Bob Enyart - Open Theism - Biblical Events Not Happening?

[Philetus]

Oh yes it will!
Shortened days are not shortened years, sir, and His Word has explained what Jesus meant, in several places, for the diligent to learn His plan from.
The sun, moon, and stars will cease to shine for one third of the twenty four hour day, making the days of that last half of the tribulation sixteen hour days so that all flesh will not perish frin the great heat, when the sun shines seven times brighter -as seven days- and the moon shines seven times brighter -as the sun in one day.
And all brought about because the earth will be moved out of it's orbit, turned upside down, and skipping about as a hunted roe, and staggering as a drunken man.
It is not possible that the seven years will be one day less than seven, to fullfill the teaching in the schoolmaster, which Schoolmaster is the living oracles committed only to the Jews, as seen by Moses, to copy as the Truth of the heavenly Plan, to teach His One Way for all Adamkind to be redeemed; which plan was complete from the beginning of creation.
Open Thiesm is ignorance of God's Word and blasphemy against His Word.

Such language. You're smarter than God. (Echos of nicer than God God God......) But, wouldn't that make a great movie?

___________

So lets see: 24 hour days become 16 hour days but 7 years can't be one less day than 7?

Do the math, and then we will move on to physics.

Open Thiesm? Never heard of it.

After spelling we can work on literature if you want.

 

[thelaqachisnext]

Such language. You're smarter than God. (Echos of nicer than God God God......) But, wouldn't that make a great movie?

___________

So lets see: 24 hour days become 16 hour days but 7 years can't be one less day than 7?

Do the math, and then we will move on to physics.

Open Thiesm? Never heard of it.

After spelling we can work on literature if you want.

Such mockery and scoffing -but no looking into the Scriptures to see if these things be so. You made up your opinion on shortened years without Scriptural backing, and looking into Scripture shows that the hours of the days will be shortened by one third, for the reason that all flesh shall not perish by the great heat of the seven times hotter sun and moon.


I count the horse's teeth instead of sitting in a forum typing out opinions -or do you need that explained?

The perfected sons of God are taken into the temple behind shut doors to celebrate the consecration of their priesthood for one week of seven days, as oracled in the Law given to Moses -as patterns of heavenly truths.
In the Oracles, the pattern is in Leviticus 8.

Meanwhile, seven years -which is also called one week in Scripture- passes, on earth.
The seven years are also called "one hour", in Revelation, and that one hour is also called the "night" before the dawning of the thousand year reign, which is also called "one Day", in Scripture; and the last half of that night before the dawning of the Day of one thousand years is also called one half hour, in Revelation, in which no one goes in or out of the temple in heaven, and in that black night no man can work on earth and no one will be saved in that last half "hour" of the seven days, which are seven years, which is the "black night" of the thousand year Day.


I am not in the mood to do your Bible study for you, as you are not interested, anyway, but any search of the Word proves these things to be so.

C.S. Lewis got it, and wrote great stories about time 'dilation'.

Days, weeks, years, hours -go study and see.
-and this thread is about the open thiesm of MAD proponents.

 

[Philetus]

Such mockery and scoffing -but no looking into the Scriptures to see if these things be so. You made up your opinion on shortened years without Scriptural backing, and looking into Scripture shows that the hours of the days will be shortened by one third, for the reason that all flesh shall not perish by the great heat of the seven times hotter sun and moon.


I count the horse's teeth instead of sitting in a forum typing out opinions -or do you need that explained?

The perfected sons of God are taken into the temple behind shut doors to celebrate the consecration of their priesthood for one week of seven days, as oracled in the Law given to Moses -as patterns of heavenly truths.
In the Oracles, the pattern is in Leviticus 8.

Meanwhile, seven years -which is also called one week in Scripture- passes, on earth.
The seven years are also called "one hour", in Revelation, and that one hour is also called the "night" before the dawning of the thousand year reign, which is also called "one Day", in Scripture; and the last half of that night before the dawning of the Day of one thousand years is also called one half hour, in Revelation, in which no one goes in or out of the temple in heaven, and in that black night no man can work on earth and no one will be saved in that last half "hour" of the seven days, which are seven years, which is the "black night" of the thousand year Day.


I am not in the mood to do your Bible study for you, as you are not interested, anyway, but any search of the Word proves these things to be so.

C.S. Lewis got it, and wrote great stories about time 'dilation'.

Days, weeks, years, hours -go study and see.
-and this thread is about the open thiesm of MAD proponents.

C.S. Lewis had a great imagination and had some really good things to say. But his take on time leaves something to be desired.

