Is Society Better With Pornography Adultery Abortion Divorce Homosexuality Accepted?

[GFR7]

I am not one of them, so why are you asking me? On the same token, why do *you* suppose that so many people who are against divorce and SSM support the relationship of older adults preying on teens under the guise of marriage?

I cannot answer, as I am not one of them :AMR1:

 

[TracerBullet]

no



no



no



no



yes

sorry traci, i had intended for this to be a poll for Christians


perverts like you are welcome to participate, but don't expect much consideration

It's almost as if you are saying that it is somehow wrong to falsely associate a minority with the harming of children

 

[Town Heretic]

Odd. Were you confused by the "with a number of other things that are properly a matter of choice for the individual." bit at the end of my noting abortion can be argued against as a matter of law/objectively? I was considering two different responses and that last part should have been edited out. It was part of a compare/contrast that I decided to expand point for point and subsequently did.

Because every other point was factually, objectively and demonstrably true.

 

[jgarden]

the question was asked:

i thought i'd throw it out as a poll

Is Society Better With Pornography Adultery Abortion Divorce Homosexuality Accepted?

If God wanted to a world of "mindless" followers He would have created a world without sin!

 

[Lighthouse]

Odd. Were you confused by the "with a number of other things that are properly a matter of choice for the individual." bit at the end of my noting abortion can be argued against as a matter of law/objectively? I was considering two different responses and that last part should have been edited out. It was part of a compare/contrast that I decided to expand point for point and subsequently did.

Because every other point was factually, objectively and demonstrably true.

That was not indicative of confusion. It is of sadness and shame.

If God wanted to a world of "mindless" followers He would have created a world without sin!

He created a world without sin. It was the fact that He created mankind with wills so that they were not mindless followers that allowed them the freedom to sin anyway. But there were still rules against the sin they committed and punishment to follow.

 

[Delmar]

sorry traci, i had intended for this to be a poll for Christians


perverts like you are welcome to participate, but don't expect much consideration

is this an example of how your rule about name calling only applies to some people Delmar?

In your case it is more of an honorary title.

 

[Delmar]

With the exception of abortion (which should be illegal because it always ends the life of an innocent child), the others do not fall in the category of *accepted* but allowable.

Unless an action can be shown as something that always destroys or intentionally harms another human being (like abortion, murder, rape, child molestation), a *free* society would no more forbid it's citizens from the above than it would from smoking and drinking.

Do you not think it can be proven that pornography destroys people?

 

[Delmar]

Is Society Better With Pornography Adultery Abortion Divorce Homosexuality Accepted?

If God wanted to a world of "mindless" followers He would have created a world without sin!

Who at TOL would you suggest is promoting "a world of "mindless" followers"?

 

[Delmar]

accepted no, legal yes.

Why?

*The caviat is abortion which is murder and therefore should be illegal.

:up:

 

[TracerBullet]

In your case it is more of an honorary title.

so you are confirming that forum rules don't apply to everyone.

What a shock

 

[Nick M]

so you are confirming that forum rules don't apply to everyone.

What a shock

Considering all the times koban/SOD/resurrected has received infractions and been banned, this is a really stupid statement. He didn't break any rule, because you are in fact perverted (twisted).

 

[xenoranger]

Is Society Better With Pornography Adultery Abortion Divorce Homosexuality Accepted?

Short answer... NO

Long answer....


Pornography:
(Secular) Psychologists recommend that people who are disinterested in sex view pornography as a way to stimulate their sexual appetite. This sounds good in theory, until you look at the effects of viewing pornography.

1) The pornographic images become the stimulation.
This creates a disassociation of sex with your partner (preferably, Spouse). Now, instead of associating arousal with your partner, you're now needing multiple sources to get arouse. The desensitization makes it harder for a person to be satisfied with their partner and leads to sexual dissatisfaction in the relationship.

2) Pornography is tied to a history of abuses
Many women featured in pornography have been sexually abused at some point in their life. Instead of seeing value in their self for other reasons, their value becomes locked in sex and sex appeal. This creates an unhealthy individual who will perpetuate the notion that porn is OK so they can feel ok with their self.

Coincidentally, porn has also been linked to the sex traffic industry. The higher the demand for porn, the more sex trafficking thrives.


Adultery
Adultery is a huge contributor to breakdown in the family unit. Humans were designed to be faithful to just one partner their entire life. "the man must leave his father and mother and cleave to his wife" is referenced several places in the Bible. Men and women were designed to have a life-long, monogamous relationship. The moment you deviate from that, sex is no longer sacred. There's a breakdown of trust that occurs.

When a husband and wife can't trust each other, it weakens the bond. I've seen many "open" marriages end in divorce over stuff like this.

