LOST - discussion about the TV series LOST. ** SPOILER ALERT **

zoo22

Well-known member
I feel like such a dork. It was pointed out to me (by chickenman) that somebody had already posted a theory about LOST being similar to the Howling Man Twilight Zone episode. :doh:

The other post beat me by about a week or so. It's amazing that somebody else would have thought of such a similar comparison.

My only consolation is that my oldest son and I had discussed the theory for about a month so I know in my heart it was an original idea. I guess it proves that there are some real similarities that others also noticed.

Still... it's kinda embarrassing.

Absolutely no sense in being embarrassed, Knight. I'm sure it's been proposed other times before over the years... There are thousands upon thousands of theories people have presented, many overlapping.

It's a very good theory. (Plus, yours is far better written :) )
 

Hilston

Active member
Hall of Fame
Apparently I missed it, but Black Shirt Man explicitly stated to Sawyer that "23 Shephard" referred to Jack. However, he could be lying.

Another detail that might support the theory that "23 Shephard" refers to Jack (and not Aaron or Christian) is his seat number on Oceanic 815, which was 23B.
 

Yorzhik

Well-known member
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
That's correct. That was really early in season 1.

Also, in the most recent episode we see the smoke monster peer into Sawyers window in Dharmaville and not much later Flocke makes a similar appearance. Llana then tells us that Flocke/Smoke monster can no longer change his shape (was she wrong??). Or... is the smoke monster peering into Sawyers window the "other" smoke monster?
It may be the smoke monster is stuck changing into *only* Locke, but not that it is stuck changing into smoke or Locke.
 

The Graphite

New member
This is NOT my theory, but I feel compelled to share it, because I think it is very insightful!

http://theoriesonlost.blogspot.com/2010/02/parallels-between-jacobmib-and-hatch-by.html

He writes:

Plain and simple, I believe the writers purposefully showed us the general plot of the show way back in Season 2. The theme of 2 sides, science vs. faith, light vs. dark, etc. has been prevalent throughout the entire show.

The Hatch:
- Inside were Desmond and Kelvin
- They were both tasked with pressing the button, thus "protecting" the world, even though they didn't understand how
- Kelvin tries to leave, while Desmond remains faithful to his duty
- When Jack and Locke arrive, the two of them replace Desmond and Kelvin
- Even though Jack doesn't believe in pressing the button and Locke is the one faithful to pressing it, Locke ends up being the one to press the button

The Jacob/MIB story
- Jacob and MIB have lived on the Island for a long, long time
- MIB says Jacob is tasked with "protecting" the Island, even though Locke says its he's protecting it from "nothing"
- MIB tries to leave, while Jacob remain faithful to his duty
- Jack is generally considered the leader of the Flight 815 survivors and Locke becomes leader of the Others. Jack doesn't believe in the Island's supernatural occurrences, but Locke accepts it with faith. However, it is Locke (sort of) that ends up killing Jacob and tries to leave the island


Whether this is important to the actual story or not, it is pretty irrefutable that this theme of two people in charge of "protecting" something, both are polar opposites of each other.

I believe every season has had this overall theme, and we have carried it through to the 6th season, still with Jack vs. Locke, even though the real Locke is dead.

Lost has always been about that Backgammon game referenced in the first episode. White vs. black, Jack vs. Locke, Survivors vs. Others, Ben vs. Widmore, Jacob vs. MIB... Our version of Lost storyline vs. the "new" version of the Lost storyline...
 

The Graphite

New member
Unless of course the "two smokie" theory is valid. :think:

I just read this post again, and I don't buy that, at least in this context regarding Smokey being in the temple.

Because that Smokey had to be MIB, since he ordered Ben to follow unLocke's orders... conveniently while unLocke had walked away. unLocke walked away, turned into Smokey, bossed Ben around to make sure that Ben would kill Jacob, and then Smokey disappeared and unLocke reappeared.
 