Why would I want you to do my bible study? Jerry Jenkins and Tim LaHaye have done most of yours. So, please, don't try to explain any more.

Not mocking ... just a sarcastic way of saying: You sure can complicate the heck out of simple things.

Maybe the language of scripture is itself a declaration or at least an admission of sorts that we don’t know in great detail or exactly HOW God will settle the future but we DO KNOW that God will and when He does it will be cosmic.

Why don't you take your shot at the post above where I say that I don't take all that ‘moon to blood’ stuff literally? It leaves me wondering exactly what does all your teeth counting have to do with Open Theism? You think because you have literally interpreted apocalyptic language you can tell us exactly what God will do? You don't just interpret it, you speak it and make no earthly sense at all. What may in fact be madness is any attempt to count the horse's teeth and think you know horses.

 

[ApologeticJedi]

Oh yes it will!
Shortened days are not shortened years, sir

Calling the great tribulation a "day" is a figure of speech that occurs regularly in the Bible. The people listening to Jesus would have assumed he was talking about the Tribulation as a whole, not that he was speaking of daylight. I think it unlikely it refers to shortened days here since that is not in context with what Jesus is speaking. You are taking a passage from the other side of the New Testament, by a different author, and claim that is the context.

Note, I agree that it's possible, but unlikely. I take it at face value and see that Jesus was saying (going on the contextual reading of the passage) that the entire tribulation is going to be shortened. I don't feel it needs to be explained away as you do.

It is not possible that the seven years will be one day less than seven....

If it was possible for Jesus to avoid the cross (as Jesus himself claimed) then it is possible for God to have mercy and not fulfill the full time span of the Tribulation, just as he stopped the Angel of destruction from fulfilling the full span of prophecy in David's time.

After all, the prophecy of the Tribulation has already been altered once - for the 70th week of Daniel did not come directly after the 69th.

 

[ApologeticJedi]

Such mockery and scoffing -but no looking into the Scriptures to see if these things be so. You made up your opinion on shortened years without Scriptural backing, and looking into Scripture shows that the hours of the days will be shortened by one third, for the reason that all flesh shall not perish by the great heat of the seven times hotter sun and moon.

He's pointing out that if the span of a day changes, then either;

1) the span of the year changes also (ie. if we hold to a year being 360 days, as Revelation seems to, then instead of lasting 8640 hours, the Tribulation will be shortened to 5760 hours)

or - if we hold to a year being the time it takes the earth to circumnavigate the sun...


2) we have serious reason to question the Bible's concept of 1260 days being a half-way mark (the earth will have only made two orbits in that time frame).

Nevermind the fact that all life on earth would probably die instantly if the earth had a 33% increase in velocity of spin - the view that the actual day will be shortened still alters the year.

 

[ApologeticJedi]

I am not in the mood to do your Bible study for you

Why is it that your theology has left you so bitter and left so little love in your heart for your neighbor, let alone your brother?

 

[Nimrod]

1 - Can God NOT have the rapture (as it is a prophesied event)?
2 - Can God cancel out the tribulation period (a prophecy) and not have it occur?

Dispensationalism BARF. There will be no "rapture", no "tribulation" as the way dispensationalists describe it.

Go to Gary Demar's website and get educated on the errors of dispensationalism.

Deconstructing Dispensationalism

Near or Eminent

 

[purfle]

One commentary says that "when they repented, the position in which they stood towards God's righteousness was altered. So God's mode of dealing with them must alter accordingly, if God is not to be inconsistent with His own immutable character of dealing with men according to their works and state of heart, taking vengeance at last on the hardened impenitent, and delighting to show mercy on the penitent"

 

[Philetus]

He's pointing out that if the span of a day changes, then either;

1) the span of the year changes also (ie. if we hold to a year being 360 days, as Revelation seems to, then instead of lasting 8640 hours, the Tribulation will be shortened to 5760 hours)

or - if we hold to a year being the time it takes the earth to circumnavigate the sun...


2) we have serious reason to question the Bible's concept of 1260 days being a half-way mark (the earth will have only made two orbits in that time frame).

Nevermind the fact that all life on earth would probably die instantly if the earth had a 33% increase in velocity of spin - the view that the actual day will be shortened still alters the year.

:up: Sometimes the harder one looks the harder it is to see the simple truth.

You have a 'knack' for saying it with such grace. Good post!

 

[thelaqachisnext]

Why is it that your theology has left you so bitter and left so little love in your heart for your neighbor, let alone your brother?

