Judaic Christians and Pagan Christians

[Levolor]

He that saith unto the wicked, Thou are righteous; him shall the people curse, nations shall abhor him:

But to them that rebuke him shall be delight, and a good blessing shall come upon them.

PS
They speak vanity every one with his neighbour: with flattering lips and with a double heart do they speak. Psalm 12:2 KJV

Do you follow Jesus?

Jesus said to love one another. After being told that God is love, you give me the above. This after suggesting that you teach, or speak on, what you consider to be the truth rather than offer condemning words.

The only additional commandment that Christ gave was is to love one another as He did. This requires laying down pride, superiority or any other characteristic within us that prevents us from being kind and having compassion with one another. Kindness and compassion takes great strength. It is so very easy to be unkind... it is, after all, a characteristic of the 'natural unborn-again person'.

Be strong in the Lord. (Ephesians 6:10)

Jesus did not come into the world to condemn it. "For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved." John 3:17

What brought me into this conversation was your saying to CherubRam: "Your sheer ignorance is showing."

Rather than follow the instructions in 2 Timothy 3:16*, you offered only condemnation. *"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:"

Rebuke, reproof, correction and instruction can be done in an edifying way, Ephesians 4:29, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.

2 Peter 3:18

 

[chair]

The first Christians were Jews. There was tension in the early Church over the role of Judaism in Christianity. All of this took place about 1900 years ago. It is over and done with. Why do folks keep bringing this up?

 

[CherubRam]

The term Judeo / Judaic-Christian is theologically, philosophically, and historically evident and universally accepted. However, a lot of historians, politicians, and congregations disagree with it.

The term is synonymous with Judaizing. The New Testament Covenant is in fact the replacement of the Old Covenant and priesthood, with Christ as the head of the priesthood. Regardless if a person chooses to accept it, it still remains a fact of life.

Judaic Christians
Typically Judaic Christians do not look for miraculous signs or prophesy in his name, or drive out demons and perform miracles. Most of all, Judaic Christians concern themselves with obeying God's commandments and keeping the testimony of Yahshua, for which is The New Covenant.
Since Messiah's actual birth name is Yahshua in Hebrew and English; that is what I prefer to call him. Modern English spells his name as Joshua. I know what the name Yahshua means, and when it is understood as such in the bible, then you can find scriptural links, such as:

Exodus 23:21.
Pay attention to him and listen to what he says. Do not rebel against him; he will not forgive your rebellion, since my Name is in him.

And

Numbers 13:16.
These are the names of the men Moses sent to explore the land.
(Moses gave Hoshea son of Nun the name Joshua "Yahshua.")

Also:

Psalm 68:4.
Sing to God, sing praise to his name, extol him who rides on the clouds his name is (the LORD / Yah) and rejoice before him.
(NIV ref# 3363. Note: Yah is the short form of Yahwah.)

If you or others want to use the name Jesus, then you don't need my permission to do so.

 

[CherubRam]

Obedience to Yahwah's commandments is an act of devotion that engages the whole person for a righteous lifestyle.

 

[freelight]

more kinds of christians exist...but more on these two.....

more kinds of christians exist...but more on these two.....

There are two kinds of Christians in the world, which one are you?

A person is known by what they do.

Are you a Judaic Christian, or are you a Pagan Christian?

I'd say most Christians are a blend of both since the Christian theology and culture draws from both Judaism and paganism.....and other schools. How much of Judaism draws from earlier pagan influences and cultures who once dominated her people? Christianity then springing from that culture further becomes synthesized with Hellenistic greek metaphysics/philosophy developing its later orthodox doctrines particularly with its terms concerning Christology.

This is to say nothing of the truer forms of Jesus teaching/following within the first few centuries approximating closer to the schools of the Essenes, Nazarienes, Ebionites, followers of the Way and some gnostic sects. Some modern day hebraic-roots groups stick only with sayings of Jesus and reject Paul's apostleship, holding to a more traditional Judaism as Jesus and the original 12 held to....continued under the leadership of James the Just in Jerusalem. After James group disintegrated..... Paul took his gospel to the gentiles...becoming all things to all people, preaching his own gospel differing in some respects from Jesus and his apostles teachings. He continually claims his own apostleship and the exclusivity of his gospel over any other.




pj

 

[CherubRam]

I'd say most Christians are a blend of both since the Christian theology and culture draws from both Judaism and paganism.....and other schools. How much of Judaism draws from earlier pagan influences and cultures who once dominated her people? Christianity then springing from that culture further becomes synthesized with Hellenistic greek metaphysics/philosophy developing its later orthodox doctrines particularly with its terms concerning Christology.