The Graphite

New member
Conjecture:

What if MIB wants to die?

MIB and Jacob see things differently, if not oppositely. Jacob didn't seem to mind dying. What if MIB wants to be released from his seemingly eternal life? He wants "out." To go "home." That could mean that he wants someone to kill him... but Jacob can't kill him, and doesn't seem interested in getting anyone else to kill him. MIB may have killed Jacob to try to goad him into doing the same thing back.

Strictly conjecture.
 

The Graphite

New member
Most of the names on the wall are notoriously hard to discern. However, numerous fans have expended a great deal of effort to blow up these images and get as much as possible.

Apparently, Mars is one of the candidate names. Mars is the marshal who tracked Kate down and arrested her. He died the day after the crash, which sure isn't much time on the island. This suggests to me that he was a candidate prior to coming to the island, and therefore was likely brought to the island because he was a candidate. Not that he became a candidate because he wound up on the island. It makes no sense to consider him a candidate after he is fatally impaled during the accident, with no apparent hope for survival. How could such a person be a candidate? His candidacy precedes the crash.

We know that Rousseau's name was on the wall, as were Linus, Goodspeed and Faraday. Pickett is in there, too, and he was one of the Others.

There are numerous names that are unfamiliar to me. Are any of these names associated with characters I'm forgetting? Or have names from the plane's manifest ever been read on the show, thereby indicating that some of these people were on the plane but died in the crash? Survivors in the tail section?

Mattingly, Brennan, Rutherford, Martin, Burke, Goldstein, Troupe, Bargas, Almeida, Lewis, Straume, Costa, Sceckler, Harggus, O'Toole, Amistad, Jones, Yaris, Oralingo, Aguella, Jenkins, Domingo, Cunningham, Fernandez, Henderson, Grant, Aguila, Chang, Carner, Lacombe, Pickett, Reynolds, Sullivan, ...-ski?

(Interesting that the greatly mysterious ship at Black Rock is a slave ship... and one of the names on the wall is the name of the most famous slave ship ever - Amistad. Probably just an easter egg, though. I realize the ship was not the Amistad.)

By the way, notice the large number of Hispanic names? Roughly a third of the names. Did they arrive together on the island along with Ricardus (who apparently was in chains), perhaps on a ship?

One more observation. I'm watching the first episode, right now. Right after a commercial break, Jack and Kate are standing at the crash site, and people are milling around, behind them, out of focus. Right before the commercial, the survivors had heard and (sort of) saw the monster in the jungle, knocking trees down, in the middle of the night. But here, the following morning, you hear Rose comment to other survivors that the sound the monster made was distinctly familiar to her.

"I keep thinking there was something really familiar about it."

The makers of the show made sure this dialogue was audible as Jack and Kate stood there silently, waiting for their turn to dialogue. Rose's comments were definitely not obvious, but they were clearly made available to the audience intentionally.

Later, Jack and Kate and Charlie find the cockpit and the pilot, and the pilot is explaining how the plane went off course... when Smokey shows up and yanks the pilot right out the window and kills him... before the pilot can spill the beans about anything he shouldn't.

Widmore controlls Oceanic, and Widmore is apparently on the side of MIB. We know this because Widmore told Locke he must return to the island because there's a war coming... and Faraday's mother Eloise said that Locke's body must return to the island as well... and when Bram and the other servants of Jacob met Miles (in a flashback), Bram told Miles that he (Miles) is working for the wrong side. Miles was being hired by Widmore to go to the island. Therefore, Widmore and his crew were under the direction of MIB, who wanted Locke's body to return to the island. Obviously, MIB wanted Locke's body, which he is now "locked" into.

Widmore covered up the plane crash with a cover story. And we know that Lapidus was supposed to be the pilot of that flight, but another pilot was switched in his place to take the plane over there. The radio mysteriously quit working 6 hours into the flight, causing the pilots to predictably change direction toward Fiji, which then took the plane directly over the island, which all seems very convenient and leads me to believe that MIB had Widmore send the plane (and the candidates aboard) to the island.