Are you speaking not of "love" but of sucking up to false teachers and their doctrine? I haven't found an interest in actually seeing what the Word says from those in MAD when I make reference passages lists, and have been asked to not make long posts -which any post becomes when explaining the reasons from Scripture, using Scripture that MAD docttrine is false, and the posts are in general not even read by many MAD doctrne posters, who come back and repeat that which is refuted soundly as if it has never been refuted with Scripture. If a person wants to go search the Scriptures by being a good Berean they will find the Truth of the Word in the Scriptures for themselves, which Truth is contradicted by MAD doctrine.


And as to 'love', I've received not a little mocking and name-calling and false accusations as to my personal character from many MAD posters here, a sport the immature MAD doctrine followers seem to exist to practice on this board, who cannot defend their doctrine when challenged, but resort to ridicule and mocking, and I have been called, here, among other things: "idiot; fool; liar; satanist; witch; which I have never returned in like manner, but I do continue to rebuke the false doctrines of MAD.
I do not mock you personally, but I do rebuke the false teaching of MAD -and it does get tiresome, so I am not really long-suffering, but I do it to help point those who may be being seduced by the false teachings of MAD away from the Once for all delivered to the Saints Faith, to see they can trust and believe the Word of God about Jesus Christ, as delivered in Matthew, Mark, Luke and John, as the One Gospel brought into the world for all nations.

 

[thelaqachisnext]

C.S. Lewis had a great imagination and had some really good things to say. But his take on time leaves something to be desired.

Why would I want you to do my bible study? Jerry Jenkins and Tim LaHaye have done most of yours. So, please, don't try to explain any more.

Not mocking ... just a sarcastic way of saying: You sure can complicate the heck out of simple things.

Maybe the language of scripture is itself a declaration or at least an admission of sorts that we don’t know in great detail or exactly HOW God will settle the future but we DO KNOW that God will and when He does it will be cosmic.

Why don't you take your shot at the post above where I say that I don't take all that ‘moon to blood’ stuff literally? It leaves me wondering exactly what does all your teeth counting have to do with Open Theism? You think because you have literally interpreted apocalyptic language you can tell us exactly what God will do? You don't just interpret it, you speak it and make no earthly sense at all. What may in fact be madness is any attempt to count the horse's teeth and think you know horses.

Okay -I will do some Scripture explaining, working through it for you -if you are at all interested in checking out the references- to show why I believe the way I do -but I cannot at the moment, as hubby needs me to help him get some things done that are pressing.
But first, briefly: I do not read those men you named and I've been saved for 38 years and do my own Bible searching when men say things, to prove if they be so, cause my sis taught me to prove all things by the Word when I was born again in Spirit.

YHWH did give me the answer to Psalm 37 when I was memorizing it and praying it daily and asking Him "When", when I was vexed in spirit while the filth of immorality plagued us when Clinton was President and his doings were gleefully reported daily, which were a shame to mention; and our minds and our children's minds and our grandchildren's minds were bombared with that filth daily by all media outlets, and were inescapable.

He spoke Psalm 75:2, into my spirit in answer to that prayer every time I called out "When"? and I did not understand at that time that He was giving me the exact answer I was asking for, though, as He quietly spoke it into my Spirit each time I asked Him "When"?, I was quieted.
When I was looking up something in Hebrew many months later I discovered that He had used His Word to tell me the answer exactly; "When I rapture the Church then I will vindicate my people and remove all the wicked". Psalm 75:2,3 tells us that He will "laqach" the Church before He vindicates them on the wicked of earth and removes all the wicked in the second consumation of sin on earth, which Enoch also prophesied about when He prophesied the flood to come, which Jude quotes, from that time which is coming, from Enoch's prophesy.

He also gave me to understand -by study of His word- that the rapture is the time of the perfecting of our bodies so that we can be glorified and stand before Him as priests in His temple, and that all the saints who are waiting in heaven since Jesus' ascension when He took them from hell below, "leading captivity captive and ending the first death when they were born again in Spirit [perfected, as the author of Hebrews says, in 12] and taken to Zion above to wait for their perfected bodies and all those who have departed their bodies since the ascension will all receive together, at the same time, at His ingathering of the harvest of Pentecost, which is called in Psalm 50.

Isaiah 26:19-21
Psalm 50;
Numbers 10:1-7;
Leviticus 8,
all tell the story of the "perfecting" of our bodies at that time of the call to gather the saints together unto Him, to enter into His Temple and shut their doors while the wrath of God [the indignation of Isaiah 26:21], is passed on earth.

