Police Behavior Irrelevant to Black Rage

[gcthomas]

First you blame everyone outside the culture that produces these degenerates.

Then you claim the degenerates are not at fault and can't change how they are.

Next you will be telling us that the cause of their antisocial behavior is genetic.

Nope. You are reading into this more than I have written. There are two levels of responsibility here, and you are conflating them.

First, the individual, who should be held responsible for their actions with regard to mitigating factors. (someone with no access to medicines stealing from a pharmacy to keep their partner alive, versus someone robbing a shop to upgrade their TV for free). Arrest, prosecute and punish when appropriate.

Second, the societal arrangements. Many more people are drawn into criminality when there is little economic hope and the authorities all seem arranged to keep them down.

The first level is simple criminality.

The second is the natural result of multi-generational economic disparities and the allowing of underclass monoculture to be the only role model for disaffected youth with no jobs or future. It is this one that the economically and politically powerful groups have a responsibility to manage.

What I saying was that if you fail to deal with politically difficult but urgent issues like these, then you should shoulder some of the blame for the riots that will inevitably happen when the spark finds the tinder box.

The difference is that of proximate versus ultimate causes.

 

[bybee]

Nope. You are reading into this more than I have written. There are two levels of responsibility here, and you are conflating them.

First, the individual, who should be held responsible for their actions with regard to mitigating factors. (someone with no access to medicines stealing from a pharmacy to keep their partner alive, versus someone robbing a shop to upgrade their TV for free). Arrest, prosecute and punish when appropriate.

Second, the societal arrangements. Many more people are drawn into criminality when there is little economic hope and the authorities all seem arranged to keep them down.

The first level is simple criminality.

The second is the natural result of multi-generational economic disparities and the allowing of underclass monoculture to be the only role model for disaffected youth with no jobs or future. It is this one that the economically and politically powerful groups have a responsibility to manage.

What I saying was that if you fail to deal with politically difficult but urgent issues like these, then you should shoulder some of the blame for the riots that will inevitably happen when the spark finds the tinder box.

The difference is that of proximate versus ultimate causes.

You are still making excuses for criminal behavior.
You are still allowing people to define themselves as victims.
Nothing good comes from either.

 

[Granite]

You are still making excuses for criminal behavior.
You are still allowing people to define themselves as victims.
Nothing good comes from either.

Are victims not allowed to define themselves as such?

 

[bybee]

First you blame everyone outside the culture that produces these degenerates.

Then you claim the degenerates are not at fault and can't change how they are.

Next you will be telling us that the cause of their antisocial behavior is genetic.

Indeed! And that kind of thinking is insulting and a slap in the face to poor people everywhere who work hard, obey the law and train their children for a better life.

 

[bybee]

Are victims not allowed to define themselves as such?

One is free to define oneself as a Jackass, should one wish to do so....

 

[Granite]

One is free to define oneself as a Jackass, should one wish to do so....

Answer the question. Are victims not allowed to define themselves as victims?

 

[bybee]

Uh, no, not really. At least, not always. Often they answer to their chief who may answer to a police board and or commissioner. Depends on the town. And keep in mind mayors are loathe to antagonize police departments and city prosecutors...



Uh, okay? All I did were ask some questions to clarify what you meant. You decided to go into hysterics instead. Maybe switch to decaf, sweetheart.



Agreed. And nothing's going to happen to the punk bully who killed Eric Garner, so, obviously something needs to give.



So you're in favor of civilian oversight. Great. Answer me this: Why do so many police departments oppose it?

You have the manners of a clot!
When you take your blinders off and look at the big picture I may take you seriously.
For now, I find that you behave like a gonadal, opinionated ape, a one note wonder!

 

[gcthomas]

You are still making excuses for criminal behavior.
You are still allowing people to define themselves as victims.
Nothing good comes from either.

If you read what I wrote (and I suspect you didn't) I said that individual criminals should be arrested, prosecuted and punished for their crimes.

But I also said that those with the power to change the socio-economic arrangements that predictably produce mob behaviour and riots should also look in the mirror for setting up the underlying factors that encourage this sort of thing.

'Proximate versus ultimate causes' is what I wrote and what you ignored.

 

[Granite]

You have the manners of a clot!
When you take your blinders off and look at the big picture I may take you seriously.
For now, I find that you behave like a gonadal, opinionated ape, a one note wonder!

Well, you're in a very, very bizarre mood today. I asked simple questions in an attempt to have a discussion and you've gone completely berserk.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Nope. You are reading into this more than I have written.

Not at all.

First, the individual, who should be held responsible for their actions with regard to mitigating factors. (someone with no access to medicines stealing from a pharmacy to keep their partner alive, versus someone robbing a shop to upgrade their TV for free).

I see you are saying stealing is good if you think your partner can benefit from it.

Second, the societal arrangements. Many more people are drawn into criminality when there is little economic hope and the authorities all seem arranged to keep them down.

More liberal lies spoken to justify robbing a shop to upgrade your TV for free.

What I saying was that if you fail to deal with politically difficult but urgent issues like these, then you should shoulder some of the blame for the riots that will inevitably happen when the spark finds the tinder box.

Typical liberal lies.
The Islamic Jihadists might get mad and start killing people, so America is at fault.
The blacks are so unstable that they might get mad and start rioting, so the police are at fault.

