Is Enyart worshipped like Jesus

[Turbo]

No seriously, I don't think he's worshiped here. But what I see borders on idolatry.

Translation: I can't substantiate my accusation, so I'll just soften it a tiny bit and make it anyway.

 

[The Edge]

Translation: I can't substantiate my accusation, so I'll just soften it a tiny bit and make it anyway.

Turbo! You are so brilliant! Thank you for being there to translate what I was thinking. I don't know what I'd do without you.

 

[Clete]

Turbo! You are so brilliant! Thank you for being there to translate what I was thinking. I don't know what I'd do without you.

I agree! I think he did an excellent translation job!
Pretty much nailed it, if you ask me.

 

[The Edge]

BTW did you notice that the thread had kind of moved to underling issues untill you brought Bob up again.

Oh how dare me, deardelmar. How dare me bring up Bob Enyart in a thread titled "Is Enyart worshipped like Jesus?"
I must be out of my mind.

 

[Delmar]

Oh how dare me, deardelmar. How dare me bring up Bob Enyart in a thread titled "Is Enyart worshipped like Jesus?"
I must be out of my mind.

I wasn't calling you evil. I didn't bad rep you. (I don't think I ever have) and I don't consider you the enemy, but I do think my point was valid.

 

[The Edge]

noted

 

[beanieboy]

Pass a law then punish some one who violated it more than a decade before it was the law?

So, he wants to make it a law and then execute others who will commit the same sin that he did, who may make the same mistake that he did?

That's very hypocritical.

I have to question a religion that focuses so much attention on putting others to death.

 

[Granite]

So, he wants to make it a law and then execute others who will commit the same sin that he did, who may make the same mistake that he did?

That's very hypocritical.

I have to question a religion that focuses so much attention on putting others to death.

It's not just theonomic Christians, of course, that have a tendency towards sadism.

Islam has a nasty habit of chopping off heads and hands...

 

[Rimi]

Execution would apply to those currently breaking the existing law . . . not punishing the past. For example, if a homo stopped being a homo, then they couldn't and shouldn't be executed. But if a homo continued, then the execution would be just.

 

[beanieboy]

How does that work out with divorce?

If someone divorces and remarries, aren't they committing adultery?

So, wouldnt Enyart be executed?

 

[Clete]

How does that work out with divorce?

If someone divorces and remarries, aren't they committing adultery?

So, wouldnt Enyart be executed?

This is not a genuine question you guys.

Whoever answers it is sillier than the one asking it.

 

[beanieboy]

I honestly don't know.

Why is divorce accepted now? I wasn't many years ago.
Is this against the bible, or has it changed?

(Yes, I know, probably a different thread, but a reader digest version short answer is suffice.)

 

[Rimi]

This is not a genuine question you guys.

Whoever answers it is sillier than the one asking it.

You read my mind.

 

[Yorzhik]

Originally posted by beanieboy
You don't even seem to know what balance is.

I'm only going by your description.

Originally posted by beanieboy
I'm not saying that it is necessary to call someone a slut, and then a perfect lady, because you are contradicting yourself.

Yes, what you describe is contradictory. Thanks for being clear that you understood the idea.

Originally posted by beanieboy
Jesus didn't simply say, "Hey, Zacheus, you stupid shrimp! You are a theif and a liar!"
No. He said, "Zacheus - I would like you to join me to eat." This is equivalent to the whole school calling Lisa a slut, and then Lisa, feeling angry, resentful, unloved, and full of hatred, to come sit at your table - to show her kindness that no one else is. The kids would say, "You are eating with the whore???"

That's what Jesus did.

And what do you imagine that Jesus talked to him about? Did he mock him, and call him names? I'm guessing that he found out about Zacheus. He probably asked him about his family. He asked him what he liked to do for fun. And he probably asked him why he was a tax collector, and doing the things he did. I imagine that Zaccheus said that he was fearful of not providing for his family, or enjoyed wealth, or whatever, but soon discovered that, yes, God loved him, despite what everyone told him, about how he was disgusting, a cheat, and a theif.

A friend of mine once went to a retreat. People there were spirit filled christians, but the HS wasn't really moving. This guy started crying, and he said, "It's because of me! God won't come because of me!" He believed that he wasn't worthy of love. People said, Do you want to accept Jesus? He said yes, and asked God to fill him with his spirit, and immediately started speaking in tongues. He then became a strong spokesperson for God, drawing others to God.

No, your question is: is only showing tough love enough?