Jesus says to watch and pray that we be counted worthy to escape all these things and to stand before the Son of Man, which is to be priests unto Him in His temple, celebrating our consecration as priests in our glorified bodies -and in John 14:1-3, He promises to come get us to be with Him forever where He is, after going to the cross to make us a personal dwelling "place" for the Father's glory. When He calls the ingathering, we depart from the midst of earth [if we are indeed His own by the second birth], and we rise on the second trump of the two [Numbers 10: 1-7], if living in our bodies at that time on earth, and enter into His Temple and shut our doors behind us and celebrate for seven days -which is a week of years back on earth.
All these things are taught in the Living Oracles commited only to the Jews as His One Plan for our Redemption and remaking as sons of God in the second Man's image, joined to His One Living Spirit by the adoption.


C.S. Lewis was not the first to write stories of space-time dilation, as a Chinese story written some tousands of years ago told of a space ship trip made by a person which trip was 75? years long, to him, but 300? years had passed on earth when he returned -my memory's fuzzy on the exact years he named.

 

[Philetus]

Psalm 37
A Psalm of David.
1 Do not fret because of evildoers,
Nor be envious of the workers of iniquity.
3 Trust in the LORD, and do good;
Dwell in the land, and feed on His faithfulness.
5 And He shall bring it to pass.
7 Rest in the LORD, and wait patiently for Him;
Do not fret because of him who prospers in his way,
Because of the man who brings wicked schemes to pass.
8 Cease from anger, and forsake wrath;
Do not fret—it only causes harm.
11 But the meek shall inherit the earth,
And shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.
18 The LORD knows the days of the upright,
And their inheritance shall be forever.
19 They shall not be ashamed in the evil time,
And in the days of famine they shall be satisfied.
21 But the righteous shows mercy and gives.
26 He is ever merciful, and lends;
And his descendants are blessed.
34 Wait on the LORD,
37 Mark the blameless man, and observe the upright;
For the future of that man is peace.

You seem to be preoccupied and delighted with knowing just when and how God is going to do away with the people you don’t like. A common trait among those who are focused on the escapeism of the end-times and can't seem to wait for the great planet earth to become the 'late planet earth". (Need I remind you that King David was a murderer and an adulterer, and yet a man after God’s own heart?) I'm sure there were righteous people who thought his misbehavior signaled the end of days. And from what we glean from Revelations, Christians of the first century BCE thought the distribution of the temple was the end of the world. Today the list is endless. But, God remains faithful to HIS own agenda.

I took the liberty to post the above from Psalm 37 not to minimize the importance of the other (what God will do) but to balance your view with what the scripture says is our part in the whole enterprise of God’s reign.

Don’t fret over evildoing; fretting only CAUSES harm; Dwell in the land (keep your feet on the ground maybe?); Cease from anger and forsake wrath; wait patiently for Him; AND HE WILL BRING IT TO PASS!

I suppose it is rather MAD to suggest as PS 72:2 does: “When I choose the proper time,
I will judge uprightly”) can be left entirely to God’s omnicompetence.

I don't at all mind being called MAD by you (even though I'm not sold on some of Enyart's views either).

MAD: Matters (for the) Almighty’s Discretion.

You need to lighten up on your enemies while God and others work toward their redemption. It remains to be seen who will and who won’t repent and be saved. Don’t get the cart before the horse just to count teeth. He might bite you.

1 Corinthians 2:11
For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the man's spirit within him? In the same way no one knows the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God.

1 Corinthians 8:2
The man who thinks he knows something does not yet know as he ought to know.

2 Timothy 2:19
Nevertheless, God's solid foundation stands firm, sealed with this inscription: "The Lord knows those who are his," and, "Everyone who confesses the name of the Lord must turn away from wickedness."

2 Timothy 2: 23 Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels. 24 And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead, he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. 25 Those who oppose him he must gently instruct, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth, 26 and that they will come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken them captive to do his will.

Who knows? It remains to be seen. When? I’m not convinced that even God has yet decided exactly when. (We know He will.) He is patient with us as He is with all others. His patience is for our repentance as well as theirs. You aren’t the only one who seeks God’s wisdom behind closed doors, but you might be among the many who think they know more than they in fact know.

 

[Philetus]

Some might think us MAD: Miffed (at the) Almighty's Discretion, but we are only open to His agenda for redemption.

 

[ApologeticJedi]

Are you speaking not of "love" but of sucking up to false teachers and their doctrine?