This is to say nothing of the truer forms of Jesus teaching/following within the first few centuries approximating closer to the schools of the Essenes, Nazarienes, Ebionites, followers of the Way and some gnostic sects. Some modern day hebraic-roots groups stick only with sayings of Jesus and reject Paul's apostleship, holding to a more traditional Judaism as Jesus and the original 12 held to....continued under the leadership of James the Just in Jerusalem. After James group disintegrated..... Paul took his gospel to the gentiles...becoming all things to all people, preaching his own gospel differing in some respects from Jesus and his apostles teachings. He continually claims his own apostleship and the exclusivity of his gospel over any other.




pj

For the most part that is true. There was Orthodox Judaism at the same time as the Hellenist Judaism, and there were Judaic Christians before Pagan and Gnostic Christianity crept in.

Jude

1. Jude, a servant of Yahshua the Messiah, and brother of James, and to them that are sanctified by Yahwah the Father, also called and saved by Yahshua the Messiah.
2. May mercy, peace, and devotion, be multiplied to you.
3. Loved, I was eager to write to you about the salvation we share, it was necessary for me to write to you, and encourage you to earnestly contend for the faith that was given to the saints.
4. Because you are unaware that certain men have sneaked in, who are of a ancient order to their condemnation, these ungodly men turn the grace of our God into immorality, and deny that the only God is Yahwah, or that our lord Yahshua is the Messiah.

 

[CherubRam]

Christianity and Paganism: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity_and_Paganism

 

[CherubRam]

Origin Of The Cross: https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=Origin+Of+The+Cross

 

[CherubRam]

Pope Gregory and Paganism.
The attitude of the Catholic Church toward paganism is best summed up by Pope Gregory the Great, in his words to a missionary: “You must not interfere with any traditional belief or religious observance that can be harmonized with Christianity.”
Not only were the Congregations divided by Gnosticism, but enticed by philosophy and paganism also, and there were geographic divisions as well.
Pope Gregory 540 – 12 March 604.

 

[Mashiach Yeshua]

Salutations in the Light of the Messiah!

Salutations in the Light of the Messiah!

Fascinating question to begin the conversation. Let us hope Christ shines through our brothers and sisters here for all to participate with active posts and/or passive reading for growth and maturation of our Character and Personality.

I have been reviewing the boundaries of Paganism (Polytheism) and Monotheism (Abrahamic traditions). The further I dig into the subject I see the lines blur, with those of greater fears and narrower minds polarizing at opposite ends. I find the Truth to appear to be somewhere in the Middle, although perspective is key. Likewise, word choices might fit for one individual and throw another into a snit.

In brief, from the perspective of Spirit (Conscious Awareness) God is the Creator, inhabiting Creation, infused within even the minutest of particles so as to not be physically distinguishable to our naked eyes and most refined tools. Thus, polytheism and monotheism are irrelevant as long as God is being worshipped. For there is only One God, and Infinite God has many many attributes.

However, from the Soul (Subconscious, Unconscious Awareness) there is a perspective of different, finite, margins and boundaries. The Soul sees different clothes, customs, colors, hears different languages and words, confused and afraid the Soul creates an "in-group" and "out-group". The group distinction is for the calming of the fears arising from difference, unpredictability, newness, as well as real and/or perceived threats to the Soul and Bodily survival. The Soul sees separation between Spirit and Soul, and Spirit and Body--not so much Soul and Body, as together they are the Personality and Life Display of you and me.

The Soul sees some folks as "either or" not recognizing as the Spirit does that there is a spectrum-continuum and people worship "wherever they are", yet all Worship ultimately goes to the One God.

Consider, how many ways are there to get to finite, physical Washington D.C?
How many more pathways to the Infinite God, eternal, immortal and invisible?

Yes, I know. "The Way, the Truth and the Life" as our Christ has proclaimed. I would argue that there is only One God, and His Christ, who is the Light and Word blazing forth in all Traditions as each Christed Figure (many Sons of Man) to bring various peoples at various times and locations to the Father. It is the same Holy Spirit working in All of them, although the body, name and form is different physically. I would then propose that the Souls of later, removed disciples purposely or accidentally (and both) altered text because they did not Know this, or Care to Know this and pass it on. Fears dominate the Soul, and fear brings separation. Fears are dominate in an unrenewed Mind which is carnal and worldly. I offer these verses which weigh favorably this way for your prayer and examination:

Galatians 3:8
John 6:45
1 Corinthians 7:17, 8:6, 12:6
Ephesians 3:9, 4:6
Acts 2:17, 17:24-28
1 Peter 4:11
Revelation 21:3
Psalms 70:4
2 Timothy 3:16
Matthew 12:22, 28:20
Thessalonians 5:23

 

[Stripe]

There are two kinds of Christians.

