,and Jesus up in the clouds?
Calvinism is just another word for "Counterfeit."
His appearances were between His resurrection and His ascension.
He hasn't returned to earth since His ascension from the Mount of Olives....yet.
No, I don't believe that the devil is in the core of the earth and I don't find that the Bible claims that he is.
The Lord Jesus went up according to the eyewitnesses and as He went up the clouds obscured their sight of Him. The account doesn't state that He remained in the clouds.
Interplanner
Well-known member
Other descriptions of the return are quite a bit different, so I'm not sure why the comparison was made to movement to/through the clouds, if that is what he meant.
perserverance
No, it is not. Again,it is a subtil(Genesis 3:1 KJV) form of works-based "salvation," as the Calvinist must look to/examine his/her works, for assurance that they are one of "the elect," not looking to the book for confirmation/assurance, i.e., I am saved, because my lifestyle tells me so.
Works are a part of faith, Calvin just took away the the Roman legality of it- having to look and act the part, or constantly keeping count of one's sins and works.
But those as yourself take it too far. It's that simple, really- except that where you perpetuate 'easy belivism', you oddly become a pompous Roman when attempting to be an example of a Christian
lain:Everything about your brand of Christianity is a conundrum. A rapture doesn't sit well within it even if there were such a thing- a rapture would require a predestined elect, otherwise it would be arbitrary. But you all don't see past your own noses to pick up on things like rapture theory originating from predestinarians
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
When do think that the saints will be "caught up" to meet the Lord Jesus in the air?:
"For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord" (1 Thess.4:16-17).
Interplanner
Well-known member
'so shall we ever be...' so much for a Davidic theocracy, or else its full of non-christians.
TULIP
Perserverance
No, it is really simple as your easy workism, over which you salivate.
Again...
Those that rightly divide the word of truth, understand "election," as pertaining to service, and separate eternal security from "predestination."
Breaking it down-"It's not that complicated"(STP):
In order for a Calvinist to "believe" he was predestined, he/she must believe he/she is saved. With me so far, sheep being conned by the Calvinists?
In order to believe he/she is "saved," he must be convinced that his/her "life style" meets the standard(just like "charismatics" like andycain). Still with me?
When his/her life style falls below a certain standard, say, he/she relapses on booze, on hookers/pimps, pot, or stops going to his/her "the" church, he/she loses that "feeling."
You know the feeling. "I know I'm saved, because my life style tells me so..."
Since I have fallen into the pit/ditch, I must not be saved. Since I am not saved, I must not be "predestinated," to get saved. I thought I was saved, but, it turns out, I was never saved. I was deceived into believing I was saved, when in fact.....
This is the Calvinist "logic." This is their material, not mine.
No, you can't get assurance, if you are looking at your behaviour as a barometer of how "saved" you are. This is what Calvinists do, despite any spin to the contrary. And most "Christians" do this, and therefore, most cannot get assurance of salvation.
That is their "good news."
Yeh, Calvinists believe in the "doctrine" of OSAS-but they believe that they were saved before they were born. But "assurance of salvation", confidence, that comes from within, is not "eternal security." .Many "churches" hold to the doctrine of "salvation." Does that mean that their church members are saved? Nope. Professing to believe a "doctrine" is one thing. But having an inner confidence, based on "assurance," is something else. I "believe" in eternal security. But I also have assurance of salvation. And nobody has that, unless they believe Eph. 2:8-9 KJV, and Titus 3:5 KJV, as well as John 17:17 KJV, Psalms 12, 19, 119, 1 Peter 1:25 KJV....
Very few "Christians" fall into this category. Most would know that, had you asked them, instead of logging into the Calvinist sites, and losing your mind.
Everything about your brand of Christianity is a conundrum. A rapture doesn't sit well within it even if there were such a thing- a rapture would require a predestined elect, otherwise it would be arbitrary. But you all don't see past your own noses to pick up on things like rapture theory originating from predestinarians
And your concept of "predestination" is satanic-no scripture teaches your devilish doctrine, of predestinated to being saved, elected to be saved -your daddy devil taught it to you.
Rapture theory, you muse, deviled one? Stumped us there.
And, being lost, you have no idea re. my "brand of Christianity," due to that 2 Cor. 4:4 KJV, 1 Cor. 2:14 KJV, problem of yours.
Get saved, wicked Clavinist/Calvinist drone.
And stuff your Romanism charge, devilish drone, as that is you-Calvinism is a clone of Roman Catholicism. I know more about Romanism, being a former one, than you ever will know, and my knowledge of satanic Calvinism makes you look like Dora The Explorer, in comparison.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Of course you refuse to believe that those who will be caught up with the Lord in the air will be with Him when He returns to the earth to sit upon His throne:
"When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory" (Mt.25:31).
And these same saints will be with Him when the following will happen:
"Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth" (Jer.23:5).
Since you have somehow been able to trick your mind into believing none of these things will ever happen then you cannot believe that those saints who will be "caught up" will be with the Lord Jesus when He returns to the earth.
musterion
Well-known member
aka the false gospel of Lordship Salvation, sho nuff.
Not really- that's something anti-Calvinists presume out of prejudice.
I don't believe anyone 'knows' anything- that's why faith is so much more convicting than 'knowing'. We can leave it on you to act as though your faith is more than faith
lain: To break it down for you, I can reference a quote: One is not saved because they believe in Christ, they believe in Christ because they are saved.
That's predestination in a nutshell, Broseph. The entire Reformation.
You should marinate on that :thumb:
God is obviously not going to destroy the world with His own people in it.
At the final moment, when this Earth is purged, God will protect His people from His wrath.
It's as simple as that- that passage you hang onto is not an evidence of your rapture
lain:Interplanner
Well-known member
God is obviously not going to destroy the world with His own people in it.
At the final moment, when this Earth is purged, God will protect His people from His wrath.
It's as simple as that- that passage you hang onto is not an evidence of your rapture
Yep, Rev 20 has the believers protected from the little period of rebellion and the earth destroyed in quick succession.
Right Divider
Body part
You used to write so frequently about the NHNE. What happened to that?
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
When we contrast the NHNE event with the lighted camel of Gen 24E, and superimpose the unimposable upon on Mt 24C, we are left with nothing more than red dirt prophecies which will remain unfulfilled. We must, therefore, look forward to the crowning jewel of promises, and overreach for 2 Cor 3T while never forgetting Eph 3B.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
So when do you say the earth will be purged?
Are these words in "bold" referring to the time when the saints will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air?:
"For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left" (Mt.24:38-41).
Thanks!
Interplanner
Well-known member
God will judge the earth and save his people in one quick motion, aka, blink of an eye. Rev 20.
btw, the 'taken' in that Mt 24 passage is horrible. The flood TOOK them away. The ones who stayed were saved.
Reveal Key To Going In The Rapture Pt. 1 1 Thess. 4:15, 17