I’m speaking about you and why there is such hatred in your heart. I view your viewpoint as wrong as you view mine. I consider your viewpoint the result of “false teachers” as much as you view mine, but I speak to you with civility and not hatred because I know that we are to love our neighbor, let alone a fellow brother in Christ. If you have been deceived - all the more reason to show you love.

That you have such bitterness and hatred in your heart is evidence to me ythat there is some severe problems with your theology. Good theology shouldn’t leave a man a bitter crusted ball. Whatever your problems, you should know that I will go to bat for you if needed.

If you span a battlefield and see two men in a foxhole together, it doesn’t mean that they agreed on everything.

I haven't found an interest in actually seeing what the Word says from those in MAD when I make reference passages lists, and have been asked to not make long posts -which any post becomes when explaining the reasons from Scripture, using Scripture that MAD docttrine is false, and the posts are in general not even read by many MAD doctrne posters, who come back and repeat that which is refuted soundly as if it has never been refuted with Scripture. If a person wants to go search the Scriptures by being a good Berean they will find the Truth of the Word in the Scriptures for themselves, which Truth is contradicted by MAD doctrine.

I’ve searched the scriptures for years trying to prove Mid-Acts Dispensationalism wrong. I thought I had many times, using much the same bad arguments that I've seen you make. I have still searched the scriptures almost daily for the past eight or nine years that I have believed some form of Mid-Acts Dispensationalism.

Typically when people say, “Well you just need to search scriptures” as evidence to their position, it means that they don’t know the way to back up what they say. Is this the case here?

Incidentally, this post has more to do with Open Theism than mid-act dispensationalism.

And as to 'love', I've received not a little mocking and name-calling and false accusations as to my personal character from many MAD posters here, a sport the immature MAD doctrine followers seem to exist to practice on this board, who cannot defend their doctrine when challenged, but resort to ridicule and mocking, and I have been called, here, among other things: "idiot; fool; liar; satanist; witch; which I have never returned in like manner, but I do continue to rebuke the false doctrines of MAD.

If it’s retaliatory, perhaps I’d understand, but I must confess I haven’t seen anyone in this thread speak to you in this manner. And further, I know that I have not so I am not currently buying your explanation.

Also, I haven't read all your posts, but I've read a few, and you don't seem to have any conclusive evidence against mid-acts dispensationalism as you claim. Perhaps I've missed all your best evidence and you can give your three best arguments against for my benefit and I'll see if I have a reasonable answer for it - or if my answers for them are far-fetch (or even if I have no credible answers).

 

[Lon]

No, a liar is someone who intends to do something other than he says he will do. For instance, lets say I told someone I was going to destroy them (in, I don't know, how about 40 days?), knowing the future exhaustively that I was not. THAT would be a liar. You wouldn't trust a God that would do that, would you?


If the Settled View were true, then God declared evil from His own hands at creation. Do you understand the implications of this?

Hello Yorzhik,

If I am a car maker, and I know the engine will quite running after 200k mi. What if I know it will quit working after only 130k mi if the guy doesn't do proper maintenance?

Going futher, what if I'm the salesman and the guy brings in the same car type with an engine that has seized at 130k, is it wrong for me to sale the car to him?

God is impeccable even in the SV. Your extrapolation is faulty.

This was a turn around from the original question though. If God can change His mind as in revoking the promise to Noah because we suddenly aren't worth saving, then this question really needs some serious addressing.

In Him

 

[Yorzhik]

Lonester, don't take this reply too harshly, I'm just talking as if this is an extension of the ongoing conversation in this thread and the niceties of introductory conversation is complete.

Hello Yorzhik,

If I am a car maker, and I know the engine will quite running after 200k mi. What if I know it will quit working after only 130k mi if the guy doesn't do proper maintenance?

Going futher, what if I'm the salesman and the guy brings in the same car type with an engine that has seized at 130k, is it wrong for me to sale the car to him?

Within every example that I've seen from people who uphold the SV, they always have to add an OV component or their example is absurd.

In your example, the salesman knows the future exhaustively, and would know that the car would stop 130k mi. Why did you mention the 200k mi's? Because that was "possible" if the guy took care of his car? Not in the SV it isn't - you added an OV thing. The 200k mi figure is a lie if the saleman tells the guy he will go 200k mi if he takes care of his car knowing the guy won't take care of the car and knowing the car will stop at 130k mi.

God is impeccable even in the SV. Your extrapolation is faulty.

What are you even talking about? Extrapolation is faulty? Neither of our examples is faulty because we both used an OV example!

