What don't you get about the divine attributes of God? Omniscient, Omnipotent, Omnipresent. THE attributes that make Him God. If you want a God of your own making that's fine but the God of the Bible is not this science formula your mentors like to define for you.
Proof from the Bible that God is In Time
- Thread starter Nathon Detroit
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What don't you get about the divine attributes of God? Omniscient, Omnipotent, Omnipresent. THE attributes that make Him God. If you want a God of your own making that's fine but the God of the Bible is not this science formula your mentors like to define for you.
genuineoriginal
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You are confused.
God is God. Period.
He knows what He knows, He is able to do what He does, and He is where He is at.
There is no need to say He has to be something He is not by claiming He has to have Greek Philosophical attributes in order to be God.
Sorry about your luck bucko. The attributes of which I speak are written and proven in the Bible. Your philosophical perspective is what has blinded you.
genuineoriginal
New member
Well, we can go "are not" "are too" until be are both blue in the face without changing anything.
I have looked closely at the proof texts used and they are inconclusive in declaring God is "Omniscient", "Omnipotent", "Omnipresent" using the definitions of those terms accepted in classical theism.
Looks like that's your problem, not mine. The Bible isn't a "proof text" it's The Word of God and it isn't "classical theism" it's the truth.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
points of view......
points of view......
Thats the thing with 'opinions' - many points of view, perspectives, assumptions, beliefs.....within a particular religious tradition, all using the same canon of 'inspired' writings. Kinda how things go
This happens to be your 'current' point of view, appropriating what knowledge or perspective you have 'acquired' up to this point in time. Your point of view 'could' change.
In any case, classically the 3 'omnis' of 'God' still hold, because the originality, universality, infinity, supremacy and ultimacy of God's very nature always prevails, because of who or what God is (unqualifiedly so). It is only when certain 'qualifications' on these universal attributes are 'assumed' do we have what we perceive as 'limitations' upon 'God'. The 'omnis' have been assigned to 'God' from antiquity for a reason, since these attributes have always been assumed to be inherent to 'God'.
Even if you hold to the general view of Open Theism, with respect to free will and omniscience,...the infinite knowledge of God which is always in the 'present' is all-perfect and supreme, in every actual moment of present existence, cognizant of all potentials and possibilities pregnant within this "now". (even here, God's knowledge of the totality of reality is always greater than any one individual point of view). So, in general,...to say that 'God' is all-knowing,...or is the 'Light' of all-knowing (as Infinite Intelligence itself) still holds because 'God' is Light. 'God' is pure Being and Consciousness, the One Spirit-Presence everywhere, having all knowledge and all power possible. (but still even here we are adding the qualifier of 'possible', by our own standards of time perception and what we assume can or cannot be known). Again, we can assume certain 'qualifications' on Gods atttributes...but lets not forget that there are aspects of Supreme Deity or The Absolute...that are Unqualified and not subject to conditional knowledge, space or time. Otherwise... since 'God' is involved and engaged with-in Creation,...naturally Spirit is active in both time and space, by the very nature of movement and his 'everywhere' presence. All is 'point of view'(from a relative perspective), beyond the pure conscious light of God-reality itself....which is always all-knowing, all-being, all-present.
pj
points of view......
Thats the thing with 'opinions' - many points of view, perspectives, assumptions, beliefs.....within a particular religious tradition, all using the same canon of 'inspired' writings. Kinda how things go
This happens to be your 'current' point of view, appropriating what knowledge or perspective you have 'acquired' up to this point in time. Your point of view 'could' change.
In any case, classically the 3 'omnis' of 'God' still hold, because the originality, universality, infinity, supremacy and ultimacy of God's very nature always prevails, because of who or what God is (unqualifiedly so). It is only when certain 'qualifications' on these universal attributes are 'assumed' do we have what we perceive as 'limitations' upon 'God'. The 'omnis' have been assigned to 'God' from antiquity for a reason, since these attributes have always been assumed to be inherent to 'God'.
