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Your works will not save you. They will condemn you.
Can a Christian lose their salvation
- Thread starter Bright Raven
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You should be careful not to let your editing skills hide the truth from you.
Thanks for admitting you haven't been a believer for some time now, Hoping!
Repent! Turn to Christ, let Him save you!
Stop relying on your own works to try to get yourself to heaven!
Believe and you will be saved!
It is written..."And he, (Jesus), said unto them, (the apostles), Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature." (Mark 16:15)
Thar happened quite a while before Paul's conversion.
Obedience to God is not a work of the Law that Paul preached against.
Loving God with all our mind, heart and strength will not bring condemnation.
Loving our neighbors as we love ourselves will not bring condemnation.
Your misunderstanding actually outlaws doing good to others and loving God above anything else.
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Once again, you are clueless to the fact that Paul was called by Jesus with NEW information.
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You are as dumb as a box of rocks.
Clearer information, perhaps, but not new.
But I am an obedient to God "box of rocks".
And I rejoice !
You really should stop condemning obedience to God.
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You are quite incorrect, once again.
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I don't. You are lying AGAIN, you poor lost sinner.
You were addressed here.
AMEN!
How is this supposed to address what I said?
There's nothing "bipolar" about it, Hoping.
No, I mean the accusation that you made against me when you said this:
Paul was addressing your accusation against me that I am somehow accommodating for sin. The passage is Paul's rebuttal to that accusation, and it's used by people like myself and others as a litmus test to see if we're teaching the right doctrine, because our doctrine SOUNDS like we're saying "it's ok to sin," when that's not what we teach.
His rebuttal to such an accusation completely undermines your position that Christians don't sin, because it PRESUPPOSES that Christians CAN and DO sin, in that the accuser is challenging what Paul is saying by asking if he is teaching that it's OK to sin, since we're under grace!
Paul's rebuttal is such that He CONDEMNS someone sinning after considering that they're under grace!
Since when has God forbidden something and it become impossible to do?
Thanks for making my point!
AMEN!
And sinners who have called upon the name of the Lord to be saved are SAVED from that death.
THAT'S HOW IT WORKS, HOPING!
That's rich, coming from you!
No, you have to assume that. That is not stated anywhere in scripture.
Nope. Neither are you.
False.
Liar.
It will be too late for you, by then, Hoping.
Repent!
You can know.
Simply call on Christ to save you from ALL your sins, ask Him to forgive you, and believe that God has raised Him from the dead, and you WILL BE SAVED!
"I am doing..."
You believe that you can do something to earn salvation.
Your faith is in your works, and not in Christ! You cannot earn salvation, Hoping.
For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.
Bible Gateway passage: Ephesians 2:8, Ephesians 2:9 - New King James Version
For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,www.biblegateway.com
Not if I'm dead to the law.
Or do you not know, brethren (for I speak to those who know the law), that the law has dominion over a man as long as he lives? For the woman who has a husband is bound by the law to her husband as long as he lives. But if the husband dies, she is released from the law of her husband. So then if, while her husband lives, she marries another man, she will be called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from that law, so that she is no adulteress, though she has married another man. Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another—to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God. For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death. But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.
Bible Gateway passage: Romans 7:1-6 - New King James Version
Freed from the Law - Or do you not know, brethren (for I speak to those who know the law), that the law has dominion over a man as long as he lives? For the woman who has a husband is bound by the law to her husband as long as he lives. But if the husband dies, she is released from the law of...www.biblegateway.com
I am delivered from the law, having died to what I was held by, so that I should (SHOULD) serve in the newness of the Spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
SHOULD.
Not "will."
Certainly, as Paul says in verses 7-12, that I would not have known sin except through the law. As such, I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died, for sin deceived me and killed me. Therefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy and just and good.