So, as they're talking to the pilot in the cockpit, Smokey makes a beeline straight for that location and takes out the pilot before he can say too much.
 

The Graphite

New member
Something else about the pilot got me to thinking. I'm sure this has been pointed out by others over the years but just to point it out here...

The plane was flying from Sydney to L.A.

Guess what is right along that flight path?

Fiji.

The pilot said when the radio went out, they changed direction to head toward Fiji. Logically, we can assume this island was not very close to Fiji, or they would have been found. And yet, Fiji is practically on the flight path from Sydney to L.A. The pilot said they crashed a "thousand miles" away from where the search would be happening.

My wife bought me a beautiful antique-looking globe some time ago. On the globe, it has, in dotted lines, a few of the most major shipping lanes around the globe, including from Sydney to San Fransisco. Guess what? A straight line path goes very close to Fiji, and if you adjust that destination to L.A., the flight path is now even closer to Fiji, probably even within sight of the plane if it is thousands of feet in the air.

So, I took a string and put it on the globe, since looking at a globe straight-on can be deceiving as far as straight lines are concerned.

A perfectly straight line from Sydney to L.A. goes over ONE and only one significant island. Fiji. It doesn't go over Samoa... or Hawaii. Just Fiji specifically. Exactly and precisely over Fiji and nothing else.

The writers looked at a globe and picked the one, specific island in the ocean that would be the most ridiculous island to mention in the pilot's explanation. The most impossible. And they used that one. If you do what I did, you'll see that for the plane to go 1,000 miles off coarse and still be not be near Fiji would be ridiculous.

No way was the pilot's explanation logical. Either it was a flub by the writers... or the pilot was lying his tuchis off. As obvious as this would be on a globe, I'm inclined to think it is not a writer's mistake.
 
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The Graphite

New member
I just counted the number of episodes in every season.

Not surprisingly, Episode 108 will happen this season, although it won't be the last episode. It will be episode 10 of this season.

Interestingly, it is tentatively titled "Happily Ever After" (according to IMDB.com), which is a pretty strange episode title for the middle of a season, especially when it is in the middle of a show's final season.
 

Nathon Detroit

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
I just counted the number of episodes in every season.

Not surprisingly, Episode 108 will happen this season, although it won't be the last episode. It will be episode 10 of this season.

Interestingly, it is tentatively titled "Happily Ever After" (according to IMDB.com), which is a pretty strange episode title for the middle of a season, especially when it is in the middle of a show's final season.
Are you sure about that?

The 100th episode already aired in season 5 (they had a big celebration).

By my count the 108th episode will air this Tuesday.
:think:

Keep in mind that double episodes (such as this years season premier) are actually counted as 2 episodes.

From wiki...

Season 1 (2004–2005)
Season 1 featured 25 episodes.

Season 2 (2005–2006)
Season 2 featured 24 episodes.

Season 3 (2006–2007)
Season 3 featured 23 episodes.

Season 4 (2008)
Season 4 was planned (prior to the Writers Guild of America strike) to feature 16 episodes, to be broadcast beginning in the US and Canada on January 31, 2008.Due to the writers' strike, the season instead lasted only 14 episodes.

Season 5 (2009)
Season 5 featured 17 episodes.

TOTAL = 103 Episodes prior to season 6


Season 6 premiered on February 2, 2010, at its new timeslot of Tuesdays at 9:00 pm in the US and Canada and will feature 18 episodes.

4 episodes have aired so far this year that makes 107.
 

The Graphite

New member
One of the names in the cave is Rutherford. That is Shannon's last name. She was a candidate, and was crossed off. This seems to bust the theory many have that candidates can be only male.

As you may recall, Shannon was killed by Ana Lucia... right at a moment when the mysterious whispers were happening, and one of their party had suddenly disappeared. Next thing you know, Ana L blew Shannon away.

