Hi to all , and many dispensationalist , believe that the the EKKLESIA /ASSEMBLY or Body of Christ is part of the New Covenant ??
What do you say and what verse will you use ??
dan p
All these crossover threads aren't going to make it easy for one trying to learn about this two gospel idea.
We are "under" the law of Christ (1 Cor. 9:21), who is the mediator of a new covenant (Heb. 9:15). We are no longer strangers to the covenants (Eph. 2:12) which means we are no longer outsiders in relation to the covenants. Sounds like we are part of the new covenant to me.
Pauline truth? I think that might offend Paul. I’m more interested in God truth.I believe that you are not understanding what Pauline truth means !!
Why would I do that?Why not start your own thread of what the meanings of 1 Cor 9:21 and what Heb 9:15 are talking about , especially Heb 9:15 !!
Like I said, I don’t know if we are technically “under” a covenant, but we are certainly no strangers to the covenants (Eph. 2:12, 19), which means we are no longer outsiders in relation to the covenants. In that way—“on the inside,” so to speak—we are part of the new covenant.Eph 2:12 , that because we were strangers from the New Covenant , that all of a sudden , we are in a Covenant with Christ , when we are " in Christ " , you need to thing that again !!
This is how I’d link them. Heb. 9:15 is speaking of the necessity of a new covenant. Jesus, by means of death, became the mediator of this new covenant. He is the mediator for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant. This does, indeed, relate to Israel. But Paul informs us that Israel’s not alone in needing redemption (Rom. 6:23). Jesus is the Mediator of this new covenant He made with the house of Israel and the house of Judah (Jer. 31:31), and Gentiles partake in the blessings and promises of that covenant (Eph. 2:19) through the same faith as Abraham (Rom. 4:16)—the same faith Abraham had while uncircumcised. And to the amazement of some Jews in that day, and I’m sure to the delight of others, Paul informed them that Jews partake in the covenant in the same way: through faith. (Rom. 4:14, 16). The promise is guaranteed to the all the descendants—those who are of the faith of Abraham without being circumcised (i.e. Gentiles, Rom. 4:11) and those who are of the faith of Abraham with being circumcised ("of the Law") (Rom. 4:12-13). [Verse 11 refers to Abraham being the father of Gentiles and verse 12 refers to Abraham being the father of Jews—those of the circumcision who follow in the steps of the faith of Abraham (i.e. Jews with faith)].It will be interseting to see HOW you will link Heb 9:15 to the Body of Christ when Heb 9:15 is speaking to Israel ??
All these crossover threads aren't going to make it easy for one trying to learn about this two gospel idea.
Pauline truth? I think that might offend Paul. I’m more interested in God truth.
Why would I do that?
Like I said, I don’t know if we are technically “under” a covenant, but we are certainly no strangers to the covenants (Eph. 2:12, 19), which means we are no longer outsiders in relation to the covenants. In that way—“on the inside,” so to speak—we are part of the new covenant.
This is how I’d link them. Heb. 9:15 is speaking of the necessity of a new covenant. Jesus, by means of death, became the mediator of this new covenant. He is the mediator for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant. This does, indeed, relate to Israel. But Paul informs us that Israel’s not alone in needing redemption (Rom. 6:23). Jesus is the Mediator of this new covenant He made with the house of Israel and the house of Judah (Jer. 31:31), and Gentiles partake in the blessings and promises of that covenant (Eph. 2:19) through the same faith as Abraham (Rom. 4:16)—the same faith Abraham had while uncircumcised. And to the amazement of some Jews in that day, and I’m sure to the delight of others, Paul informed them that Jews partake in the covenant in the same way: through faith. (Rom. 4:14, 16). The promise is guaranteed to the all the descendants—those who are of the faith of Abraham without being circumcised (i.e. Gentiles, Rom. 4:11) and those who are of the faith of Abraham with being circumcised ("of the Law") (Rom. 4:12-13). [Verse 11 refers to Abraham being the father of Gentiles and verse 12 refers to Abraham being the father of Jews—those of the circumcision who follow in the steps of the faith of Abraham (i.e. Jews with faith)].
Pauline truth? I think that might offend Paul. I’m more interested in God truth.
Why would I do that?
Like I said, I don’t know if we are technically “under” a covenant, but we are certainly no strangers to the covenants (Eph. 2:12, 19), which means we are no longer outsiders in relation to the covenants. In that way—“on the inside,” so to speak—we are part of the new covenant.
This is how I’d link them. Heb. 9:15 is speaking of the necessity of a new covenant. Jesus, by means of death, became the mediator of this new covenant. He is the mediator for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant. This does, indeed, relate to Israel. But Paul informs us that Israel’s not alone in needing redemption (Rom. 6:23). Jesus is the Mediator of this new covenant He made with the house of Israel and the house of Judah (Jer. 31:31), and Gentiles partake in the blessings and promises of that covenant (Eph. 2:19) through the same faith as Abraham (Rom. 4:16)—the same faith Abraham had while uncircumcised. And to the amazement of some Jews in that day, and I’m sure to the delight of others, Paul informed them that Jews partake in the covenant in the same way: through faith. (Rom. 4:14, 16). The promise is guaranteed to the all the descendants—those who are of the faith of Abraham without being circumcised (i.e. Gentiles, Rom. 4:11) and those who are of the faith of Abraham with being circumcised ("of the Law") (Rom. 4:12-13). [Verse 11 refers to Abraham being the father of Gentiles and verse 12 refers to Abraham being the father of Jews—those of the circumcision who follow in the steps of the faith of Abraham (i.e. Jews with faith)].