What ever happened to personal responsibility and social behavior instead of blaming everyone else for your antisocial behavior?

 

[genuineoriginal]

Answer the question. Are victims not allowed to define themselves as victims?

I think you meant to ask, "Are criminals not allowed to define themselves as victims?"

Yes, criminals are allowed to define themselves as victims, but the truth is that they are criminals and the real victims are the ones they are hurting.

 

[Granite]

I think you meant to ask, "Are criminals not allowed to define themselves as victims?"

Yes, criminals are allowed to define themselves as victims, but the truth is that they are criminals and the real victims are the ones they are hurting.

Is this true in every case? Maybe a better question would be what you think of the so-called war on drugs.

And no, I meant exactly what I asked. Are victims not allowed to define themselves as such?

 

[genuineoriginal]

I also said that those with the power to change the socio-economic arrangements that predictably produce mob behaviour and riots should also look in the mirror for setting up the underlying factors that encourage this sort of thing.

Jessie Jackson, Al Sharpton, CNN, MSNBC, etc. are the people that produce the mob behaviour and riots.

Start attacking their race baiting and liberal philosophies, since those are the real reasons the communities you are defending are stuck where they are.

 

[gcthomas]

Typical liberal lies.
The Islamic Jihadists might get mad and start killing people, so America is at fault.
The blacks are so unstable that they might get mad and start rioting, so the police are at fault.

What ever happened to personal responsibility and social behavior instead of blaming everyone else for your antisocial behavior?

Unless you are a complete idiot, you will have read THAT I THINK THAT RIOTING CRIMINALS NEED LOCKING UP.

Sheesh. You are so keen to criticise you neglect to consider what I actually said about it.

I see you are saying stealing is good if you think your partner can benefit from it.

Really? That is how you see it? The issue of this sort of theft is used in junior high school classes so you can spot when children grow up from the "it's stealing so it's wrong" and start with the 'shades of grey' mature thought processes.

You have just failed a moral-reasoning test for 12 year olds.

More liberal lies spoken to justify robbing a shop to upgrade your TV for free.

Hmm. I implied strongly that this would never be acceptable, in contrast to the medicines one. Can't you read?

 

[genuineoriginal]

Maybe a better question would be what you think of the so-called war on drugs

Prohibition led to the rise of the Chicago gangsters.
The new prohibition, "war on drugs", has led to the rise of more gangstas.

Either our government failed to learn from history, or it was done intentionally.

Which would you prefer, an incompetent government that destroys its own citizens by its own incompetence, or an evil government that destroys its own citizens through deliberate malice?

 

[Granite]

Prohibition led to the rise of the Chicago gangsters.

Yes, I'm well aware.

The new prohibition, "war on drugs", has led to the rise of more gangstas.

"Criminals" works just fine, thanks. But yes, we agree.

Either our government failed to learn from history, or it was done intentionally.

:noid:

Which would you prefer, an incompetent government that destroys its own citizens by its own incompetence, or an evil government that destroys its own citizens through deliberate malice?

Well you may be unclear where I'm coming from. I oppose the drug war and consider it a farce, at best. But then there's this:

"Yes, criminals are allowed to define themselves as victims, but the truth is that they are criminals and the real victims are the ones they are hurting."

I consider the vast majority of Americans rotting in our prisons thanks to this inane "war on drugs" to very much be victims.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Really? That is how you see it? The issue of this sort of theft is used in junior high school classes so you can spot when children grow up from the "it's stealing so it's wrong" and start with the 'shades of grey' mature thought processes.

You have just failed a moral-reasoning test for 12 year olds.

Actually I passed the moral-reasoning test, as defined by the Bible.
You, and your liberal cronies that are desensitizing children and teaching them that immoral behaviour is acceptable, are the ones that failed.
:loser:

 

[gcthomas]

Prohibition led to the rise of the Chicago gangsters.
The new prohibition, "war on drugs", has led to the rise of more gangstas.

Either our government failed to learn from history, or it was done intentionally.

You liberals, always finding excuses for the gangsters. "It wasn't their fault, it was the gubmint banning the drugs. Whaaa :baby:" Get a grip, the gangsters should be locked up. It is their own fault etc etc.

 

[bybee]

Yes, I'm well aware.



"Criminals" works just fine, thanks. But yes, we agree.



:noid:



Well you may be unclear where I'm coming from. I oppose the drug war and consider it a farce, at best. But then there's this:

"Yes, criminals are allowed to define themselves as victims, but the truth is that they are criminals and the real victims are the ones they are hurting."

I consider the vast majority of Americans rotting in our prisons thanks to this inane "war on drugs" to very much be victims.

Guess what? I agree! People guilty of trivial abuses of the law being locked up is a travesty.
But, oh my! We must pay those taxes!

 

[genuineoriginal]

You liberals, always finding excuses for the gangsters. "It wasn't their fault, it was the gubmint banning the drugs. Whaaa :baby:" Get a grip, the gangsters should be locked up. It is their own fault etc etc.

Are you starting to reconsider your previous statement where you said, "It is a wonder how you can be surprised when you bottle up blacks in underresourced no-hope ghettos and have white cops shooting kids that you get a little kickback every now and again"?