Did God die on the cross?

[Vail Lifted]

The Trinitarian idea is that Jesus has two natures both God and man. And it would be absurd to say that God died. After all we are explicitly told that God only has immortality (deathlessness). Therefore it could only be Jesus' other nature, the nature of man, that died.

The Trinitarian claim is that the son of God is eternally begotton(contradiction) meaning that there never was a time that he was not. The son of God is a member of the Trinity and therefore can not die.

So how is it that God gave His own son to die on the cross(Rom 8:32) if the son cannot die because he is eternally God and the second person of trinity?

 

[Jacob]

The Trinitarian idea is that Jesus has two natures both God and man. And it would be absurd to say that God died. After all we are explicitly told that God only has immortality (deathlessness). Therefore it could only be Jesus' other nature, the nature of man, that died.

The Trinitarian claim is that the son of God is eternally begotton(contradiction) meaning that there never was a time that he was not. The son of God is a member of the Trinity and therefore can not die.

So how is it that God gave His own son to die on the cross(Rom 8:32) if the son cannot die because he is eternally God and the second person of trinity?

It sounds like you are confused by false doctrine.

 

[Aimiel]

The Trinitarian idea is that Jesus has two natures both God and man. And it would be absurd to say that God died. After all we are explicitly told that God only has immortality (deathlessness). Therefore it could only be Jesus' other nature, the nature of man, that died.

The Trinitarian claim is that the son of God is eternally begotton(contradiction) meaning that there never was a time that he was not. The son of God is a member of the Trinity and therefore can not die.

So how is it that God gave His own son to die on the cross(Rom 8:32) if the son cannot die because he is eternally God and the second person of trinity?

It isn't a Trinitarian idea, the doctrine comes from the fact that Jesus said: "And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive; I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan."

 

[beloved57]

The Trinitarian idea is that Jesus has two natures both God and man. And it would be absurd to say that God died. After all we are explicitly told that God only has immortality (deathlessness). Therefore it could only be Jesus' other nature, the nature of man, that died.

The Trinitarian claim is that the son of God is eternally begotton(contradiction) meaning that there never was a time that he was not. The son of God is a member of the Trinity and therefore can not die.

So how is it that God gave His own son to die on the cross(Rom 8:32) if the son cannot die because he is eternally God and the second person of trinity?

The Son of God I believe is made up of two components in His pre existence, the Eternal Word of God Jn 1:1 and the eternal begotten Son of God the Mediator. So His Divinity as the Word of God couldnt die, but that which was eternally begotten as mediator could die and did, yet while still in Union with His Divinity as the Word of God which didnt die.

 

[Vail Lifted]

The Son of God I believe is made up of two components in His pre existence, the Eternal Word of God Jn 1:1 and the eternal begotten Son of God the Mediator. So His Divinity as the Word of God couldnt die, but that which was eternally begotten as mediator could die and did, yet while still in Union with His Divinity as the Word of God which didnt die.

To beget means to father a child/offspring.

Now, since "eternally begotten" is a man made idea and cannot be found in Scripture we must go with the actual meaning of begotten. And if we then understand the proper meaning, "eternally begotten" becomes a contradiction within itself.

If Jesus is begotten it means that in some point of time God fathered him

 

[Vail Lifted]

It isn't a Trinitarian idea, the doctrine comes from the fact that Jesus said: "And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive; I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan."

"which was dead and is alive"... God can not die.

 

[beloved57]

To beget means to father a child/offspring.

Now, since "eternally begotten" is a man made idea and cannot be found in Scripture we must go with the actual meaning of begotten. And if we then understand the proper meaning, "eternally begotten" becomes a contradiction within itself.

If Jesus is begotten it means that in some point of time God fathered him

You aren't reasoning from scripture but from man. Thats a problem

Sent from my LGMP260 using Tapatalk

 

[Vail Lifted]

You aren't reasoning from scripture but from man. Thats a problem

Sent from my LGMP260 using Tapatalk

The problem is that "eternally begotten" can't be found in Scripture. Its a man-made idea so interpreting its meaning is impossible from a Scriptural standpoint.

