OK Supreme Court: 10 Commandments must come down

[Buzzword]

I do not have a problem with scrupulous separation of church and state. It is obviously something that is painful to many, but it is protection for all of us.
On the other hand, this (what appears to me) specious nitpicking over every jot and tittle that someone finds offensive is simply polarizing our society.

This isn't "every jot and tittle".
This is a monument to a particular set of religions holding a position of honor on property which is supposed to only be used by secular government in its representation of all citizens regardless of their religion or lack of it.
In addition to that supposedly secular government preventing the erection of monuments to any other of its citizens' varied religious beliefs on that property.

We are jousting at windmills whilst our society condones and defends something like the "slaughter of the innocents" as conducted by Planned Parenthood?

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We are indeed jousting at windmills in several areas, but the true battle is not the so-called "slaughter of the innocent".
It is the continued and widening income inequality in this the so-called "wealthiest nation on Earth," as more and more new income is poured into the coffers of the wealthiest and everyone else's quality of life continues to plummet.

Vote Bernie Sanders in 2016.

 

[Jose Fly]

Things have become truly bizarre in this case.

When the OK Supreme Court ruled the monument must come down, the Oklahoma Attorney General filed for a rehearing of the case, arguing that the monument was secular/historical, and not religious.

"The Oklahoma Supreme Court’s ruling was wrong because it ignored the profound historical impact of the Ten Commandments, and contradicted previous decisions of the court. "

The court denied the request aying they “found nothing to merit a rehearing in the case.” But the AG has filed another brief, now arguing that taking down the monument creates hostility towards religion.

"That declaration prohibits manifestations of faith from the public square in such a way as to create hostility toward religion in violation of the U.S. Constitution."

So at one point the AG argues that the monument isn't religious, but now argues that taking it down is hostile to religion? :idunno:

Hilarious.

 

[ok doser]

don't feel like going back through three pages of this

can you point me to the post where Oklahoma was forcing people to worship this monument?

kthxbaie

 

[Jose Fly]

can you point me to the post where Oklahoma was forcing people to worship this monument?

Oh brother. So I suppose you were just fine with having the monument to Satan right next to the 10 Commandments monument, right?

 

[ok doser]

looks like you can't


anybody?

 

[Jose Fly]

Why do you think that's at all relevant?

 

[ok doser]

sorry, you've had your turn


can anybody else show where Oklahomans have been forced to kneel down and pray to this statue?

 

[bybee]

For the same reason tyrants erect statues of themselves.

No doubt for the same reason that some folks have a burning desire to tear down whatever others consider special?

 

[quip]

No doubt for the same reason that some folks have a burning desire to tear down whatever others consider special?

I suppose that depends on the specific special-ness.

 

[Rusha]

I suppose that depends on the specific special-ness.

Personally, the Ten Commandments doesn't bother me. It does, however, leave the door wide open for all other religious and political POVS to be displayed.

 

[Jose Fly]

UPDATE: An Oklahoma judge has given the state 30 days to remove the monument.

 

[genuineoriginal]

It is part of an ancient code that has served society well. Likely, it is viewed as an historical monument by most folks. But, since it is also part of a religious format it may rightly be required to be taken down if some find it transgressing the separation of church and state.
It seems making a mountain out of a molehill to me but Heavens! Where shall this end?

According to the Bible, it will end with Christians being beheaded followed by the return of Jesus.

 

[Jose Fly]

UPDATE: Oklahoma to remove Ten Commandments monument from Capitol by Oct.12

An Oklahoma commission voted on Tuesday to remove a privately funded granite monument of the Ten Commandments from the State Capitol grounds, after a judge ordered its removal by Oct. 12.

The Capitol Preservation Commission, which oversees art displays in public spaces, voted 7-1 to authorize the Office of Management and Enterprise Services to remove the monument.

The Oklahoma Supreme Court in June had ordered the monument, which was erected in 2012, removed because the state constitution bans the use of state property for the benefit of a religion.

A judge earlier this month gave Oklahoma until Oct. 12 to remove the 6-foot-tall (1.8-meter) monument, denying a request from state Attorney General Scott Pruitt to leave it in place. The monument has strong support of Oklahoma’s Republican leadership.

John Estus, a spokesman for the Office of Management and Enterprise Services, said it was unclear where the monument would be placed.

 

[Jose Fly]

It's been removed. :up:

Workers Removing Ten Commandments From Oklahoma Capitol

A granite monument of the Ten Commandments that has sparked controversy since its installation on the Oklahoma Capitol grounds was being removed and will be transported to a private conservative think tank for storage.

A contractor the state hired began removing the monument shortly after 10:30 p.m. Monday. The work comes after the Oklahoma Supreme Court's June decision that the display violates a state constitutional prohibition on the use of public property to support "any sect, church, denomination or system of religion."

 

[OliviaM]

I think some people want to have government force their brand of Christianity on others. Sometimes that is by putting up ten commandments. Other times it is a nativity scene. Maybe a coach making kids pray at a football game.

All that is wrong.

 

[Angel4Truth]

I think some people want to have government force their brand of Christianity on others. Sometimes that is by putting up ten commandments. Other times it is a nativity scene. Maybe a coach making kids pray at a football game.

All that is wrong.

Examples please of a coach 'making' kids pray - thanks, also where are they forcing anyone to kneel and worship at the 10 commandments or a nativity scene?

 

[OliviaM]

Examples please of a coach 'making' kids pray - thanks, also where are they forcing anyone to kneel and worship at the 10 commandments or a nativity scene?

The coach gathers the kids before the game and leads a prayer. The players may not just not participate of they don't want reprisal. Well know how the game is played.

Government should not force any specific belief on people.

Baptists shouldn't have to pray to Mary before the football game. The Hindi shouldn't have to endure the government putting a nativity scene in the public park.

This isn't hard to understand.

It is quite easy to understand.

 

[bybee]

The coach gathers the kids before the game and leads a prayer. The players may not just not participate of they don't want reprisal. Well know how the game is played.

Government should not force any specific belief on people.

Baptists shouldn't have to pray to Mary before the football game. The Hindi shouldn't have to endure the government putting a nativity scene in the public park.

This isn't hard to understand.

It is quite easy to understand.

But of course Christians must learn to tuck themselves in and no longer be open as once they were?
This particular administration is most certainly not pushing Christianity.

 

[bybee]

I think some people want to have government force their brand of Christianity on others. Sometimes that is by putting up ten commandments. Other times it is a nativity scene. Maybe a coach making kids pray at a football game.

All that is wrong.

How about kids not allowed to pray?

 

[OliviaM]

But of course Christians must learn to tuck themselves in and no longer be open as once they were?
This particular administration is most certainly not pushing Christianity.

Christians don't have to tuck or anything. Just don't act like your particular version owns the country because it does not. You don't get o use a position of power over people to get them to pray to or worship your version.