ECT When does responsibility before God "kick in"?

nikolai_42

Well-known member
Allow me to say up front that the academic nature of my question does not indicate a coldness to this girl's condition. But if salvation is about meeting emotional needs, then we should all simply preach a social gospel and worry more about feelings than spiritual condition. I use this article only as an example of the variety of physical and mental conditions that exist - and that if salvation is a universal need with a single qualification for all humanity and the same single standard (and same One Way) for all of humanity - then the patent emotional arguments that could be used miss the necessary focus.

I'm sure this sounds like an age of accountability question, but it isn't. Not quite. It's more the question of the mentally handicapped. The thing is, this is a handicap only in the sense of diminished capacity. Maybe it doesn't make a difference, but this girl doesn't seem to grasp a lot of things. There isn't any physical condition other than her brain is much smaller than normal :

https://www.yahoo.com/parenting/girl-with-almost-no-brain-is-still-alive-at-10-165306200.html

The upshot is, though, that she can't process nearly the same amount of information as most can - nor at the relatively high level that the average individual can. The article clearly says that most of the handful of people who suffer from this condition appear to be unconscious.

Taking this to a logical extent (some might say extreme), at what point does someone have "enough brains" and understanding to comprehend the gospel? A child doesn't have the understanding is the argument for an age of accountability. They aren't responsible for what they can't grasp. This child will probably never have that level of understanding - simply because she doesn't have enough of a brain.

If we assume she is a sinner, what makes her that? If we agree that all have sinned and come short of the glory of God, why should those who have diminished mental capacity (relative to the average man on the street) be exempted? The article says she knows when bad things are going on and so she can respond on at least a basic emotional and relational level.

Or is our awareness of sin come to by some other process than intellectual determination? Of course it is come to spiritually, but without a certain level of mental ability, does that register? Would it be considered offensive if another were to try and share the gospel with this girl in her early teen years (or even now, at 10)? If so, why? Of course, I accept that given the situation, it is something that should be reserved for the parents who know her best. But even then, if the parents don't know the Lord, where does that leave the girl?

I'm not asking if she is saved or not. Intentionally so. Even with us, no one has that absolute knowledge save for God. But the way in which we approach this basic apologetic subject is at least partly determined by our understanding of how individuals take in information, the role of the intellect - and by the nature of the Word of God and its interplay with our faculties (intellectual, emotional and spiritual).
 

1Mind1Spirit

Literal lunatic
Luke 12:48 KJV


48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given , of him shall be much required : and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.
 

revpete

New member
I think the overall teaching of scripture is that all will be judged on the amount of light received. OT: Deut. 1:39. NT as 1M 1S

Pete
 

nikolai_42

Well-known member
I think the overall teaching of scripture is that all will be judged on the amount of light received. OT: Deut. 1:39. NT as 1M 1S

Pete

I agree. Having established that, the question I have is whether her understanding is limited by her cerebral restrictions or if it isn't. And not just her, but others who are handicapped. And then extend that to an age of accountability. Is the limitation intellectual that is being spoken of in scripture? Or something largely other than that?
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
I agree. Having established that, the question I have is whether her understanding is limited by her cerebral restrictions or if it isn't. And not just her, but others who are handicapped. And then extend that to an age of accountability. Is the limitation intellectual that is being spoken of in scripture? Or something largely other than that?

That's really an interesting question. As I understand it, the spirit in us communicates with the Spirit of God. There is no reason this child's spirit should be unable to see what her limited mind can't possibly comprehend. I see it the same as babies who die....they go to be with God because they were created to know Him.

Proverbs 20:27
The spirit of man is the candle of the Lord, searching all the inward parts of the belly.​
 

revpete

New member
I agree. Having established that, the question I have is whether her understanding is limited by her cerebral restrictions or if it isn't. And not just her, but others who are handicapped. And then extend that to an age of accountability. Is the limitation intellectual that is being spoken of in scripture? Or something largely other than that?

The first is a medical question which I am not qualified to answer and the second I feel would be different for everyone because we are all individuals and develop at different rates.

Pete 👤
 

1Mind1Spirit

Literal lunatic
That's really an interesting question. As I understand it, the spirit in us communicates with the Spirit of God. There is no reason this child's spirit should be unable to see what her limited mind can't possibly comprehend. I see it the same as babies who die....they go to be with God because they were created to know Him.

Proverbs 20:27
The spirit of man is the candle of the Lord, searching all the inward parts of the belly.​

:) :straight:
 

Danoh

New member
The answer to the OP's question is - When one knows of God's standard of right from wrong, Rom. 10:17.
 

Truster

New member
Allow me to say up front that the academic nature of my question does not indicate a coldness to this girl's condition. But if salvation is about meeting emotional needs, then we should all simply preach a social gospel and worry more about feelings than spiritual condition. I use this article only as an example of the variety of physical and mental conditions that exist - and that if salvation is a universal need with a single qualification for all humanity and the same single standard (and same One Way) for all of humanity - then the patent emotional arguments that could be used miss the necessary focus.

I'm sure this sounds like an age of accountability question, but it isn't. Not quite. It's more the question of the mentally handicapped. The thing is, this is a handicap only in the sense of diminished capacity. Maybe it doesn't make a difference, but this girl doesn't seem to grasp a lot of things. There isn't any physical condition other than her brain is much smaller than normal :

https://www.yahoo.com/parenting/girl-with-almost-no-brain-is-still-alive-at-10-165306200.html

The upshot is, though, that she can't process nearly the same amount of information as most can - nor at the relatively high level that the average individual can. The article clearly says that most of the handful of people who suffer from this condition appear to be unconscious.

Taking this to a logical extent (some might say extreme), at what point does someone have "enough brains" and understanding to comprehend the gospel? A child doesn't have the understanding is the argument for an age of accountability. They aren't responsible for what they can't grasp. This child will probably never have that level of understanding - simply because she doesn't have enough of a brain.

If we assume she is a sinner, what makes her that? If we agree that all have sinned and come short of the glory of God, why should those who have diminished mental capacity (relative to the average man on the street) be exempted? The article says she knows when bad things are going on and so she can respond on at least a basic emotional and relational level.

Or is our awareness of sin come to by some other process than intellectual determination? Of course it is come to spiritually, but without a certain level of mental ability, does that register? Would it be considered offensive if another were to try and share the gospel with this girl in her early teen years (or even now, at 10)? If so, why? Of course, I accept that given the situation, it is something that should be reserved for the parents who know her best. But even then, if the parents don't know the Lord, where does that leave the girl?

I'm not asking if she is saved or not. Intentionally so. Even with us, no one has that absolute knowledge save for God. But the way in which we approach this basic apologetic subject is at least partly determined by our understanding of how individuals take in information, the role of the intellect - and by the nature of the Word of God and its interplay with our faculties (intellectual, emotional and spiritual).

One of two things will occur.

She will be born above, be regenerate and trust.

Or she will perish in her sin.

Which ever occurs the Eternal Almighty will be glorified.
 
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