 

[beloved57]

The problem is that "eternally begotten" can't be found in Scripture. Its a man-made idea so interpreting its meaning is impossible from a Scriptural standpoint.

Scripture supports it. It certainly sets forth Christ as having been begotten prior to having been sent, which supports eternally begotten Jn 3:16

16 [FONT=&quot]For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

[/FONT]He had to be already begotten in order for God to give Him as only begotten.

1 Jn 4:9

[FONT=&quot]In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God [/FONT]sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.

Again this indicates He was the only begotten Son who was sent into the world. He wasnt born of mary until after He was sent.

 

[Caino]

No! Only the temporary mortal tabernacle that the Son took on while he was incarnate on earth died. The person of the Son didn't die, he returned on his own volition as he said he would in a similar form recognizable to those who knew him before.

 

[beloved57]

No! Only the temporary mortal tabernacle that the Son took on while he was incarnate on earth died. The person of the Son didn't die, he returned on his own volition as he said he would in a similar form recognizable to those who knew him before.

Christ Jesus the Man Mediator died, in that capacity He was a Man 1 Tim 2:5

5 [FONT=&quot]For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;[/FONT]

 

[beloved57]

"which was dead and is alive"... God can not die.

Christ who was a Man did die. As God He didnt die. The Christ I know and believe in was both God and Man. Now do you believe Jesus Christ was both God and Man ?

 

[Caino]

The Son of God took the experience of being human with him, his human body died and returned to the dust.

Obviously the incarnate God didn't die.

 

[beloved57]

The Son of God took the experience of being human with him, his human body died and returned to the dust.

Obviously the incarnate God didn't die.

Your son of god is different from mine, My Son of God His Body never saw corruption Acts 2:27

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans serif]Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, [/FONT]neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans serif]The word for corruption here is:

[/FONT]
διαφθοράdiaphthora =

1. corruption, destruction
   
2. in the NT that destruction which is effected by the decay of the body after death

διαφθοράdiaphthora

 

[Caino]

Your son of god is different from mine, My Son of God His Body never saw corruption Acts 2:27

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans serif]Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, [/FONT]neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans serif]The word for corruption here is:

[/FONT]
διαφθοράdiaphthora =

1. corruption, destruction
   
2. in the NT that destruction which is effected by the decay of the body after death

διαφθοράdiaphthora

We just have a difference of opinion. There are as many different opinions about religion as their are religionists.

I believe the angels asked for his body to be instantly returned to the elements so that they didn't have to witness it's corruption. There is simply no need for the Son to take the human form back to his place on high. He has the same form that he had before coming down.

 

[Aimiel]

"which was dead and is alive"... God can not die.

The fact that He called Himself, in that verse: "The First and the Last," says that He is, indeed: God. Your understanding will remain darkened until you learn Who He is: God, in The Flesh.

 

[beloved57]

caino

We just have a difference of opinion.

Yes and different Son of Gods

 

[Vail Lifted]

Scripture supports it. It certainly sets forth Christ as having been begotten prior to having been sent, which supports eternally begotten Jn 3:16

16 [FONT="]For God so loved the world, that [B]he gave his only begotten Son,[/B] that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

[/FONT][/COLOR]He had to be already begotten in order for God to give Him as only begotten.

1 Jn 4:9

[COLOR=#000000][FONT="]In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God [/FONT]sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.

Again this indicates He was the only begotten Son who was sent into the world. He wasnt born of mary until after He was sent.

John 1:6 There came a man who was sent from God. His name was John.

Anyone could take that to mean that John existed with God before he was sent from God.

 

[beloved57]

John 1:6 There came a man who was sent from God. His name was John.

Anyone could take that to mean that John existed with God before he was sent from God.

Not the same, not even close. Jesus the word existed in the beginning with God before creation. Jn 1:1 and He had Glory with Him before the world began Jn 17:5 Your example was kinda corny

 

[Vail Lifted]

Christ who was a Man did die. As God He didnt die. The Christ I know and believe in was both God and Man. Now do you believe Jesus Christ was both God and Man ?

I believe Christ was made Lord as a man. I believe the Father (God) dwelt fully in the man so that if you seen the man Jesus you seen God (the Father).