Now, if you're going to say my example is faulty, then you will have to show either that God did not know how Ninevah would react, or that God did not say He would destroy them in 40 days. It's one or the other. Either that, or whoever was making Jonah say Nineveh was going to be destroyed in 40 days was just a puppet to something bigger.

I just threw that last line in as a joke... but the more I think about it the more that is what you have to embrace because it is the only logical conclusion with a Settled View. A joke. HA! You call our God small - fine, our God is small and your God is a joke.

This was a turn around from the original question though. If God can change His mind as in revoking the promise to Noah because we suddenly aren't worth saving, then this question really needs some serious addressing.

In Him

The point of God changing prophecy is so God can do something good. It's the reason God changes prophecy - goodness, love, mercy, justice. All the fear you have of a capricious God in the OV is misplaced if you are willing to understand that God is good.

So we have to ask; Does the SV God define good by what He does or does He do good because He chooses to do good?

 

[Lon]

Hello Yorzik,

Lon[..]ster, don't take this reply too harshly, I'm just talking as if this is an extension of the ongoing conversation in this thread and the niceties of introductory conversation is complete.

That's fine, I'll continue however, if you are alright with that.

Within every example that I've seen from people who uphold the SV, they always have to add an OV component or their example is absurd.

In your example, the salesman knows the future exhaustively, and would know that the car would stop 130k mi. Why did you mention the 200k mi's? Because that was "possible" if the guy took care of his car? Not in the SV it isn't - you added an OV thing. The 200k mi figure is a lie if the saleman tells the guy he will go 200k mi if he takes care of his car knowing the guy won't take care of the car and knowing the car will stop at 130k mi.

I can appreciate that you think this, but it is incorrect, or you have misconstrued the SV position to either a generality.

God designed man to live for ever if he followed the one prohibition. It is not His fault in design, or providence.

That salesman is not guilty simply because the guy already knows he's messed up the car and is willing to shell out the $ for a new one. It is 'ownership.' He's a stand-up guy and owns up to his own dilemma. He's buying a new car.

It doesn't matter what the salesman knows, he is impeccable. If he were taken to court by the guy, he'd lose (at least in a literal interpretation of the law).

What are you even talking about? Extrapolation is faulty? Neither of our examples is faulty because we both used an OV example!

In the above explanation, hopefully this assessment is made clear.

Now, if you're going to say my example is faulty, then you will have to show either that God did not know how Ninevah would react, or that God did not say He would destroy them in 40 days. It's one or the other. Either that, or whoever was making Jonah say Nineveh was going to be destroyed in 40 days was just a puppet to something bigger.

When you read Jonah chapter 4, what is Jonah's disposition? Why is he mad? What did he understand about this judgement? What does that imply to you?

I just threw that last line in as a joke... but the more I think about it the more that is what you have to embrace because it is the only logical conclusion with a Settled View. A joke. HA! You call our God small - fine, our God is small and your God is a joke.

Then even your God would be a joke, because OV is birthed out of traditional theology. It would be similar if I told Catholics something similar. They may have went wrong in theology, but they were and many still are His church. They may be wrong, but I would not say that the God they believe in is a joke, because He is my God.

The point of God changing prophecy is so God can do something good. It's the reason God changes prophecy - goodness, love, mercy, justice. All the fear you have of a capricious God in the OV is misplaced if you are willing to understand that God is good.

So we have to ask; Does the SV God define good by what He does or does He do good because He chooses to do good?

He does 'good' because it is His nature. He is not judged by you or I. How would you be able to measure perfection with imperfect tools, and imperfect knowledge?
Rather, we are compared to Him because we are imperfect.

I don't believe God has given an unconditional prophecy that was not fulfilled. If it was unfulfilled, it was 'conditional' or not prophecy at all. Ninevah: Conditional implied (Jonah definitely knew it was implied-He had a tizzy over it).

 

[thelaqachisnext]

Psalm 37
A Psalm of David.
1 Do not fret because of evildoers,
Nor be envious of the workers of iniquity.
3 Trust in the LORD, and do good;
Dwell in the land, and feed on His faithfulness.
5 And He shall bring it to pass.
7 Rest in the LORD, and wait patiently for Him;
Do not fret because of him who prospers in his way,
Because of the man who brings wicked schemes to pass.
8 Cease from anger, and forsake wrath;
Do not fret—it only causes harm.
11 But the meek shall inherit the earth,
And shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.
18 The LORD knows the days of the upright,
And their inheritance shall be forever.
19 They shall not be ashamed in the evil time,
And in the days of famine they shall be satisfied.
21 But the righteous shows mercy and gives.
26 He is ever merciful, and lends;
And his descendants are blessed.
34 Wait on the LORD,
37 Mark the blameless man, and observe the upright;
For the future of that man is peace.

