Which Adam are you in?

[musterion]

Man is identified by God either in Adam in his falleness, or Christ in His righteousness. There is no third option and no middle ground. It's one or the other. The life of Adam is of dust, flesh and death. The eternal life of Christ is of God and Spirit (1 Cor 15:45).

It is not a remade, renewed, or regenerated first Adam who God sees when He sees the believer. That Adam counts for nothing. The believer is counted as cut free and dead to the first Adam in order to be counted as alive from the dead in the last Adam, Christ,“Who is the image of the invisible God, the Firstborn of every creature” (Colossians 1:15).

All of us are identified with an Adam - either the first or the last, but not both.

The only way to be certain of being in Christ, and not in Adam, is to believe the only saving Gospel of the grace of God: that Christ died for our sins, was buried, and rose again the third day for our justification. Believing any salvation message which differs from that cannot save you but leaves you condemned in the first Adam, no matter how nice, polite, friendly, charitable, prayerful, devout and loving you may be.

 

[Robert Pate]

Man is identified by God either in Adam in his falleness, or Christ in His righteousness. There is no third option and no middle ground. It's one or the other. The life of Adam is of dust, flesh and death. The eternal life of Christ is of God and Spirit (1 Cor 15:45).

It is not a remade, renewed, or regenerated first Adam who God sees when He sees the believer. That Adam counts for nothing. The believer is counted as cut free and dead to the first Adam in order to be counted as alive from the dead in the last Adam, Christ,“Who is the image of the invisible God, the Firstborn of every creature” (Colossians 1:15).

All of us are identified with an Adam - either the first or the last, but not both.

The only way to be certain of being in Christ, and not in Adam, is to believe the only saving Gospel of the grace of God: that Christ died for our sins, was buried, and rose again the third day for our justification. Believing any salvation message which differs from that cannot save you but leaves you condemned in the first Adam, no matter how nice, polite, friendly, charitable, prayerful, devout and loving you may be.

The way I see it, physically, we are still in Adam. Those that believe in Jesus are spiritually in Christ. We are both sinners and saints at the same time. Catholicism is an attempt to regenerate the old Adam by the works of the law. This is why we must be changed, 1 Corinthians 15:52.

 

[musterion]

The way I see it, physically, we are still in Adam.

Physically, for now, the believer is indeed still anchored in flesh. Thankfully, the flesh counts for nothing and profits nothing. What counts is his identity before God and that is found in the Son via the Gospel of grace.

 

[jamie]

Physically, for now, the believer is indeed still anchored in flesh.

But the flesh is dead. We are not influenced by dead flesh.

 

[Hannibal Flavius]

Good post, and I am always thinking of this subject, '' what exactly is Adam?''

What we are made up of is explained in so many ways that it gets confusing at time.

Hagar and Sarah~ Galatians
…29At that time, however, the son born by the flesh persecuted the son born by the Spirit. It is the same now. 30But what does the Scripture say? “Expel the slave woman and her son, for the slave woman’s son will never share in the inheritance with the free woman’s son.” 31Therefore, brothers, we are not children of the slave woman, but of the free woman.…

If Christ is the New Adam, wouldn't this mean that the old Adam is still present? And if Christ is the New Adam, is Adam a spirit that is within us in order to guide us daily?

If Christ became a new Adam and obtained a new bride by his side being pierced where the water and blood spilled out to create a new bride for this new Adam, was the story of the first Adam like this? Adam was lain down in a sleep of death so that a bride could be taken from his own body, and the two became one and they were called,'' Adam.'' Was Adam a male spirit inside a bride of flesh? I think he was and I think the references to the left eye is where the spirit of Adam would dwell, and the spirit of Eve in the right eye of flesh. But my thoughts of this are always going back and forth. I think that we are of Adam, and we are of Eve and the serpent, but there is a cause for a new Adam, and a cause to cast out the bondswoman and her son.

 

[john w]

Survey Romans 5:12 KJV. Paul is no longer dealing with sins(plural), but He is dealing with the source, "indwelling" sin. And Romans 5:12 KJV is speaking of identification, with whom we are historically identified, as all humanity "in Adam."When Adam sinned and thereby died to God, "positionally,"I died with Adam-dead. When he became flesh, so did I in him. When he was judged, I was also judged in him.


Despite what your SOF may have taught you, unlike the by product of sin, sins(plural),which can be forgiven(1 Cor. 15:1-4.....reconciliation-death of Christ-debt of sins paid), sin cannot be forgiven-it would still be sin. Sin(singular), who we are "in Adam," must be judged/condemned. For eg., a forgiven thief, murderer, rapist.....is still a murderer, thief, rapist................ Hence, sin had to be condemned/judged in death, as it is written:

"...God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for SIN(emphasis mine-sin, singular, not sins), condemned SIN(emphasis mine) in the flesh."Romans 8:3 KJV.

Thus, my sins, plural, were forgiven by the principle of substitution, "in my behalf," "for," ...


"...Christ died for our sins..."..1 Cor 15:3 KJV/"...gave himself for our sins....".. Gal. 1:4 KJV

But our sin. singular, who we are in Adam, was condemned/judged by the principle of identification...

