Question for Liberals

[Buzzword]

Why don't we start with marriage equality. What does that mean to you?

That any two consenting adults have the right to enter into a marriage contract, with all of the rights and responsibilities it entails, including life insurance, employee health insurance, power of attorney, DNR, etc etc.

Next, getting money out of politics. Are we talking about Warren Buffett's, Bill Gates', Nancy Pelosi's, Service Employee's Union, ActBlue, NEA, FARH LLC, etc. money, or do you have someone else in mind?

That's a good start.
Funding should never have become the deciding factor for who can run for office in this country.
We've spent many generations telling kids that "anyone can be president," but the current massive, convoluted system of money-funneling makes that a gigantic lie.

"Campaign contributions" and the buying power of the 1% now decide that only the already-wealthy can run for any office above the municipal level, which creates a self-defeating election for the rest of us no matter who wins.

In British terms, all we have are two Houses of Lords in Congress, who have set up a system in which only their financial peers even have a chance of getting in the door.

We have forced health care now.

Have to chime in here, because I addressed it in my initial post.
We have forced health INSURANCE right now, which means we are forced into a bureaucratic system of deductibles, copays, and other monies being thrown around that in no way solves the problems we already had, and creates many more.
What we need in order to join the rest of the civilized world is forced government health CARE.
That means nationalized health and pharmaceutical industries, whose services are offered free of charge to citizens in need because they are government employees paid by taxes.

 

[Mocking You]

Not everyone wishes to contribute to National Defense. Why can't *they* decide for themselves what they wish to contribute to?

You'd have to move to another country. The preamble to the US Constitution:

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

And Article 1, sec. 8

The Congress shall have power

To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

This link should get you a head start:

https://www.constituteproject.org/search?lang=en

Just find a nation that does not have it written right in the constitution that the government has the power to tax to provide for defense.

 

[Rusha]

Simple answer. If you don't believe this country should have a national defense you don't believe in this country at all and should move elsewhere or accept being labeled as a traitor.

:chuckle: No ... that is the "you either agree with me or don't belong here!" answer!

Typical.

Newsflash: Some of us can still support those in the military with out disregarding the elderly and poor.

However, feel free to follow your own advice and leave.

 

[This Charming Manc]

The monarchy is over played, it is historic we are liberal capitalist democracy just like the states.

The big differences in implementation are size and your constitution, which restricts parameters for change to both the good and ill.

I am so sorry Charming Manc. I love you. No, really I do.

But Rusha is over here and needs my help, or rather is going to get my attempt, anyway.

Rusha, you can agree with him because it all sounds good but what have I been trying to say?
That anything contrary to human nature is NOT (repeat NOT) something you get by being or voting or claiming "Liberal."

Pres Clinton and his wife are loved dearly and supported by many, why?
Because they are absolute Democratic leaders staunchly showing the "Believe what I say and not what I do" position. There is nothing sweeter. Who needs reality when you can have that?

Please remember TCM is actually living in a country that politically does things like "control" and tries to "balance" as well as "accepting"
and provide "equality."

Strangely he has Socialism under a Monarchy...
How do they do that?
I don't know but it is something they are making work.

Could we? I don't think you could stand either of them. (And I love you)

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

That any two consenting adults have the right to enter into a marriage contract, with all of the rights and responsibilities it entails, including life insurance, employee health insurance, power of attorney, DNR, etc etc.

So you'd be against poligamy, and marriage with animals. How about the age when one becomes an adult? Who decides that?

That's a good start.

Funding should never have become the deciding factor for who can run for office in this country. We've spent many generations telling kids that "anyone can be president," but the current massive, convoluted system of money-funneling makes that a gigantic lie.

"Campaign contributions" and the buying power of the 1% now decide that only the already-wealthy can run for any office above the municipal level, which creates a self-defeating election for the rest of us no matter who wins.

In British terms, all we have are two Houses of Lords in Congress, who have set up a system in which only their financial peers even have a chance of getting in the door.

Have to chime in here, because I addressed it in my initial post.
We have forced health INSURANCE right now, which means we are forced into a bureaucratic system of deductibles, copays, and other monies being thrown around that in no way solves the problems we already had, and creates many more.

What we need in order to join the rest of the civilized world is forced government health CARE.

That means nationalized health and pharmaceutical industries, whose services are offered free of charge to citizens in need because they are government employees paid by taxes.

The problem is we are talking about more than the 1% (I'm guessing you mean the top 1% wage earners.) But here's a list of the top donors:

https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php

Care to comment?

 

[Rusha]

You'd have to move to another country. The preamble to the US Constitution

Personally, I have no problem supporting the military. I also have no problem paying into a system that actually shows compassion for their fellow human being. I am not moving anywhere ... and will continue to support those who don't see our country as nothing more than a combat zone.