Nope. Just one. Those who have confessed Christ as savior and accepted Him into their hearts are Christians. Anything else is just decoration.

 

[CherubRam]

Fascinating question to begin the conversation. Let us hope Christ shines through our brothers and sisters here for all to participate with active posts and/or passive reading for growth and maturation of our Character and Personality.

I have been reviewing the boundaries of Paganism (Polytheism) and Monotheism (Abrahamic traditions). The further I dig into the subject I see the lines blur, with those of greater fears and narrower minds polarizing at opposite ends. I find the Truth to appear to be somewhere in the Middle, although perspective is key. Likewise, word choices might fit for one individual and throw another into a snit.

In brief, from the perspective of Spirit (Conscious Awareness) God is the Creator, inhabiting Creation, infused within even the minutest of particles so as to not be physically distinguishable to our naked eyes and most refined tools. Thus, polytheism and monotheism are irrelevant as long as God is being worshipped. For there is only One God, and Infinite God has many many attributes.

However, from the Soul (Subconscious, Unconscious Awareness) there is a perspective of different, finite, margins and boundaries. The Soul sees different clothes, customs, colors, hears different languages and words, confused and afraid the Soul creates an "in-group" and "out-group". The group distinction is for the calming of the fears arising from difference, unpredictability, newness, as well as real and/or perceived threats to the Soul and Bodily survival. The Soul sees separation between Spirit and Soul, and Spirit and Body--not so much Soul and Body, as together they are the Personality and Life Display of you and me.

The Soul sees some folks as "either or" not recognizing as the Spirit does that there is a spectrum-continuum and people worship "wherever they are", yet all Worship ultimately goes to the One God.

Consider, how many ways are there to get to finite, physical Washington D.C?
How many more pathways to the Infinite God, eternal, immortal and invisible?

Yes, I know. "The Way, the Truth and the Life" as our Christ has proclaimed. I would argue that there is only One God, and His Christ, who is the Light and Word blazing forth in all Traditions as each Christed Figure (many Sons of Man) to bring various peoples at various times and locations to the Father. It is the same Holy Spirit working in All of them, although the body, name and form is different physically. I would then propose that the Souls of later, removed disciples purposely or accidentally (and both) altered text because they did not Know this, or Care to Know this and pass it on. Fears dominate the Soul, and fear brings separation. Fears are dominate in an unrenewed Mind which is carnal and worldly. I offer these verses which weigh favorably this way for your prayer and examination:

Galatians 3:8
John 6:45
1 Corinthians 7:17, 8:6, 12:6
Ephesians 3:9, 4:6
Acts 2:17, 17:24-28
1 Peter 4:11
Revelation 21:3
Psalms 70:4
2 Timothy 3:16
Matthew 12:22, 28:20
Thessalonians 5:23

I do not buy into the "all is good theory."

 

[CherubRam]

Nope. Just one. Those who have confessed Christ as savior and accepted Him into their hearts are Christians. Anything else is just decoration.

Pagan Christians make the choice to remain in that sin, others don't. Therefore there are two kinds of Christians.

 

[freelight]

We are the tabernacle..............

We are the tabernacle..............

Fascinating question to begin the conversation. Let us hope Christ shines through our brothers and sisters here for all to participate with active posts and/or passive reading for growth and maturation of our Character and Personality.

I have been reviewing the boundaries of Paganism (Polytheism) and Monotheism (Abrahamic traditions). The further I dig into the subject I see the lines blur, with those of greater fears and narrower minds polarizing at opposite ends. I find the Truth to appear to be somewhere in the Middle, although perspective is key. Likewise, word choices might fit for one individual and throw another into a snit.

In brief, from the perspective of Spirit (Conscious Awareness) God is the Creator, inhabiting Creation, infused within even the minutest of particles so as to not be physically distinguishable to our naked eyes and most refined tools. Thus, polytheism and monotheism are irrelevant as long as God is being worshipped. For there is only One God, and Infinite God has many many attributes.

