Abortionist Tiller's Murder in Perspective

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Jefferson

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Abortionist Tiller's Murder in Perspective

This is the show from Monday June 1st, 2009.

BEST QUOTE OF THE SHOW:
If child killing were not legal, George Tiller would not be dead. If premarital sex and extramarital sex were not legal, ten thousand murder victims with adultery as a factor would not be dead. You know, liberals say, "If it saves one life it's worth it." They're such liars. They're such liars.

SUMMARY:

* BEL Does Not Condone, but...Have you seen the extraordinary vigilante worksheet at American Right To Life's site? This program is based on that material. Abortionist George Tiller is the most recent and notorious of the four abortionists killed in America, after Barnett Slepian, John Britton, and David Gunn. God has granted everyone the right of self defense to use an escalation of force up to lethal action to protect oneself and one's neighbor from unjust, imminent harm and death. Of course abortionists have unjustly slaughtered countless innocent children. Yet here at Bob Enyart Live we do not condone the murder of Tiller, but we are thankful that he will never kill another child. The typical abortionist kills more than four people by lunchtime, yet the vigilantes who killed these four abortionists were unjustified. The ARTL Abortion Vigilante Worksheet uses the principles which establish the right of self defense and at the same time condemn vigilantism and the killing of abortionists. Jesus observed that those who live by violence will perish by violence (Mat. 26:52) as the New Testament further states, "He who kills with the sword must be killed with the sword" which command is described as "the faith of the saints" (Rev. 13:10). Widespread injustice like slavery, the holocaust, and abortion undermine the tranquility that societies (and even the perpetrators) desire; and as violence begets itself, these crimes against humanity bring about predictable eruptions of violence.

* Liberals Can't Condemn Liberals: "If I were like a liberal, or a liar like most U.S. politicians, I would say, 'I am personally against killing abortionists, but who am I to impose my morality on others?' But that would be disgusting. If I were a liberal, I would say to pro-choicers, let's work together to make abortionist killings rare, but that would be disingenuous. If I were a like a liberal, I would deny the obvious truth, and say Sunday's killing is not murder; it's simply a very late-term abortion. But I am not a liberal, and I have the obligation to follow the standard of truth and integrity presented by Jesus Christ. Liberals cannot even theoretically be condemned by their own materialistic and 'scientific' worldview, for neither survival of the fittest, physics, nor any of the physical laws employ the concepts of right and wrong. Conversely, a Christian can be condemned by his standard, if he violates the principles of Jesus Christ." -Bob Enyart

* Denver's NBC Affiliate 9News: took the unusual step of uploading the raw footage of their interview with Bob Enyart regarding abortionist George Tiller's murder. Perhaps they think that presenting the raw footage, rather than as customary the answers to the reporter's questions, presents the pro-life side in a bad light. But here at BEL we're thankful that everything said is true, justifiable and urgent.

Today's Resource: Non-Christians: If you write and ask, we will send you for free our Mount Moriah DVD examining the powerful historic and geographic evidence for the resurrection of Jesus Christ! Pro-lifers, you can get the Focus on the Strategy I & II two DVD combo (for only $22.99 for yourself or give it as a gift, and with our standard 90-day BEL money-back guarantee) containing Bob Enyart's blockbuster analysis of pro-life and Christian political strategy. Focus on the Strategy, advertised by other ministries as the DVD of the Century, is the blockbuster analysis of Christian political strategy, filmed before a live audience of 300 Christian activists in which Bob Enyart reveals the presentation he gave at Focus on the Family. And the sequel, film festival finalist Focus on the Strategy II, with its startling video and audio clips (including licensed video) which DVD many Christian leaders have given extraordinary endorsements as the must see video for everyone who wants to end "legalized" abortion.
 
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Granite

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Is this an example of that Christian moral relativism that was mentioned earlier?
 

chatmaggot

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I watched the video of NBC that is labeled as "raw footage" above. Is there a precedence for a news station to do this?

I have never seen a news broadcast where they post the "raw footage". I know Bob mentions...

Perhaps they think that presenting the raw footage, rather than as customary the answers to the reporter's questions, presents the pro-life side in a bad light.

as his reason as to why they might have done it that way. Honestly, I can't think of any other reason why they would have done so. It was almost like they hoped that Bob would say something that they could point to in order to paint CRTL as conspirators in the murder of Tiller.

The video was just somewhat odd to watch from a news web site.
 

chatmaggot

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Another point in regards to the "raw footage".

Is that web only footage...or is that the footage they used for the actual news broadcast?
 

Granite

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God has granted everyone the right of self defense to use an escalation of force up to lethal action to protect oneself and one's neighbor from unjust, imminent harm and death. Of course abortionists have unjustly slaughtered countless innocent children. Yet here at Bob Enyart Live we do not condone the murder of Tiller, but we are thankful that he will never kill another child.

Uh huh.

This is a classic loves me/loves me not situation: we have the right to defend the innocent, buuuuuuuuuuuuuut you shouldn't kill abortionists. We're sorry Tiller was murdered buuuuuuuuuuuuuut we're glad he'll never perform another abortion.