My rights and citizenship are protected every bit as much as yours.

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

:chuckle: No ... that is the "you either agree with me or don't belong here!" answer!

Typical.

Newsflash: Some of us can still support those in the military with out disregarding the elderly and poor.

However, feel free to follow your own advice and leave.

The elderly and the poor were being cared for without government assistance before the government butted in. People cared for people on a personal level. They did not need the government to be the "middleman". We don't need and cannot afford the government we have now, no matter how well intentioned you believe it might be. That's the bottom line.

 

[Rusha]

The elderly and the poor were being cared for without government assistance before the government butted in

Right ... there is no more cost after burial. Not everyone gets sick because they do not take care of themselves, however, a catastrophic illness can wipe out the earnings of someone who has worked and saved all their life.

The option is do not seek treatment and possibly die OR go to the emergency room, be admitted and be prepared to lose everything you worked your whole life for.

 

[rainee]

The monarchy is over played, it is historic we are liberal capitalist democracy just like the states.

The big differences in implementation are size and your constitution, which restricts parameters for change to both the good and ill.

Beloved,
You are the Brits.
Somehow you are capitalist socialist democratic monarchists. (And that includes knighting people and such)

No one could be what you are - but maybe no one could be what we are
either. Neither is perfect. But both are changeable to a certain degree - unlike some of the bad ones.

I'd be willing to give y'all back all the Middle East you had before. That is how good you were/are.

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

Right ... there is no more cost after burial.

Do you expect the same level of care, at the same cost as Warren Buffett or Bill Gates?

 

[Rusha]

Medical treatment is too costly for everyone which leaves the person with a choice of: IF the bill is too high, lose everything you own OR hope your appendix will heal itself.

 

[Rusha]

Do you expect the same level of care, at the same cost as Warren Buffett or Bill Gates?

No, obviously most people can't buy a hospital and have them on them on speed dial. Emergency room is not a realistic option.

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

Medical treatment is too costly for everyone which leaves the person with a choice of: IF the bill is too high, lose everything you own OR hope your appendix will heal itself.

I'm about $50K+ in debt because of health care costs for my wife and myself -- and I have very good insurance. We (my wife, three dogs and I) cut costs elsewhere, but it's not enough. I still don't want national health care because everything the government touches they screw-up and it leads to fraud.

 

[Rusha]

I'm about $50K+ in debt because of health care costs for my wife and myself -- and I have very good insurance. We (my wife, three dogs and I) cut costs elsewhere, but it's not enough. I still don't want national health care because everything the government touches they screw-up and it leads to fraud.

I completely understand the misgivings, however, that doesn't mean there isn't a way to do it right. Currently, it's not being done right. The best experience I have had with medical coverage was while I lived in California and utilized Kaiser or other HMO plans.

Which is yet another reason I need to move back to Cali.

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

I completely understand the misgivings, however, that doesn't mean there isn't a way to do it right. Currently, it's not being done right. The best experience I have had with medical coverage was while I lived in California and utilized Kaiser or other HMO plans.

Which is yet another reason I need to move back to Cali.

When I lived and worked in California, I did not have insurance. I went to a clinic once for a rash that turned out to be psoriasis. When I needed stitches for being hurt on the job, I was covered by workmans comp.

 

[Rusha]

When I lived and worked in California, I did not have insurance. I went to a clinic once for a rash that turned out to be psoriasis. When I needed stitches for being hurt on the job, I was covered by workmans comp.

I didn't go to the doctor so much for myself, but with three children, it was a necessity. Between my oldest daughter spending her first two weeks on life support (she was premature) and my son's sports related injuries and all those little things in between, I was lucky that my insurance paid a good portion of the bills.

Of course, I also worked for Blue Shield and had either no deductible or only 100 per person for a very low premium. My ex-husband had Kaiser. Back then, insurance was semi-affordable.

 

[TracerBullet]

The prime purpose of government is a National Defense. Why can't I decide for myself what else I want to contribute to?

Why do we spend more on our national defense than the next ten countries spend on theirs combined?

 

[TracerBullet]

So you'd be against poligamy, and marriage with animals. How about the age when one becomes an adult? Who decides that?

show me an animal that can legally consent to be married and then we can talk about it.

 

[TracerBullet]

The elderly and the poor were being cared for without government assistance before the government butted in.

Where was this?

We don't need and cannot afford the government we have now, no matter how well intentioned you believe it might be. That's the bottom line.

that is why we need to reign in military spending, return to taxing the mega wealthy, and penalizing companies that move their production and administration overseas.

 

[TracerBullet]

Do you expect the same level of care, at the same cost as Warren Buffett or Bill Gates?

why shouldn't people have the same level of medical care available?