Furthermore, like porn, when there is adultery, it creates a disassociation of sex from the spouse. Thus, I can get sexual fulfilment with that person if my spouse isn't willing to provide it for me. This places unhealthy expectations on the spouse to perform. These expectations then subjugate the spouse, removing the equal-opposite relationship that men and women should have. While it is true that the man is the head of the house, many verses prescribe how the woman is not his slave but his helper. Thus, the two are equal but different.


Abortion
In the old testament, Molech worship was common. They'd throw their children into the fires built to worship Molech. Most worshippers of Molech lived sexually promiscuous lifestyles. In the modern day, abortion is framed as being about women's reproductive freedom. In some campaigns, it's just simply called sexual freedom.

So, you have a few things happening here:

1) A life is taken.
At conception, the child has a unique set of DNA from the mother. The pro-life movement can provide quite a few other facts that contribute to the argument of the "fetus" being human, so lets move on.

From a judiciary point, if you harm a woman who's pregnant and kill her unborn child and you're charged with murder. There's a disconnect of convenience which allows circumstances to determine if the fetus is human or not.

Also, society does not have a point of humanity. Some say as soon as the child is born, some say in the womb, and some say after 3 years old (as infanticide is legal in some European countries). The grey lines between when a person is human and under what circumstances leaves room for anything to be done to the unborn according to the individual's moral compass.

This breeds a further problem. Since the unborn are not considered human 100% of the time, their freedoms may be infringed upon for any reason. If a doctor wanted to genetically manipulate a fetus for whatever experimentation, he/she could since it's just "tissue" according to the pro-abortion team. But, I digress.

2) A Womb Disturbed
There are studies that show that post-abortion women have a harder time conceiving. Thus, when a woman wants to have a child, her body isn't prepared to carry the child full term and may abort it or not nurture it as it was meant to.

3) Removed Sexual Consequences
A consequence of sex is children. As Christians, we love children and consider them a gift from God. When you remove the sexual consequence of children from the factor, then people are encouraged to be very promiscuous. The more promiscuous a person is, the harder it is for them to have a monogamous sex life once they're married. Sex becomes void of intimacy and meaning by being reduced to a casual activity. The same bond that was meant to strengthen a marriage is now as useful as a cordless drill with an old battery.


Divorce
Divorce is biblically only allowed in cases of adultery. But, there's a larger issue here in society.

Mommy State = Subsidized Divorce
In the US, 89% of divorces filed end in favor of the woman. THus, you have women getting paid to divorce their husbands. Prior to child support laws, women would stick with their husbands until either he left or she decided that she just couldn't take it anymore. I'm not saying that this was ideal, but there was more incentive to work it out. Some marriages (especially in my family) lasted because there was no easy out.

I have several friends who were divorced by choice of the woman. In a friends and my cases, our ex-wives found someone else that they chose to sleep with. Before the bed was cold, we were served papers. After being thrust into a lifestyle of living hand-to-mouth, it was hard. But, where was the repercussions for their actions? The courts didn't care. My lawyer explained to me that no matter how she cheats in the relationship, there's nothing that can be done against her.

So, why is this important? Subsidizing divorce makes the decision less weighty. If you know that you can burn someone and get a win-fall for it, why not?

2) Family Issues
Divorce hurts families. One of my kids blamed their self for the divorce. My child told me that things would've been different if they hadn't provided secret updates to mom on what dad did or didn't do. While this is the mother encouraging unhealthy behavior, the fact that it lead to the child's parents divorcing still plagues my child to this day.

3) Father Issues
Where are the fathers in this day? 1 out of every 3 children has a father today. Fathers are the ones that set expectations for authority. A strong, loving father increases a child's success rate in life. Through divorce, fathers are being removed from their children's lives. This breeds children who have lowered respect for law and order. In the end, children who are much more likely to be criminals.

4) Trust Issues
Can you really trust someone who just threw their last relationship away for you? What guarantee do you have that they'll be faithful to you? If the person you're pursuing simply divorced their last spouse, how do you know they won't divorce you?

Divorce (like breaking up with someone you're dating) gets easier every time. The first is devastating, but each time after that it's just a legal process that you've traversed before. I have a family member who's on their 4th marriage. Each time, they've been less emotionally involved in the divorce.

Building trust is hard in life, but when you've been burned, it's much harder to trust again. From personal experience, I have to separate the actions of my current wife from past experiences of my ex-wife. Circumstances may be similar, but they are different people.


Homosexuality
Homosexuality is a huge issue. It's much larger than the secular world wants to admit. Homosexuality breeds all sorts of societal problems.