Answer from Clete: Of course not, but I have to also tell you that you are disgusting and deserve to die. (not my question. I asking that if one can only show hatred toward another, only tough love, is that enough. I even gave an example - if one only spanks their child, and never encourages them, or is kind to them, or reads to them, is that love?)

The "Of course not" part of the answer that you have already received means that if one thinks sitting down with someone and eating with them will get a response in the same principle of response that Jesus got from Zacchaeus (Zacchaeus said: I will give half my wealth to the poor, Lord, and if I have overcharged people, I will give them back four times as much) then that is what one does.

Go ahead and accuse us of never even trying such a tack, or not trying to do it enough. And after you accuse us you can answer yourself because the answer is we do try that sometimes and it succeeds sometimes. Then you can accuse us of never doing it on TOL, and you can answer yourself again because the answer is that we are nice sometimes on TOL, and it works sometimes. But then you should realize the nature of a debate forum does not lend itself to that situation often.

Originally posted by Yorzhik
Yes, the kindest thing to do to Lisa is call her a slut unrelentingly. That would be a blessing to her.

Originally posted by beanieboy
That would help her how?

I have to tell you? Okay, I'll be nice. The short answer is that she will be ashamed to be a slut and stop being one. Long answer below.

Originally posted by beanieboy
If all of the unsaved are calling her slut, and you simply chime in, and refuse to have anything to do with her, how will that save her?

I have to tell you? Okay, I'll be nice. She will be ashamed to be a slut and stop being one.

Originally posted by beanieboy
If anything, it will show you to be a cruel as the unsaved.

Are you sure? Maybe the unsaved "demonstrate that God's law is written within them, for their own consciences either accuse them or tell them they are doing what is right." You cannot assume that because the unsaved do something that it must be wrong. If I do what is right and call Lisa a slut, and some pagan also calls her a slut because she is one, I cannot judge the pagan if they are not being hypocritical about using that pejorative.

I need to stop using the word "balance" because you confuse it. It is simply a "proper response". When a slut comes to the cafeteria, and ends up sitting with you because no-one else will because of her reputation, you have to weigh your possible responses. If you have the mind of Christ, you can have a "proper response". It has nothing to do with being nice or being mean, it has only to do with what would be best for her for relationship with God.

In these next replies, when I use the phrase "If you know…", I mean that what you know is actually true.

Do you take time to find out about her life?

If you know she's a slut, then you know enough about her life to call her a slut.

Do you know what her family life was like?

If you know she's a slut, then you know enough about her family to call her a slut.

Do you know why she is sexually active?

If you know she's a slut, then you know enough about her reasons to call her a slut.

Do you know about any abuse that was in the family?

If you know she's a slut, then you know enough about her home-life to call her a slut.

Do you know how she feels about herself?

If you know she's a slut, then you know enough about her feelings to call her a slut.

Do you know if she battles with suicide?

If you know she's a slut, then you know enough about her battles to call her a slut.

Do you know if her mother is an alcoholic?

If you know she's a slut, then you know enough about her mother to call her a slut.

What do you know about her? Probably nothing, because you simply call her a slut, and shut down communication before you even begin.

You don't call someone a slut if you don't know that person is a slut. So, "probably nothing" is wrong. And, beanie, you should acknowledge that you are wrong here. You should say, "yes Yorzhik, knowing she was really a slut is knowing something enough to call her a slut. And I was wrong to say 'nothing'."

And simply calling her a slut and shutting down communication is THE WHOLE IDEA (assuming that when you call her a slut she'll stop talking with you). Cutting off communication is a very powerful motivator to get someone to think about what they are doing. Having her think about stopping destroying her life is a good thing. Now, if you think that saying things to her in such a way that she is comfortable talking with her, you certainly aren't talking with her about that which is destroying her life!

Originally posted by beanieboy
I would suggest the same to you. If you can't see what Romans 12 is saying, think that it means that mocking and calling people names is all that God calls for, then it is you that needs to learn about the milk of the bible. Tough love is returning blessing when you are cursed, not simply walking through the streets pointing fingers and throwing your nose in the air.

Of course Romans 12 is not talking about "mocking and calling people names is all that God calls for". You not only do not understand Romans 12, you don't even understand what we are plainly saying to you now. What we are saying to you now is:

Of course not, but I have to also tell you that you are disgusting and deserve to die. (not my question. I asking that if one can only show hatred toward another, only tough love, is that enough. I even gave an example - if one only spanks their child, and never encourages them, or is kind to them, or reads to them, is that love?)

Do you remember what the "Of course not" means?

But let's go even farther. How did Paul avoid violating Romans 12 in his encounter with Peter in Galatians 1? Or how about when he instructed us to cut off communications with someone is 1 Cor 5?

