Japanese PM Offers Condolences for WWII Deaths

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think this was a class act for Japan's PM and I believe it was genuine. Whether my dad would have accepted the apology if he was still alive, well that's another matter. The story from Foxnews is below.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...-in-wwii-in-speech-pushing/?intcmp=latestnews

 

[rexlunae]

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think this was a class act for Japan's PM and I believe it was genuine. Whether my dad would have accepted the apology if he was still alive, well that's another matter. The story from Foxnews is below.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...-in-wwii-in-speech-pushing/?intcmp=latestnews

I was listening to Mr. Abe's speech, and while it's true that he offered condolences, I don't believe he did offer an apology. If it was there, I missed it. The thing that has often been a cloud over Japan's post-war attitude has been the failure to recognize that they did wrong as a nation and to take moral responsibility for it.

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

I was listening to Mr. Abe's speech, and while it's true that he offered condolences, I don't believe he did offer an apology. If it was there, I missed it. The thing that has often been a cloud over Japan's post-war attitude has been the failure to recognize that they did wrong as a nation and to take moral responsibility for it.

I didn't hear the speech so I can't comment on the validity of your take. You are right to point out that there's a difference between condolences and an apology. Maybe I will get a chance to read or hear the whole speech tonight.

 

[rexlunae]

I didn't hear the speech so I can't comment on the validity of your take. You are right to point out that there's a difference between condolences and a apology. Maybe I will get a chance to read or hear the whole speech tonight.

It's worth a listen, although I don't know if there's a recording available somewhere. It struck me as a very carefully-worded speech, and not just as a result of the language barrier.

 

[The Berean]

I was listening to Mr. Abe's speech, and while it's true that he offered condolences, I don't believe he did offer an apology. If it was there, I missed it. The thing that has often been a cloud over Japan's post-war attitude has been the failure to recognize that they did wrong as a nation and to take moral responsibility for it.

How does a nation a a whole take "take moral responsibility"? :idunno: Sure the leader of nation and the government can offer condolences, apologies, even financial restitution. But this is an action by the government, not the citizens of that nation.

 

[rexlunae]

How does a nation a a whole take "take moral responsibility"? :idunno: Sure the leader of nation and the government can offer condolences, apologies, even financial restitution. But this is an action by the government, not the citizens of that nation.

By acknowledging past actions, particularly at an official level. Japan has often played a game of trying to say 'yeah, we did some bad things, but everyone did bad things, so we're all even'. And this attitude is so pervasive in Japanese public statements that it is clearly a problem of systematically avoiding accurate memory. It's not unlike Turkey's denial of the Armenian genocide.

 

[The Berean]

By acknowledging past actions, particularly at an official level. Japan has often played a game of trying to say 'yeah, we did some bad things, but everyone did bad things, so we're all even'. And this attitude is so pervasive in Japanese public statements that it is clearly a problem of systematically avoiding accurate memory. It's not unlike Turkey's denial of the Armenian genocide.

It seems the Japanese PM was trying to at least start this process. It will be interesting how this will go. I was thinking about how the common Japanese citizen will/should react to this? Most Japanese people today were born long after WW II ended. I'm sure most of them are aware of Japan's actions during WW II.

 

[rexlunae]

It seems the Japanese PM was trying to at least start this process. It will be interesting how this will go.

I might think so if it weren't for the fact that his comments were essentially the status quo.

I was thinking about how the common Japanese citizen will/should react to this? Most Japanese people today were born long after WW II ended. I'm sure most of them are aware of Japan's actions during WW II.

And that is the problem. When you don't teach true history, you erase the crimes of the past.

 

[The Berean]

I might think so if it weren't for the fact that his comments were essentially the status quo.

I'm not sure what you expect him to say? Japan owes apologies to China and Korea before the U.S. IMO. My wife is Korean and the Korean people still harbor resentment towards Japan for their WW II atrocities to this day. My wife is in her late 40's so she has memories and stories passed down from her parents of what they went though during WW II.

And that is the problem. When you don't teach true history, you erase the crimes of the past.

I have visited Japan. The Japanese people are aware of what Japan did during World War II. For young Japanese people, though, they really have no connection to WW II Japan. What exactly does a Japanese person born in 1992 have to apologize for? Similarly, I don't expect a 22 year old German to have to apologize for what the Nazi's did.