1) Gender Identity
Growing up in this fast-paced world is already difficult. Homosexuals challenge people to question yet one more aspect of their self. Are you the right gender? Quick clarification, sex is what parts you have, but gender is now defined as whether you identify as masculine or feminine. By not being sure of who you are as a person, others can project an identity on to you.

Funny story, but the psychology community still considers homosexuality to be a gender identification disorder. This hasn't been removed from the books.

2) Promiscuity
With gay marriage being passed in states, we'll see the numbers start to show. The traditional homosexual relationship is one of multiple partners and bed hopping. History has shown that the homosexual life style seldom produces monogamous couples.

3) Disease
The US CDC forbids homosexuals from donating body fluids. A glance on their website, and people practicing same-sex relationships are at minimum 11% more likely to be carriers for STD's than promiscuous heterosexuals.

4) Protected Class/Uber Rights
If you have read the news, there are several cases where small business owners have rejected business from homosexuals due to religious reasons. It doesn't matter whether you agree or disagree with the business owner. The fact is that almost all of them have lost the court battles. This means that a person who holds religious views (specifically those against homosexuality) can be forced to cater to the homosexual community. THis produces an infringement upon individual rights in favor of minority rights.


So, long answer... there are many horrible things that have been born from Pornography, Adultery, Abortion ,Divorce & Homosexuality in society. While you can't legislate morality, you can discourage these actions by providing information as to their detriment in society. In the end, each will choose their own god, but not all will choose God.

 

[Lighthouse]

so you are confirming that forum rules don't apply to everyone.

What a shock

The rules explicitly state there is a bias. Then there's what Nick said.

 

[Town Heretic]

That was not indicative of confusion. It is of sadness and shame.

A useless and easy objection absent some particular. I went point for point in noting almost everything I wrote was objectively, factually true and verifiably so...meaning either you find the objectively true sorrowful or you have a point of difference to set out.


In the absence of that particular: :nono:

 

[Lighthouse]

A useless and easy objection absent some particular. I went point for point in noting almost everything I wrote was objectively, factually true and verifiably so...meaning either you find the objectively true sorrowful or you have a point of difference to set out.


In the absence of that particular: :nono:

Aw... did I hurt your ego by being saddened and ashamed of your willfully ignoring God's commands simply because He gave us freedom of will to break them?

 

[Town Heretic]

Aw... did I hurt your ego by being saddened and ashamed of your willfully ignoring God's commands simply because He gave us freedom of will to break them?

That's a fairly childish response. No, you can't hurt my feelings given I consider you a fairly immature younger brother. What irked me was the irrational projection of your personal feeling devoid of any substantive point. Why I expected more is anyone's guess...I'm an optimist.

 

[Lighthouse]

That's a fairly childish response. No, you can't hurt my feelings given I consider you a fairly immature younger brother. What irked me was the irrational projection of your personal feeling devoid of any substantive point. Why I expected more is anyone's guess...I'm an optimist.

Who said anything about feelings?

God's commands regarding adultery and fornication, and Jesus' words on lust = adultery in the heart [pornography falls into this category] are the substance of my point. At least in regard to certain topics listed in the OP. Scripture is littered with the substance of my point.

My personal feelings don't play a part in any of this, as they disagree with God, and I prefer submission to Him. I'm also apparently incapable of being irrational, as even at my angriest I have never been irrational. Even as a child, when you would expect one to be irrational I was surprisingly rational. You can ask my father. He has a story that he likes to tell because of how surprisingly rational I was at an age when it was expected I would not be rational about the situation at all.

And just what makes me a "fairly immature younger brother"?

 

[Town Heretic]

Who said anything about feelings?

You did. "Hurt your ego" would be an emotional wound since you can't literally hurt a thing that isn't an organ. lain:

God's commands regarding adultery and fornication, and Jesus' words on lust = adultery in the heart [pornography falls into this category] are the substance of my point. At least in regard to certain topics listed in the OP. Scripture is littered with the substance of my point.

Now imagine you can connect that to an objection on any point I raised before your smiley and subsequent, slightly less terse but no more revealing response to a fairly straight forward post on my part.

My personal feelings don't play a part in any of this,

People with a case to make, in my experience, tend to make it. People who offer little more than declarative judgement, who have to be dragged into the substantive, tend to be acting from emotion, however they see themselves.

I'm also apparently incapable of being irrational, as even at my angriest I have never been irrational.

Everyone is capable of and has been at some point in their life, irrational. I think the ego you should be concerned with here is your own if you begin from that premise.

And just what makes me a "fairly immature younger brother"?

A smiley followed by an unilluminating declaration, for one.

I think that by and large illustrates my point and criticism. A mature Christian, finding fault with a particular posit would advance the fault he perceived in an attempt to be helpful while being open to the possibility (however unlikely he finds that possibility) of his own error.

