The Berean
Well-known member
i thought I'd start this thread to discuss any and all sports. :thumb:
I'll start. Is Eli Manning a future Hall of Famer? :think:
I'll start. Is Eli Manning a future Hall of Famer? :think:
General Sports Thread
- Thread starter The Berean
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The Berean
Well-known member
Eli Manning already has 33,000+ passing yards and 220 TDs. He's only 32 and if he plays until he's 39-40 years old he will have 50,000+ yards passing and ~350 TDs. It would be unprecedented for the Hall of Fame not to induct such a QB. Only four QB's have ever passed for 50,000+ yards (Though Bress and Brady will clear 50,000 yards in the near future). Only seven QB's have thrown for 300+ TDs. Only three QB's have thrown for 350 TD's (Brees will make it four soon).
With 2 rings and the numbers he'll rack up I don't see how he won't be. Are there any QBs with 2 rings that are NOT in the HOF?
One of the greats.
The Berean
Well-known member
The only retired QB with at least two Super Bowl rings and not in the Hall of Fame is Jim Plunkett. All the others are in the Hall of Fame.
Bart Starr
Roger Staubach
Terry Bradshaw
Joe Montana
Troy Aikman
John Elway
Brady-still active
Eli- still active
Eventually? Likely, even with his inconsistency, given the numbers he has and will likely amass, as you rightly note. But it would be better for him if he could get back to the SB. Absent that I wouldn't be surprised to see him miss on a first year inclusion, depending on when and who is around him in the inevitable logjam.
Where do you think Adrian Peterson will rank on the list of all-time great RBs by the time he's done? And given the nature of the changes the game is undergoing is the pure RB being phased out? Is Reggie Bush the new model?
I don't know about that.
I watched him lose three straight NLCS's in Pittsburgh.
He won a World Series in Florida (but that shouldn't count because it was against Cleveland, and Cleveland can't win anything....the only reason the Braves won one World Series was because they got to play Cleveland too)
Then in Detroit he took them to the World Series twice and lost both times, and took them to the ALCS this year and lost, and he lost a one game tie-breaker for a wild card.
So, while he did win one World Series, and took teams to the postseason a number of times, he comes across to me as a guy who always had trouble winning the big games.
Look at game 2 and game 6 this year. He yanked Max Scherzer twice when Scherzer was pitching gems each time, and each time the relief pitchers gave up grand slams and the Tigers lost both games. And, how do you only pitch the best pitcher in baseball (Verlander) once in six games?
You forgot Ben Roethlisberger...2 rings - still active.
Also, Roethlisberger is almost a full year younger than Eli Manning even though they were in the same draft class. Roethlisberger is 31, Eli is 32
Career wins as of week 7, 2013
Ben Roethlisberger - 89
Eli Manning - 78
Ben Roethlisberger has 31,499 passing yards, and 198 TD's
Since Roethlisberger is a full year younger (meaning he'll get to play one more year than Eli), has just as many Super Bowl rings as Eli Manning, has one more Super Bowl appearance than Eli Manning, has more wins than Eli Manning.....then using your numbers and logic, Roethlisberger should also get into the HOF?
The Berean
Well-known member
Sure.
General observation for Tet. For years I've heard Peyton had weapons/Brady made decent WRs look great. I think that's always been backwards. I see Brady more as Kobe Bryant and Peyton as Larry Bird.
So how goes it with the greatest qb of all time (Tet's estimation)? Keeping in mind a QBR of 50 is average and 100 is perfect.
Wk/QBR
1. 60.5
2. 24.2
3. 65.5
4. 87.4
5. 16.8
6. 59.6
7. 29.5
That's mostly awful.
Peyton:
Wk/QBR
1. 83.6
2. 89.1
3. 95.4
4. 95.9
5. 93.7
6. 92.9
7. 57.9
Total yearly QBR over 80 since 2006? 4 guys:
Peyton: 4
Brees: 2
Brady: 1
Rogers: 1
So how goes it with the greatest qb of all time (Tet's estimation)? Keeping in mind a QBR of 50 is average and 100 is perfect.