 

[rexlunae]

I'm not sure what you expect him to say?

It's not that I'm surprised he didn't say more. I just wanted to correct the impression that he'd apologized, because I think that's inaccurate. They should apologize, but I don't know that a speech to Congress is necessarily the right place for it.

Japan owes apologies to China and Korea before the U.S. IMO. My wife is Korean and the Korean people still harbor resentment towards Japan for their WW II atrocities to this day. My wife is in her late 40's so she has memories and stories passed down from her parents of what they went though during WW II.

China, Korea, Guam (which is a US territory with a painful memory of Japanese occupation), the Philippines, Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia, Malaysia, Singapore, Hong Kong, Australia, and the US. Even Taiwan, if you go back a bit.

I have visited Japan. The Japanese people are aware of what Japan did during World War II. For young Japanese people, though, they really have no connection to WW II Japan. What exactly does a Japanese person born in 1992 have to apologize for? Similarly, I don't expect a 22 year old German to have to apologize for what the Nazi's did.

Individually, nothing. This is about the nation as a whole.

 

[jgarden]

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think this was a class act for Japan's PM and I believe it was genuine. Whether my dad would have accepted the apology if he was still alive, well that's another matter. The story from Foxnews is below.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...-in-wwii-in-speech-pushing/?intcmp=latestnews

Japanese law does not define those convicted in the post-1945 trials as criminals, despite the fact that Japan's governments have accepted the judgments made in the trials, and in the Treaty of San Francisco (1952). This is because the treaty does not mention the legal validity of the tribunal. Had Japan certified the legal validity of the war crimes tribunals in the San Francisco Treaty, the war crimes would have become open to appeal and overturning in Japanese courts. This would have been unacceptable in international diplomatic circles Current Prime Minister Shinzo Abe has advocated the position that Japan accepted the Tokyo tribunal and its judgements as a condition for ending the war, but that its verdicts have no relation to domestic law. According to this view, those convicted of war crimes are not criminals under Japanese law.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_war_crimes

The Japanese have repeatedly denied any responsibility for the WW2 atrocities attributed to them and Japanese law does not recognize the legitimacy of those convicted of war crimes by international tribunals.

Is it a coincidence that this particular apology just happens to coincide with the Japanese PM Abe's attempt to conclude a trade agreement with the US?

 

[TomO]

I'm not sure what you expect him to say? Japan owes apologies to China and Korea before the U.S. IMO. My wife is Korean and the Korean people still harbor resentment towards Japan for their WW II atrocities to this day. My wife is in her late 40's so she has memories and stories passed down from her parents of what they went though during WW II.

lain: That's pretty much the way I feel about it. Anything that Japan did to us; we paid back in spades....As far as I'm concerned we're more than even.

....China, Korea, and all the others? Well, I don't really expect them to be quite so amicable. :nono:

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

The Japanese have repeatedly denied any responsibility for the WW2 atrocities attributed to them and Japanese law does not recognize the legitimacy of those convicted of war crimes by international tribunals.

Is it a coincidence that this particular apology just happens to coincide with the Japanese PM Abe's attempt to conclude a trade agreement with the US?

I was wondering when someone would bring that up. I agree with you, it's not a coincidence. But Japan and the US have had good relations since the war ended. Most of the people responsible on the Japanese side are dead now. So how can we expect an apology from people who had nothing to do with WWII? Is their acknowledgement that important? Have we apologized to every native American for what we did in the name of Manifest Destiny? We probably owe an apology to Mexico too.

 

[The Berean]

I was wondering when someone would bring that up. I agree with you, it's not a coincidence. But Japan and the US have had good relations since the war ended. Most of the people responsible on the Japanese side are dead now. So how can we expect an apology from people who had nothing to do with WWII? Is their acknowledgement that important? Have we apologized to every native American for what we did in the name of Manafest Destiny? We probably owe an apology to Mexico too.

And Mexico owes an apology to the indigenous people of Mexico as well.

 

[Saved.One.by.Grace]

And Mexico owes an apology to the indigenous people of Mexico as well.

And Spain, Portugal and England owe apologies to everyone in the Americas. How far back do we go?

 

[The Berean]

And Spain, Portugal and England owe apologies to everyone in the Americas. How far back do we go?

All the way back to the beginning with Cain.