So, once again, I made and revisited an handful of points I argue are factually established and invite any particular criticism on any particular point. I'll wait while you likely don't do that. lain:

 

[jgarden]

The Seven Woes
23 Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples, 2 “The scribes and the Pharisees sit on Moses' seat, 3 so do and observe whatever they tell you, but not the works they do. For they preach, but do not practice. 4 They tie up heavy burdens, hard to bear,[a] and lay them on people's shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to move them with their finger. 5 They do all their deeds to be seen by others. For they make their phylacteries broad and their fringes long, 6 and they love the place of honor at feasts and the best seats in the synagogues 7 and greetings in the marketplaces and being called rabbi by others. 8 But you are not to be called rabbi, for you have one teacher, and you are all brothers.[c] 9 And call no man your father on earth, for you have one Father, who is in heaven. 10 Neither be called instructors, for you have one instructor, the Christ. 11 The greatest among you shall be your servant. 12 Whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and whoever humbles himself will be exalted.

13 “But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you shut the kingdom of heaven in people's faces. For you neither enter yourselves nor allow those who would enter to go in.[d] 15 Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you travel across sea and land to make a single proselyte, and when he becomes a proselyte, you make him twice as much a child of hell[e] as yourselves.

16 “Woe to you, blind guides, who say, ‘If anyone swears by the temple, it is nothing, but if anyone swears by the gold of the temple, he is bound by his oath.’ 17 You blind fools! For which is greater, the gold or the temple that has made the gold sacred? 18 And you say, ‘If anyone swears by the altar, it is nothing, but if anyone swears by the gift that is on the altar, he is bound by his oath.’ 19 You blind men! For which is greater, the gift or the altar that makes the gift sacred? 20 So whoever swears by the altar swears by it and by everything on it. 21 And whoever swears by the temple swears by it and by him who dwells in it. 22 And whoever swears by heaven swears by the throne of God and by him who sits upon it.

23 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you tithe mint and dill and cumin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faithfulness. These you ought to have done, without neglecting the others. 24 You blind guides, straining out a gnat and swallowing a camel!

25 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you clean the outside of the cup and the plate, but inside they are full of greed and self-indulgence. 26 You blind Pharisee! First clean the inside of the cup and the plate, that the outside also may be clean.

27 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs, which outwardly appear beautiful, but within are full of dead people's bones and all uncleanness. 28 So you also outwardly appear righteous to others, but within you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.

29 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you build the tombs of the prophets and decorate the monuments of the righteous, 30 saying, ‘If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have taken part with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’ 31 Thus you witness against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. 32 Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers. 33 You serpents, you brood of vipers, how are you to escape being sentenced to hell? 34 Therefore I send you prophets and wise men and scribes, some of whom you will kill and crucify, and some you will flog in your synagogues and persecute from town to town, 35 so that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah the son of Barachiah, whom you murdered between the sanctuary and the altar. 36 Truly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.

Is Society Better With Pornography Adultery Abortion Divorce Homosexuality Accepted?

Presumably the role of mankind is to glorify God - but without being allowed to practice "free will," this becomes a meaningless concept.

"Sin," in its various forms, can be defined as the result of mankind being separated from God!

Pornography, adultery, abortion, divorce, homosexuality, etc may rank high on most Christians' top 10 list of sins - but it is self-righteousness that tops Christ's list!

 

[Lighthouse]

You did. "Hurt your ego" would be an emotional wound since you can't literally hurt a thing that isn't an organ. lain:

Ego is not an emotion.

Now imagine you can connect that to an objection on any point I raised before your smiley and subsequent, slightly less terse but no more revealing response to a fairly straight forward post on my part.

You defended freedom to view pornography as though it should be a legal right.

People with a case to make, in my experience, tend to make it. People who offer little more than declarative judgement, who have to be dragged into the substantive, tend to be acting from emotion, however they see themselves.

I'm so ashamed of you mostly because I don't see the point in making a case. You're too blind and deaf to pay attention.

Everyone is capable of and has been at some point in their life, irrational. I think the ego you should be concerned with here is your own if you begin from that premise.

It's difficult for me to be irrational.

A smiley followed by an unilluminating declaration, for one.

I think that by and large illustrates my point and criticism. A mature Christian, finding fault with a particular posit would advance the fault he perceived in an attempt to be helpful while being open to the possibility (however unlikely he finds that possibility) of his own error.

So, once again, I made and revisited an handful of points I argue are factually established and invite any particular criticism on any particular point. I'll wait while you likely don't do that. lain:

I've been a follower of Christ and student of His word for over 30 years. I see in you a ignorance so deep that it can only be reached if you are allowed to lead yourself into destruction until you realize your own mistakes, because no one else will ever be able to reach you.