On a side note, "Chang" has been reported as being on the cave wall. That is Dr. Pierre Chang, of the Others, better known to many as "Dr. Marvin Candle" in the training video. Miles' dad. The name refers to Dr. Chang, and not Miles, because Miles' name is also on the cave wall - Straume.

As for episode count, IMDB.com's page for Lost has a comprehensive list of every episode of every season of Lost, with episode titles and very brief story summaries. I took my count from that.

Season 1: 24 episodes

Season 2: 23 episodes

Season 3: 22 episodes

Season 4: 13 episodes

Season 5: 16 episodes

. . . . . . = 98 episodes

And yes, this listing does count double-episodes as two episodes, as you can see.
 

The Graphite

New member
And thank you, Hilston, I had not seen that analysis and that totally trumps what I said about the flight path. I stand corrected.
 

Nathon Detroit

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
As for episode count, IMDB.com's page for Lost has a comprehensive list of every episode of every season of Lost, with episode titles and very brief story summaries. I took my count from that.

Season 1: 24 episodes

Season 2: 23 episodes

Season 3: 22 episodes

Season 4: 13 episodes

Season 5: 16 episodes

. . . . . . = 98 episodes

And yes, this listing does count double-episodes as two episodes, as you can see.
IMDB's count is wrong.

The 100th episode party.

(The Ace of Cakes made the cake) Yum! :chew:
 

The Graphite

New member
IMDB's count is wrong.

The 100th episode party.

(The Ace of Cakes made the cake) Yum! :chew:
That's kind of hinky... So, part 1 is an episode, and part II is a single show that lasts 80 minutes but it's considered two episodes...

... so part 1 & 2 are three episodes. Is that how they officially count the episodes? Or how fans count them? I don't care who's right or wrong; just curious. :patrol:
 

Nathon Detroit

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
That's kind of hinky... So, part 1 is an episode, and part II is a single show that lasts 80 minutes but it's considered two episodes...

... so part 1 & 2 are three episodes. Is that how they officially count the episodes? Or how fans count them? I don't care who's right or wrong; just curious. :patrol:
Yeah... it's kinda funky. It had us all confused when we were ordering DVD's from Netflix (prior to streaming).

Some of the episodes were longer (especially season finale's). They would often have a part 1, then a double episode which turned out to be part 2 and part 3 when all was said and done.

Here is an official episode list.
 

The Graphite

New member
According to the official Lost Season 1 DVD, that season is considered to have 24 episodes, so the Part II of the season finale is considered to be one episode. So, that helps us know where we stand with episode 108, in case it is relevant. (Previous episodes that share a number with "the numbers" don't seem to have special relevance in that respect, so I have doubts as to whether 108 will, but who knows!)

Is Lostpedia official? Isn't it a wiki, and therefore compiled by numerous fans?
 

Nathon Detroit

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
According to the official Lost Season 1 DVD, that season is considered to have 24 episodes, so the Part II of the season finale is considered to be one episode. So, that helps us know where we stand with episode 108, in case it is relevant. (Previous episodes that share a number with "the numbers" don't seem to have special relevance in that respect, so I have doubts as to whether 108 will, but who knows!)

Is Lostpedia official? Isn't it a wiki, and therefore compiled by numerous fans?
I guess it's not official but it is accurate. When you stream the episodes via Netflix their count matches the LOST wiki as well as the episodes on Blu-Ray and also the normal wiki article. Trust me this whole thing had us confused as well, we weren't sure if we had seen all the episodes from each season or not. Finally we found the LOST wiki count and it all made more sense and matched the episodes on DVD and Netflix.

For instance.... the season one finale Exodus Part I & II is actually three separate episodes. Exodus Part 1 is one episode and Exodus part II is a double episode and each episode of part II has it's own intro and credits etc.

Wacky!
 
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