You missed the Holy Spirit's teaching by leaving out major doctrine of that Psalm.

The Heritage of the Righteous and the Calamity of the Wicked
A Psalm of David.
Do not fret because of evildoers,
Nor be envious of the workers of iniquity.
2 For they shall soon be cut down like the grass,
And wither as the green herb.

3 Trust in the Lord, and do good;
Dwell in the land, and feed on His faithfulness.
4 Delight yourself also in the Lord,
And He shall give you the desires of your heart.

5 Commit your way to the Lord,
Trust also in Him,
And He shall bring it to pass.
6 He shall bring forth your righteousness as the light,
And your justice as the noonday.

7 Rest in the Lord, and wait patiently for Him;
Do not fret because of him who prospers in his way,
Because of the man who brings wicked schemes to pass.
8 Cease from anger, and forsake wrath;
Do not fret--it only causes harm.

9 For evildoers shall be cut off;
But those who wait on the Lord,
They shall inherit the earth.
10 For yet a little while and the wicked shall be no more;
Indeed, you will look carefully for his place,
But it shall be no more.
11 But the meek shall inherit the earth,
And shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.

12 The wicked plots against the just,
And gnashes at him with his teeth.
13 The Lord laughs at him,
For He sees that his day is coming.
14 The wicked have drawn the sword
And have bent their bow,
To cast down the poor and needy,
To slay those who are of upright conduct.
15 Their sword shall enter their own heart,
And their bows shall be broken.

16 A little that a righteous man has
Is better than the riches of many wicked.
17 For the arms of the wicked shall be broken,
But the Lord upholds the righteous.

18 The Lord knows the days of the upright,
And their inheritance shall be forever.
19 They shall not be ashamed in the evil time,
And in the days of famine they shall be satisfied.
20 But the wicked shall perish;
And the enemies of the Lord,
Like the splendor of the meadows, shall vanish.
Into smoke they shall vanish away.

21 The wicked borrows and does not repay,
But the righteous shows mercy and gives.
22 For those blessed by Him shall inherit the earth,
But those cursed by Him shall be cut off.

23 The steps of a good man are ordered by the Lord,
And He delights in his way.
24 Though he fall, he shall not be utterly cast down;
For the Lord upholds him with His hand.

25 I have been young, and now am old;
Yet I have not seen the righteous forsaken,
Nor his descendants begging bread.
26 He is ever merciful, and lends;
And his descendants are blessed.

27 Depart from evil, and do good;
And dwell forevermore.
28 For the Lord loves justice,
And does not forsake His saints;
They are preserved forever,
But the descendants of the wicked shall be cut off.
29 The righteous shall inherit the land,
And dwell in it forever.

30 The mouth of the righteous speaks wisdom,
And his tongue talks of justice.
31 The law of his God is in his heart;
None of his steps shall slide.

32 The wicked watches the righteous,
And seeks to slay him.
33 The Lord will not leave him in his hand,
Nor condemn him when he is judged.

34 Wait on the Lord,
And keep His way,
And He shall exalt you to inherit the land;
When the wicked are cut off, you shall see it.
35 I have seen the wicked in great power,
And spreading himself like a native green tree.
36 Yet [fn1] he passed away, and behold, he was no more;
Indeed I sought him, but he could not be found.

37 Mark the blameless man, and observe the upright;
For the future of that man is peace.
38 But the transgressors shall be destroyed together;
The future of the wicked shall be cut off.

39 But the salvation of the righteous is from the Lord;
He is their strength in the time of trouble.
40 And the Lord shall help them and deliver them;
He shall deliver them from the wicked,
And save them,
Because they trust in Him.

I did not see this until tonight and have not responded for that reason, but I will return and talk of this matter more in relation to what I posted earlier...

 

[thelaqachisnext]

...
I suppose it is rather MAD to suggest as PS 72:2 does: “When I choose the proper time,
I will judge uprightly”) can be left entirely to God’s omnicompetence.
...

.

Philetus, in Psalm 37 the theme is of the wicked passing away and the meek inheriting the earth, which is the time of the second consumation of sin on earth which was foretold by Enoch the seer, prophet, and scribe, before the flood, and Jude, a sibling of Jesus Christ, quoted from Enoch on that time which is yet to come.