Any kind of equivocation when it comes to this situation is unacceptable. Providing a straight answer shouldn't be so difficult.
 

drbrumley

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God has granted everyone the right of self defense to use an escalation of force up to lethal action to protect oneself and one's neighbor from unjust, imminent harm and death. Of course abortionists have unjustly slaughtered countless innocent children. Yet here at Bob Enyart Live we do not condone the murder of Tiller, but we are thankful that he will never kill another child.

Uh huh.

This is a classic loves me/loves me not situation: we have the right to defend the innocent, buuuuuuuuuuuuuut you shouldn't kill abortionists. We're sorry Tiller was murdered buuuuuuuuuuuuuut we're glad he'll never perform another abortion.

Any kind of equivocation when it comes to this situation is unacceptable. Providing a straight answer shouldn't be so difficult.

Seemed straight up to me.
 

ApologeticJedi

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This is a classic loves me/loves me not situation: we have the right to defend the innocent, buuuuuuuuuuuuuut you shouldn't kill abortionists. We're sorry Tiller was murdered buuuuuuuuuuuuuut we're glad he'll never perform another abortion.

You would have had to difficulty seeing Martin Luthar King's non-violence logic as well.
 

Johnny

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Jefferson said:
God has granted everyone the right of self defense to use an escalation of force up to lethal action to protect oneself and one's neighbor from unjust, imminent harm and death. Of course abortionists have unjustly slaughtered countless innocent children.
The logical extension is:

(A) If BEL believes God has granted everyone the right of self defense (or defense of a neighbor) in the case of unjust, imminent harm and death AND
(B) If BEL condones that which he believes God grants AND
(C) If abortionists are unjustly killing babies, THEN
(D) BEL should condone the actions of Tiller's murderer in the name of defense of an innocent life.

Does anyone disagree?

*I am only going on Jefferson's text of the show.
 

ApologeticJedi

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Total non-sequitar and inaccurate to boot.

Perhaps I misunderstood but I believe you were saying you had a hard time understanding why it was okay to oppose someone (the abortionist) but not kill him. Yet those are the exact same beliefs that MLK believed in.

I'll qoute you again:

we have the right to defend the innocent, buuuuuuuuuuuuuut you shouldn't kill abortionist

If that's what you are saying then it was neither a non-sequitar nor inaccurate. If not ... please explain what you meant.
 

Lighthouse

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The logical extension is:

(A) If BEL believes God has granted everyone the right of self defense (or defense of a neighbor) in the case of unjust, imminent harm and death AND
(B) If BEL condones that which he believes God grants AND
(C) If abortionists are unjustly killing babies, THEN
(D) BEL should condone the actions of Tiller's murderer in the name of defense of an innocent life.

Does anyone disagree?

*I am only going on Jefferson's text of the show.
Apparently you don't know what imminent means, either.

Was Tiller in the process of performing an abortion, or was he prepping for one, etc. at the moment Roeder shot him?

The answer is, "No." Therefore was no imminent harm to an unborn child at the moment Roeder killed Tiller.
 

fool

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The logical extension is:

(A) If BEL believes God has granted everyone the right of self defense (or defense of a neighbor) in the case of unjust, imminent harm and death AND
(B) If BEL condones that which he believes God grants AND
(C) If abortionists are unjustly killing babies, THEN
(D) BEL should condone the actions of Tiller's murderer in the name of defense of an innocent life.

Does anyone disagree?

Spot on.
Do right and risk the consequences.
 

ApologeticJedi

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The logical extension is:

(A) If BEL believes God has granted everyone the right of self defense (or defense of a neighbor) in the case of unjust, imminent harm and death AND
(B) If BEL condones that which he believes God grants AND
(C) If abortionists are unjustly killing babies, THEN
(D) BEL should condone the actions of Tiller's murderer in the name of defense of an innocent life.

Does anyone disagree?

*I am only going on Jefferson's text of the show.

What baby was about to be killed at that church service Tiller was attending?
 

fool

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Apparently you don't know what imminent means, either.

Was Tiller in the process of performing an abortion, or was he prepping for one, etc. at the moment Roeder shot him?

The answer is, "No." Therefore was no imminent harm to an unborn child at the moment Roeder killed Tiller.

BS
Tiller killed 60,000 people and he was going to work on Monday.
Now his shop is closed.
Roeder is a hero that sacraficed his freedom so that others might live.
The only reason the rest of us don't do what he did is because we're not willing to make the same sacrafice.
 

Johnny

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What baby was about to be killed at that church service Tiller was attending?
So had the act been performed it as Tiller was walking into his abortion clinic, would it then be condonable?

Assuming the clinic had normal hours, and patients had appointments, Tiller would have been scheduled to murder in less than 24-hours. Does that not qualify as imminent threat of death to the fetuses?

Imagine a hostage situation: "This person will die in 24 hours unless X demands are met" -- is lethal force not condonable in this case because the implementation of the lethal plan isn't in progress yet?

I'm just asking.
 
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