Wk/QBR
1. 60.5
2. 24.2
3. 65.5
4. 87.4
5. 16.8
6. 59.6
7. 29.5
That's mostly awful.
Peyton:
Wk/QBR
1. 83.6
2. 89.1
3. 95.4
4. 95.9
5. 93.7
6. 92.9
7. 57.9
Total yearly QBR over 80 since 2006? 4 guys:
Peyton: 4
Brees: 2
Brady: 1
Rogers: 1
Both Ben Roethlisberger and Eli Manning are members of the 500 Yard Club. Tom Brady and Drew Brees are also in it, but surprisingly there is no Peyton Manning.
Norm Van Brocklin - 554 yards, September 28, 1951
Matt Schaub - 527 yards, November 18, 2012
Warren Moon - 527 yards, December 16, 1990
Boomer Esiason - 522 yards, November 10, 1996
Dan Marino - 521 yards, October 23, 1988
Matthew Stafford - 520 yards, January 1, 2012
Tom Brady - 517 yards, September 12, 2011
Phil Simms - 513 yards, October 13, 1985
Eli Manning - 510 yards, September 16, 2012
Drew Brees - 510 yards, November 19, 2006
Vince Ferragamo - 509 yards, November 26, 1982
Tony Romo - 506 yards, October 6, 2013
Y.A. Tittle - 505 yards, December 26, 1982
Elvis Grbac - 504 yards, November 5, 2000
Ben Roethlisberger - 503 yards, December 20, 2009
What kind of matrix did you use to factor in that cold Massachusetts weather against that warm climate controlled Dome in Indiana?
I can't wait to see Peyton's numbers when it's 0 degrees Fahrenheit with 25 mph winds in Denver.
Got to give kudos to ole Norm Van Brocklin. Not to many QB records are still standing from the old days, but Norm still has the most yards after all these years.
Bird didn't play pro ball in Indiana.
lain: And no one plays outdoors in the NBA. Bird made his team mates better. Kobe played great and made good teams better because of it.
Most QBs don't do as well in extremely cold weather, or rain for that matter. It's no real wonder. Why do you think Tom advanced his teams at home on the strength of his kicker's leg?
As of last year:
Peyton Manning – Career Stats in Games Under 40 Degrees:
292-453, 3553 yards, 23 TDs, 14 INT (64.5%, 7.8 ypa, 92.5 QB rating)
That's actually pretty decent for anyone.
Peyton Manning – Last Five Seasons: Stats in Games Under 40 Degrees:
165-235, 2132 yards, 16 TDs, 9 INT (70.2%, 9.1 ypa, 105.1 QB rating)
And that's darn good. But he's getting older. Maybe it will get to him. Maybe. But I wouldn't bet on it.
Source
True, though Moon chose to leave the record on the table in a game when he looked to easily be capable of taking it.
Is that because Kobe has 5 rings and Larry only has 3?
Robert Horry has more rings than either of them. So he must be better, right?
Robert Horry has more rings than either of them. So he must be better, right?
No, I was comparing the 5-3 Kobe to Bird ring ratio with the 3-1 Brady to Peyton ring ratio.
I will concede there is a chance Peyton Manning "might" be a better QB than Tom Brady during the REGULAR season.
However, Peyton Manning fails miserably when you compare the two in the post season.
Peyton Manning has a 6-6 record in the postseason when his team gives up 21 or less points. Let's take a look at some of the other great QB's records from the postseason when their teams gave up 21 or less points:
Dan Marino 7-1
John Elway 10-1
Tom Brady 12-1
Joe Montana 12-2
Steve Young 4-1
Brett Favre 11-1
Bart Starr 8-1
John Unitas 6-2
Terry Bradshaw 13-2
Bob Griese 6-2
Roger Staubach 11-4
Fran Tarkenton 6-2
Troy Aikman 10-1
Ben Roethlisberger 6-0
Peyton Manning is 6-6. That's embarrassing. You can't blame the defense.
To put it into perspective, Elway, Brady, Favre, Aikman, Starr, Marino, and Roethlisberger are a combined 64-6 when their teams gave up 21 or less. Peyton, at 6-6 has as many loses as all of them combined, except they have 58 more wins.