 

[Clete]

Yorzhik,

Excellent post! :BRAVO:

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Yorzhik again." :dang:

 

[Delmar]

So, he wants to make it a law and then execute others who will commit the same sin that he did, who may make the same mistake that he did?

That's very hypocritical.

I have to question a religion that focuses so much attention on putting others to death.

I think you don't get the point. The reason a crime is punishable by death is not so that people will be executed but rather so that people won't do the crime.

 

[Poly]

Yorzhik,

Excellent post! :BRAVO:

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Yorzhik again." :dang:

I got it.

That was awesome, Yorzhik!

 

[julie21]

Yorzhik: And simply calling her a slut and shutting down communication is THE WHOLE IDEA (assuming that when you call her a slut she'll stop talking with you). Cutting off communication is a very powerful motivator to get someone to think about what they are doing. Having her think about stopping destroying her life is a good thing. Now, if you think that saying things to her in such a way that she is comfortable talking with her, you certainly aren't talking with her about that which is destroying her life!

Okay...get the reds ready because I personally find this attitude above deplorable. Sorry Yorzhik.I know there are many here who will agree that it deserved as they have given you already, but I cannot agree.

Yorzhik: Cutting off communication is a very powerful motivator to get someone to think about what they are doing.

I think that cutting off communication leads a lot of 'worldly' people to think, basically "Who gives a fig Newton about their not talking to me. Stuff them!"...and so their life goes on exactly as it did before you stopped communication, especially if the communication was mostly someone calling them 'slut' or similar.Sometimes, it can even move it up a notch or two, out of defiance.

Now, if you think that saying things to her in such a way that she is comfortable talking with you,then you certainly aren't talking with her about that which is destroying her life!

Funny that I have seen it work ...just talking about how they were destroying their lives. I know I am not alone on this. Jesus talked in with the Samaritan woman and the woman caught in adultery in such a way that they felt 'comfortable', about the issues in their lives that were destroying them...and it is generally accepted that it worked for Him.

 

[Johnny]

And simply calling her a slut and shutting down communication is THE WHOLE IDEA (assuming that when you call her a slut she'll stop talking with you). Cutting off communication is a very powerful motivator to get someone to think about what they are doing. Having her think about stopping destroying her life is a good thing. Now, if you think that saying things to her in such a way that she is comfortable talking with her, you certainly aren't talking with her about that which is destroying her life!

Calling her a slut and cutting her off would probably just result in her getting angry at you and further her stereotyping Christians as hateful, spiteful, self-righteous, and judgemental. Why in the WOLRD would she want to become that? She would be just as repulsed by you and your God as you are by her sinfulness. Don't you think she knows that she's wrong? Most sinners do. Deep down, they do. They don't need you or your hate to tell them that they are filthy. They can feel it. They need the love of Jesus, not the hate of man.

Are you telling me calling her a slut is the most loving thing you can do for her? The God of the Universe became a man and let his creation beat him, mock him, spit on him, and nail him to a piece of wood, because he loved us. That's love. Are you telling me the most loving thing you can muster up is a few harsh words for someone who obviously needs the love of Jesus? Sickening.

Let me get this straight, because no one would answer my previous post: It seems that you justify your hatred by claiming that it's really love because the loving thing to do is lead someone toward salvation and that's what hatred does. Is that correct? Then you must assume that hating the unsaved is a more powerful testimony for Christ than loving them?

I'm still dumbfounded as to how a sect of Christians can read Jesus' words, see His life, and see His ministry, and then find it perfectly acceptable to turn around and mock, insult, deride, and hate "in the name of love" because Jesus called the Pharisees hypocrites. Your support is weak. You point to the old testament examples of God hating sinners. Great. I'll point you to old testament examples of God demanding that men women and children be slaughtered. That doesn't make it right for us to demand the same. I think that if God wanted us to follow a doctorine of calling names, derision, hatefulness, self-righteousness, He would have clearly told us so. Instead, in no ambiguous terms, Jesus said to love your enemy and do good to them, love your neighbor, and love God. I'm still not clear about where Jesus mentions hating in His name.

II Timothy 2 "24And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,

25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will."

Gentle:

# Considerate or kindly in disposition; amiable and tender.
# Not harsh or severe; mild and soft: a gentle scolding; a gentle tapping at the window. (dictionary.com)

2 a : TRACTABLE, DOCILE b : free from harshness, sternness, or violence (m-w.com)

 

[ShadowMaid]

Nice answer, Dad!