2 Cor. 5:21 KJV "...to be SIN(emphasis mine) for us..."


Again, sins(plural) can be forgiven, but sin(singular), cannot be forgiven-it must be judged/condemned. That is, the sin nature, who I was "in Adam"(1 Cor. 15:22), was not forgiven at Calvary. My/our then future sins were forgiven, "Christ died for our sins"-plural-emphasis mine-1 Cor. 15:3 KJV... but I, as the "old man" "in Adam," Romans 6:6 KJV, Eph. 4:22 KJV, Col.3:9 KJV, the cause/source of those sins, was not, and cannot be forgiven. Sin must be judged/condemned, and it was at Calvary, the Lord Jesus Christ taking our place, and our judgment!!!! Get it, folks?


.. "For he(God the Father-emphasis mine) hath made him(the Son of God-emhasis mine) to be sin for us...."2 Cor. 5:21 KJV



"For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh..." Romans 8:3 KJV

Thus, while the Lord Jesus Christ was on the altar/cross, being made a curse for us, God the Father laid all of my/our as-yet-uncommitted sins upon Him, and His death by blood for those sins, brought about my/our reconciliation-"reconciled by his death"(Romans 5:10 KJV-reconciliation is not justification), freed me/us from the penalty of sin. Thus, while the Lord Jesus Christ was on that cross, God the Father identified(the meaning of the word "baptize")me/us, in my/our life of sin "in Adam," "all die," with the Saviour, who was made to be that sin-again, 2 Cor. 5:21 KJV. In Him/Christ, I died to sin-dead. In my death unto sin in the Lord Jesus Christ's death, I was freed/let loose/redeemed from all that I was in the "first man Adam,"1 Cor. 15:45 KJV, and was re-created in the "last Adam,"1 Cor. 15:45 KJV, as a new creature in Christ....Romans 6:5 KJV, 2 Cor. 5:17 KJV, Eph. 2:10 KJV, Galatians 2:20 KJV.....

Thus, in sum:

-all my/our sins were forgiven via the principle of substitution..1 Cor. 15:3 KJV

-my/our sin was condemned/judged via the principle of identification 2 Cor. 5:21 KJV


The Lord Jesus Christ did not die for sin, but for sins. Being made sin, our sin, He was judged, condemned, and crucified in our place.

Justice served....trial over....we are dead....no re-trying a dead man........................


Good news! Get it?

And quit trying to resuscitate a dead man, wolves, you religious drones.....

 

[musterion]

But the flesh is dead. We are not influenced by dead flesh.

It is not literally dead, so don't come here preaching the demonic lie of eradicationism.

God only COUNTS the old man as having died; he does not figure into nor impacts the believer's complete forgiveness and justification. However, Paul repeatedly emphasized that the old man is still a force the believer has to put off; were the old man truly "dead and gone" the way you mean, there would be nothing left to put off.

If you know nothing of that struggle...well...

 

[jamie]

God only COUNTS the old man as having died; he does not figure into nor impacts the believer's complete forgiveness and justification.

I said, "But the flesh is dead. We are not influenced by dead flesh."

Paul's teaching was that you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you.

But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. (Romans 8:9)​

Those in the flesh do not have eternal life.

 

[musterion]

I said, "But the flesh is dead. We are not influenced by dead flesh."

How "dead" can it be if...

Eph 4:22-24

Titus 2:12-13

Gal 5:16

Those exhortations are all pointless and useless if it is indeed literally dead.

Now be silent, perverse untaught woman.

 

[jamie]

Eph 4:22-24

Titus 2:12-13

Gal 5:16

Those exhortations are all pointless and useless if it is indeed literally dead.

Yes, the exhortations are no doubt pointless and useless to you.

 

[daqq]

Good post, and I am always thinking of this subject, '' what exactly is Adam?''

What we are made up of is explained in so many ways that it gets confusing at time.

Hagar and Sarah~ Galatians
…29At that time, however, the son born by the flesh persecuted the son born by the Spirit. It is the same now. 30But what does the Scripture say? “Expel the slave woman and her son, for the slave woman’s son will never share in the inheritance with the free woman’s son.” 31Therefore, brothers, we are not children of the slave woman, but of the free woman.…

If Christ is the New Adam, wouldn't this mean that the old Adam is still present? And if Christ is the New Adam, is Adam a spirit that is within us in order to guide us daily?

If Christ became a new Adam and obtained a new bride by his side being pierced where the water and blood spilled out to create a new bride for this new Adam, was the story of the first Adam like this? Adam was lain down in a sleep of death so that a bride could be taken from his own body, and the two became one and they were called,'' Adam.'' Was Adam a male spirit inside a bride of flesh? I think he was and I think the references to the left eye is where the spirit of Adam would dwell, and the spirit of Eve in the right eye of flesh. But my thoughts of this are always going back and forth. I think that we are of Adam, and we are of Eve and the serpent, but there is a cause for a new Adam, and a cause to cast out the bondswoman and her son.

Welcome to the forum Hannibal Flavius!

 

[musterion]

Yes, the exhortations are no doubt pointless and useless to you.

They would be useless if "we are not influenced by dead flesh."

You are a fool.

 

[Hannibal Flavius]

Well, thanks so much Daq!