ECT He shall save His people from their sins

I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Truster said:
I wasn't addressing you, but seeing as you have chosen to reply...wrong. I asked "do you understand by" and that would require the knowledge of the "meaning of the word" and not its application in relation to a nation or person.
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An ancient text has no meaning other than that which the original hearers understood in its original historical-grammatical setting. In other words, Matthew was calling him the new Joshua--he would lead them to another 'land.'
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Interplanner said:
This creation will be shaken; believers inherit an unshakeable kingdom, whether they are Jews or not. You think the problem is resolved in literalism of OT vision, instead of in Christ.

Many, many passages in the OT use the term forever for about 4-5 generations, whether speaking of a good or evil outcome.
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What garbage! Your fairy story forces you to corrupt much of the Bible.

What you term "literalism" is simply taking God at His Word.
 
T

Truster

New member
Interplanner said:
An ancient text has no meaning other than that which the original hearers understood in its original historical-grammatical setting. In other words, Matthew was calling him the new Joshua--he would lead them to another 'land.'
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People like you are so dangerous. You read or hear things and try to repeat them, but because you lack understanding you fail in conveying what you "think" you know.

"Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm".

"The legs of the lame are not equal: so is a parable in the mouth of fools."
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Interplanner said:
For God to fulfill things in Christ is not cancellation. No more than the Seed referred to one person, Christ, not many people, Gal 3:16.
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Seed refers to BOTH one person and many people. One usage of the term does NOT cancel the other.

Pay strict attention to ALL scripture:

Rom 9:6-8 (AKJV/PCE)​
(9:6) Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they [are] not all Israel, which are of Israel: (9:7) Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, [are they] all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. (9:8) That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these [are] not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
​

Notice that in THIS usage the SEED is CLEARLY PLURAL.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Right Divider said:
Seed refers to BOTH one person and many people. One usage of the term does NOT cancel the other.

Pay strict attention to ALL scripture:

Rom 9:6-8 (AKJV/PCE)​
(9:6) Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they [are] not all Israel, which are of Israel: (9:7) Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, [are they] all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. (9:8) That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these [are] not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
​

Notice that in THIS usage the SEED is CLEARLY PLURAL.
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But it is channeled through Christ; that is how it becomes plural, not directly, not genetically, not racially, Jn 1:13. You are completely controlled by your system.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Right Divider said:
I'm not denying the shakable and the unshakable. I'm saying that your "understanding" of them is crap.
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ARe we supposed to take the 'plain meaning' of crap or is it a figure of speech?

Nothing from this earth will last, not the splinter of the surface of the earth known as Judea; nothing.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Right Divider said:
Seed refers to BOTH one person and many people. One usage of the term does NOT cancel the other.

Pay strict attention to ALL scripture:

Rom 9:6-8 (AKJV/PCE)​
(9:6) Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they [are] not all Israel, which are of Israel: (9:7) Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, [are they] all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. (9:8) That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these [are] not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
​

Notice that in THIS usage the SEED is CLEARLY PLURAL.
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Your strict attention mandate applies to you about Gal 3, you see.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Truster said:
People like you are so dangerous. You read or hear things and try to repeat them, but because you lack understanding you fail in conveying what you "think" you know.

"Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm".

"The legs of the lame are not equal: so is a parable in the mouth of fools."
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What's the danger? That you might find out what it originally meant?

Take the word 'saved' for ex., it never means a restored land of Israel in Romans. Or anywhere in Paul that I know of. It joins justification and personal transformation without confusing them.
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Interplanner said:
But it is channeled through Christ; that is how it becomes plural, not directly, not genetically, not racially, Jn 1:13. You are completely controlled by your system.
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Your "interpretation" is perverse and does not come from a plain reading of scripture.

The CONTEXT of John is Christ's coming to HIS PEOPLE.

John 1:11-13 (AKJV/PCE)​
(1:11) He came unto his own, and his own received him not. (1:12) But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, [even] to them that believe on his name: (1:13) Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. ​

Verse 13 is contingent on what came before it.

BUT as many as received him..... those many were SOME of those that where HIS OWN. You clueless unbeliever.
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Interplanner said:
ARe we supposed to take the 'plain meaning' of crap or is it a figure of speech?

Nothing from this earth will last, not the splinter of the surface of the earth known as Judea; nothing.
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Firstly, is English not your first language? YOUR interpretations are CRAP.

Then new heaven and the new earth will still have a NEW JERUSALEM.... guess where it will be.

You are a babbling idiot.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Right Divider said:
Firstly, is English not your first language? YOUR interpretations are CRAP.

Then new heaven and the new earth will still have a NEW JERUSALEM.... guess where it will be.

You are a babbling idiot.
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Your plain meaning is just something you trot out when you have found your favorite proof texts and are scared of what a pile of others actually say. Like your fear of Gal 3:16 about the Seed, and about how it is in the Seed that the seeds exist, not directly.

I'm quite aware of what the NHNE will have or already has. The new city already exists; it is all the believers who have died already, resurrected. It is clearly not the same physicality that we have today because there is no light like the sun and Christ is the temple. At least if you follow the plain meaning. If you jump, then who knows?
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Interplanner said:
Your plain meaning is just something you trot out when you have found your favorite proof texts and are scared of what a pile of others actually say. Like your fear of Gal 3:16 about the Seed, and about how it is in the Seed that the seeds exist, not directly.

I'm quite aware of what the NHNE will have or already has. The new city already exists; it is all the believers who have died already, resurrected. It is clearly not the same physicality that we have today because there is no light like the sun and Christ is the temple. At least if you follow the plain meaning. If you jump, then who knows?
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:kookoo:
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Right Divider said:
:kookoo:
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The city is mentioned in Mt 27, Gal 4 and Heb 11-13 as already existing and connected to us. In 2 Cor 5, Christ is called the new creation (the grammar there does not mean the individual Christian; it means the old things of Judaism have been shed and new have come). Paul says the new creation is what 'matters' while solving the circ vs uncirc issue of Gal 6.

So it is current and vital.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
RD,
If you haven't noticed, you have never answered the 'physicality' thing: God is the light (not the sun) and Christ is the temple (not a structure in Judea) in Rev 21. Why do you never answer this question and go into cartoon mode?
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Interplanner said:
The city is mentioned in Mt 27, Gal 4 and Heb 11-13 as already existing and connected to us. In 2 Cor 5, Christ is called the new creation (the grammar there does not mean the individual Christian; it means the old things of Judaism have been shed and new have come). Paul says the new creation is what 'matters' while solving the circ vs uncirc issue of Gal 6.

So it is current and vital.
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Mr. DingleBerry is now Mr. Equivocation. Good work.

The new heaven and the new earth are BOTH yet future (no matter how badly you twist the scripture).

2Pet 3:13 (AKJV/PCE)​
(3:13) Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
​

Peter was STILL LOOKING FOR them.

Stop embarrassing yourself and accept the truth of scripture instead of your fairy story.
 
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