Jesus referenced it, also, when He was asked what the sign of His coming was, for His reply was that "This generation shall not pass away until...and He delineated all the things that must come to pass on the earth before "This generation passes away ", as they did pass away from earth in the first consumation of sin on earth by the flood, "when they were all taken away".
The "one generation" of the children of wrath, "all the wicked", demons and rebel men who willfully rebel and all rebel angels who rule over this earth from the heavenly realm of it's dominion [which belonged to Adam, which Adam lost], will not pass away from the earth until the time appointed from the beginning of creation comes -which time is already appointed and will come in it's pre-appointed season.

You used the passage in Psalm 75 from a faulty translation, and that is sloppy of you, as the concordance is easy to find and use; and the original is not "choose" as in "deciding later", for there is no "time" word in the original passage meaning to decide later in any sense, in context, but "laqach" of the "congregation", as in "taking away" =to Himself;
Psalm 75:2, in the Hebrew: laqach mow`ed shaphat meyshar
"Laqach" is translated these ways in the AV -from blb.org:

1) to take, get, fetch, lay hold of, seize, receive, acquire, buy,
bring, marry, take a wife, snatch, take away
a) (Qal)
1) to take, take in the hand
2) to take and carry along
3) to take from, take out of, take, carry away, take away
4) to take to or for a person, procure, get, take possession of, select, choose, take in marriage, receive, accept
5) to take up or upon, put upon
6) to fetch
7) to take, lead, conduct
8) to take, capture, seize
9) to take, carry off
10) to take (vengeance)
b) (Niphal)
1) to be captured
2) to be taken away, be removed
3) to be taken, brought unto
c) (Pual)
1) to be taken from or out of
2) to be stolen from
3) to be taken captive
4) to be taken away, be removed
d) (Hophal)
1) to be taken unto, be brought unto
2) to be taken out of
3) to be taken away
e) (Hithpael)
1) to take hold of oneself
2) to flash about (of lightning)

"mow`ed" is the congregation of YHWH, which is comprised of the OT testament saints who were taken to Zion above to wait for their regenerated bodies when Jesus ascended, and led them out of Sheol below to Zion above, and of NT saints -since His resurrection and ascension, who live on earth since the resurrection of the LORD in their own bodies until they depart the body to go to Zion above to wait for their resurrection bodies of regeneration also, for only those resurrected in Chrsit "Firstfruits" of the harvest of sons of God of the first harvest have been resurrected in their regenerated bodies, in Christ "The" Firstfruits, when He raised them at His resurrection, top fulfill the Living Oracle in the Law of "first of firstfruits", after Passover.
mow`ed: 1) appointed place, appointed time, meeting
a) appointed time
1) appointed time (general)
2) sacred season, set feast, appointed season
b) appointed meeting
c) appointed place
d) appointed sign or signal
e) tent of meeting

AV - congregation 150, feast 23, season 13, appointed 12, time 12,
assembly 4, solemnity 4, solemn 2, days 1, sign 1, synagogues 1; 223


"shaphat" is to vindicate, punish -and He will "laqach" the congregation from the midst of earth and then "vindicate His own by His wrath poured out and He will "plead with all flesh on earth"
"shaphat" ;1) to judge, govern, vindicate, punish
a) (Qal)
1) to act as law-giver or judge or governor (of God, man)
a) to rule, govern, judge
2) to decide controversy (of God, man)
3) to execute judgment
a) discriminating (of man)
b) vindicating
c) condemning and punishing
d) at theophanic advent for final judgment
b) (Niphal)
1) to enter into controversy, plead, have controversy together
2) to be judged
c) (Poel) judge, opponent-at-law (participle)

AV - judge (v) 119, judge 60, plead 11, avenged 2, condemn 2,
execute 2, judgment 2, defend 1, deliver 1, misc 3; 203

meyshar is 1) evenness, uprightness, straightness, equity
a) evenness, level, smoothness
b) uprightness, equity
c) rightly (as adv)

AV - equity 4, uprightly 3, uprightness 3, right things 2, agreement 1,
aright 1, equal 1, right 1, righteously 1, sweetly 1, upright 1; 19

 

[CiY127]

He does 'good' because it is His nature. He is not judged by you or I.

When you decided to believe and trust in God you did so because you judged Him trustworthy. He made us logical, thinking beings; then, He went about proving His goodness. I do not believe that God is good because the Bible says so. I believe the Bible because God has proved that what it says about Him is true. I have judged Him faithful to His Word; therefore, His Word is true.

Heb 11:11 Through faith also Sara herself received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of a child when she was past age, because she judged him faithful who had promised.

Agape,
CiY