Notice what Paul said next, starting a new paragraph, speaking in present tense, and not some narrative tense that you've come up with to try to shoehorn your beliefs into the text:
Has then what is good become death to me? Certainly not! But sin, that it might appear sin, was producing death in me through what is good, so that sin through the commandment might become exceedingly sinful. For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am carnal, sold under sin. For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do. If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good. But now, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find. For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice. Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. I find then a law, that evil is present with me, the one who wills to do good. For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man. But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? I thank God—through Jesus Christ our Lord!So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin.
Bible Gateway passage: Romans 7:13-25 - New King James Version
Law Cannot Save from Sin - Has then what is good become death to me? Certainly not! But sin, that it might appear sin, was producing death in me through what is good, so that sin through the commandment might become exceedingly sinful. For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am carnal, sold...www.biblegateway.com
Your "narrative" belief completely ignores the context in which he's framing what he says.
"Sin revived and I died when the commandment came."
"Sin WAS producing death in me through what is good."
"BUT NOW it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me."
"In me nothing good dwells."
"if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me."
"I [am] the one who wills to do good."
"I delight in the law of God according to the inward man."
"I see another law in my members."
"So then (from here on, now that I've been delivered from this body of death by Jesus Christ our Lord, AKA "saved") with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin."
I'm not serving two masters. I am serving God, while my flesh serves the law of sin.
Indeed it was.
And if one is saved (apart from works), righteousness is imputed to him, making him righteous.
What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh? For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt. But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works: "Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven, and whose sins are covered; Blessed is the man to whom the Lord shall not impute sin."
Does this blessedness then come upon the circumcised only, or upon the uncircumcised also? For we say that faith was accounted to Abraham for righteousness. How then was it accounted? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised. And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also, and the father of circumcision to those who not only are of the circumcision, but who also walk in the steps of the faith which our father Abraham had while still uncircumcised. For the promise that he would be the heir of the world was not to Abraham or to his seed through the law, but through the righteousness of faith. For if those who are of the law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise made of no effect, because the law brings about wrath; for where there is no law there is no transgression. Therefore it is of faith that it might be according to grace, so that the promise might be sure to all the seed, not only to those who are of the law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all (as it is written, “I have made you a father of many nations”) in the presence of Him whom he believed—God, who gives life to the dead and calls those things which do not exist as though they did; who, contrary to hope, in hope believed, so that he became the father of many nations, according to what was spoken, “So shall your descendants be.” And not being weak in faith, he did not consider his own body, already dead (since he was about a hundred years old), and the deadness of Sarah’s womb. He did not waver at the promise of God through unbelief, but was strengthened in faith, giving glory to God, and being fully convinced that what He had promised He was also able to perform. And therefore “it was accounted to him for righteousness.” Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, but also for us. It shall be imputed to us who believe in Him who raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead, who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was raised because of our justification.
Bible Gateway passage: Romans 4 - New King James Version
Abraham Justified by Faith - What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh? For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for...www.biblegateway.com
Thus, a sinner can be made righteous through faith!
Again, Paul answered this accusation you're leveling against my position, that it somehow "allows more sin" because we're under grace. It doesn't.
What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it? Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. For he who has died has been freed from sin. Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him. For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. Likewise you also, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord. Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in its lusts. And do not present your members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin, but present yourselves to God as being alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace.
Bible Gateway passage: Romans 6:1-14 - New King James Version
Dead to Sin, Alive to God - What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it? Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? Therefore we were buried...www.biblegateway.com
The truth is that you are not saved, and therefore not a Christian, and you will face God's wrath on the Day of Judgement.
Repent! Before it's too late!
Which Gospel?
Which Gospel?
Thanks for your opinion.
You really should stop condemning obedience to God.
I am glad you can at least see the truth that any doctrine that accommodates sin is not of God.
My conversion to believer, Christianity, lover of God, lover of neighbor, hater of sinfulness, is just one step to an eventual reading of my name from the book of life.
If I go back into sinfulness, my conversion to all of that will be for naught.
I await God's judgement.
The one taught since the resurrection of Christ; that Jesus died for our sins and was raised alive the third day from the tomb. (1 Cor 15:1-4)
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I don't. You habitual liar. Stop sinning!