However, from the Soul (Subconscious, Unconscious Awareness) there is a perspective of different, finite, margins and boundaries. The Soul sees different clothes, customs, colors, hears different languages and words, confused and afraid the Soul creates an "in-group" and "out-group". The group distinction is for the calming of the fears arising from difference, unpredictability, newness, as well as real and/or perceived threats to the Soul and Bodily survival. The Soul sees separation between Spirit and Soul, and Spirit and Body--not so much Soul and Body, as together they are the Personality and Life Display of you and me.

The Soul sees some folks as "either or" not recognizing as the Spirit does that there is a spectrum-continuum and people worship "wherever they are", yet all Worship ultimately goes to the One God.

Consider, how many ways are there to get to finite, physical Washington D.C?
How many more pathways to the Infinite God, eternal, immortal and invisible?

Yes, I know. "The Way, the Truth and the Life" as our Christ has proclaimed. I would argue that there is only One God, and His Christ, who is the Light and Word blazing forth in all Traditions as each Christed Figure (many Sons of Man) to bring various peoples at various times and locations to the Father. It is the same Holy Spirit working in All of them, although the body, name and form is different physically. I would then propose that the Souls of later, removed disciples purposely or accidentally (and both) altered text because they did not Know this, or Care to Know this and pass it on. Fears dominate the Soul, and fear brings separation. Fears are dominate in an unrenewed Mind which is carnal and worldly. I offer these verses which weigh favorably this way for your prayer and examination:

Galatians 3:8
John 6:45
1 Corinthians 7:17, 8:6, 12:6
Ephesians 3:9, 4:6
Acts 2:17, 17:24-28
1 Peter 4:11
Revelation 21:3
Psalms 70:4
2 Timothy 3:16
Matthew 12:22, 28:20
Thessalonians 5:23

Blessings in the Universal One

It appears you might be more in line with an 'inclusionist gospel outreach', which recognizes the eternal truth, wisdom and dispensation given to each religious tradition, the 'perennial wisdom' underlying all, yet so wonderfully revealed in the person of Jesus, and mirrored in us on the interior level as the 'Christ within'. On this note, 'God' is the original Light from which all colours, tones, vibrations and waves emenate as a creative expression of Itself. If 'God' is Light, we are His rainbows :angel:

Shekinah Blessings,



pj

 

[Stripe]

Pagan Christians make the choice to remain in that sin, others don't. Therefore there are two kinds of Christians.

All Christians engage in sinful behavior. Who are you to say some are pagans and some aren't?

 

[CherubRam]

All Christians engage in sinful behavior. Who are you to say some are pagans and some aren't?

Matthew 5:20
For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

 

[Stripe]

Matthew 5:20
For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

How does one attain righteousness?

 

[jamie]

Paul took his gospel to the gentiles...becoming all things to all people, preaching his own gospel differing in some respects from Jesus and his apostles teachings.

His own gospel? How so?

Paul preached the gospel of God.

That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God, that the offering up of the Gentiles might be acceptable being sanctified by the Holy Spirit. (Romans 15:16 KJV)​

The gospel of God is the gospel God preached to Abraham.

And the scripture foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, "In thee shall all nations be blessed." (Galatians 3:8 KJV)​

Paul preached God's gospel that through Abraham all nations would be blessed.

Blessed how?

That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith. (Galatians 3:14 KJV)​

Paul preached God's gospel.

 

[Mashiach Yeshua]

Freelight, Stripe, and Levolor I have enjoy the three very distinct and fresh insights given to you by our Christ for others on this post!

Ignorance is wonderful, as it is an "Unknowing" which will become a Knowing when the one admits emptiness and thus becomes full of the Holy Spirit! In contrast, "dogma" cannot be argued with. Gems have been said here, and though some have eyes and ears there are those here without eyes to See and Ears to hear!

Some are merely.. "Trolling" and puffing up their own pride, either purposefully upsetting some with pointless, absolutist arguments.. Or doing the "devil's work" ignorantly.

I hope to view more post by you three in other forums.

In His Grace,

Brother Aaron

 

[Stripe]

Freelight, Stripe, and Levolor I have enjoy the three very distinct and fresh insights given to you by our Christ for others on this post!

Ignorance is wonderful, as it is an "Unknowing" which will become a Knowing when the one admits emptiness and thus becomes full of the Holy Spirit! In contrast, "dogma" cannot be argued with. Gems have been said here, and though some have eyes and ears there are those here without eyes to See and Ears to hear!

Some are merely.. "Trolling" and puffing up their own pride, either purposefully upsetting some with pointless, absolutist arguments.. Or doing the "devil's work" ignorantly.

I hope to view more post by you three in other forums.

In His Grace,

Brother Aaron

To be fair, Freelight is a Christ-hating, homo-loving pagan.