Even if you hold to the general view of Open Theism, with respect to free will and omniscience,...the infinite knowledge of God which is always in the 'present' is all-perfect and supreme, in every actual moment of present existence, cognizant of all potentials and possibilities pregnant within this "now". (even here, God's knowledge of the totality of reality is always greater than any one individual point of view). So, in general,...to say that 'God' is all-knowing,...or is the 'Light' of all-knowing (as Infinite Intelligence itself) still holds because 'God' is Light. 'God' is pure Being and Consciousness, the One Spirit-Presence everywhere, having all knowledge and all power possible. (but still even here we are adding the qualifier of 'possible', by our own standards of time perception and what we assume can or cannot be known). Again, we can assume certain 'qualifications' on Gods atttributes...but lets not forget that there are aspects of Supreme Deity or The Absolute...that are Unqualified and not subject to conditional knowledge, space or time. Otherwise... since 'God' is involved and engaged with-in Creation,...naturally Spirit is active in both time and space, by the very nature of movement and his 'everywhere' presence. All is 'point of view'(from a relative perspective), beyond the pure conscious light of God-reality itself....which is always all-knowing, all-being, all-present.
pj
Which of these attributes can you show me from His word? And how does His experiencing as we do [we are created in His image] negate any of them anyway?
genuineoriginal
New member
Exactly, which is why Calvinism is wrong and the Greek Philosophical attributes of the perfect imagined god do not apply to the Living God.
ThePresbyteers
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The Calvinist has been told, via the Bible, that the Living God lives before the human lives. That means that God comes first and created that thought before you even think a thought. Arminians believe they created their own thoughts off non-existent free will. Thats where the Devil fools man into thinking he can also be a god. Tip: No man can trace the source of their thoughts so they create a lie where a thought comes from, themselves.
What's the meaning of being guided by the Holy Spirit if we guide ourselves? Once we realise the present, we're long gone in the past. Our brains can't think of the absolute present where the Living God lives.
genuineoriginal
New member
That kind of stuff and nonsense leads to the conclusion that God directed the thoughts of Hitler when Hitler decided to murder all the Jews in Europe.
Isn't that what you are really saying?
ThePresbyteers
New member
If it happens, it happens. Most look for God over there. Where is God to you? Is He here or over there. Dividing God isn't possible. Man can't think fast enough to react where God really is. Are you saying that God wasn't present when Hitler did his actions?
genuineoriginal
New member
Quite so, which means that there is no reason to push all of God's plans to a time before the creation of the world. God's reactions are fast enough that He can travel to any place we can think of before we can finish the thought.
I am saying that God did not devise a scheme before the creation of the world that required Hitler to think of killing all the Jews in Europe.
ThePresbyteers
New member
In time, nothing is wasted. I wouldn't want to waste time looking for God over there when He is here. It's also acceptable for you to think God has nothing to do with Hitler's choices. God also wants to to think you have a free will for other reasons. In my 2 cents worth, I don't believe I have any free will. Even in China, the monks teach that it is the Qi that controls every action you do.
ThePresbyteers
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genuineoriginal
New member
You have the "free will" choice of who you will serve.
Joshua 24:14-15 14Now therefore fear the LORD, and serve him in sincerity and in truth: and put away the gods which your fathers served on the other side of the flood, and in Egypt; and serve ye the LORD. 15And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD. |
Omniscient: God is all knowing
A. God knows everything that has actually happen.
B. Gods knows everything that can potentially happen.
Omnipotent: God is all powerful
A. God has already done everything he is infinitely capable of doing.
B. God has not done everything he is infinitely capable of doing.
Omnipresent: God is present everywhere
A. God is present in all past and future history of the universe.
B. God is present everywhere in the present.
Which is literally Biblical? A, would logically mean that the world is as eternal as God is. B, would logically mean the world has a beginning.
--Dave
Isaiah 55:8 RSV For my thoughts are not your thoughts...says the Lord.
How dumb can you get. :hammer:
--Dave
You are funny. The WORLD is not God. LOL! You can't see those qualities in God ALONE. That's your problem. Get God would ya!
The God of the living is a living God, who moves and is moved.
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