I agree.#1 , He is a mediator of a New Covenant that is given to Israel Heb 8:8 !!
Wait a minute? I thought you said, “Let me explain Heb. 9:15 to you.” The new covenant is described in Jer. 31:31 and Isaiah 59:21.#2 , Can you explain what is in the NEW COVENANT , OR WILL YOU ??
Okay. But his death and resurrection did much more than that.#3 , When Jesus died on the cross , His death PAID FOR OVER 1600 years sins where Israel killed thousands of animal .
Okay. But his death and resurrection did much more than that.#4 , Jesus paid " for the Redemption of the FIRST transgressions that were under the FIRST TESTAMENT "
You haven’t explained anything to me. And you going around saying to others’ posts, “Your response is MOOT” as if it’s some kind of claim with any weight is getting redundant and boring.#5 , By , exegesis and CONTEXT your response is MOOT and has no merit !!
I agree.
Wait a minute? I thought you said, “Let me explain Heb. 9:15 to you.” The new covenant is described in Jer. 31:31 and Isaiah 59:21.
Okay. But his death and resurrection did much more than that.
Okay. But his death and resurrection did much more than that.
You haven’t explained anything to me. And you going around saying to others’ posts, “Your response is MOOT” as if it’s some kind of claim with any weight is getting redundant and boring.
Why would anyone’s questions be offensive? I really don’t understand your comment. And I didn’t say you were boring. Your continual “Your response is MOOT!” comment is getting tiring. My responses may not “enlighten” dispensationalism, but so what? That was never my intention in the first place. My intention is to understand Scripture IN context.Hi , and just what does the New Covenant given too ?? HUH !!
#1 , If it is described in Jer 31:31 , Isa 59:21 , and do not forget Ezek 36:24-38 is a DESCRIPTION of Israel , and not for the Body of Christ .
What I mean is that you have nothing to debate or enlighten Dispensationalism .
Moot to me means not Debatable .
Israel were given CONITIONAL and UNCONDITIONAL Covenants , but you knew that , right !!
Start an new threads and explain all the Covenants given in the Bible and educate me and prove who these Conditional and Unconditions were given to and prove how BORING I am !!
And I am not offended by any of your questions at ALL !!
dan p
Why would anyone’s questions be offensive? I really don’t understand your comment. And I didn’t say you were boring. As for this thread, the body of Christ partakes in the blessings of the new covenant that God made with Israel through Messiah Jesus (Eph. 2:12, 19).
No, I didn’t say “your posts” are redundant and boring. I said, “Your comment, ‘Your response is MOOT!” is getting redundant and boring.” If you have difficulty interpreting simple comments such as that, you may want to rethink your adamant belief of this two gospel doctrine.Hi , and in post #9 , you were saying that my posts were " redundant and boring " are your words
According to Eph. 2:12, 19 the body of Christ partakes in the blessings of the new covenant that God made with Israel through Messiah Jesus.by Rom 11:12 we are enjoying Grace , BUT this does not mean God has a New Covenant with the Body of Christ !!
No, I didn’t say “your posts” are redundant and boring. I said, “Your comment, ‘Your response is MOOT!” is getting redundant and boring.” If you have difficulty interpreting simple comments such as that, you may want to rethink your adamant belief of this two gospel doctrine.
According to Eph. 2:12, 19 the body of Christ partakes in the blessings of the new covenant that God made with Israel through Messiah Jesus.
I am under no obligation to prove anything to you. This forum is called "MidActs Dispensationalism." It is for those who adhere to this doctrine to prove their position. YOU have not done that. I am still waiting.Hi , and if you believe in ONE GOSPEL , give a verse where is says that ??
If I believe in more than , I can defend my position , so DEFEND your One Gospel Theology , if you can ?? HEH , HEH !!
dan p
I am under no obligation to prove anything to you. This forum is called "MidActs Dispensationalism." It is for those who adhere to this doctrine to prove their position. YOU have not done that. I am still waiting.
This is the one saving gospel:
Acts 26:17-23 ...Jewish people and...the Gentiles,...to open their eyes so that they may...receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance...by faith in Me [Christ Jesus]...at Jerusalem...and even to the Gentiles that they should repent...performing deeds appropriate to repentance. ...stating nothing but what the Prophets and Moses said...that the Christ was to suffer and by reason of his resurrection...he would...proclaim light to both the Jewish people and to the Gentiles.
Hi , and I have some 10 OP , proving Paul is right on and when did you disprove one , Like Rom 1:1 ???
Give it a shot ??
dan p
Pauline truth? I think that might offend Paul. I’m more interested in God truth.
Why would I do that?
].
Who?Hi , and what doe think about the following verse , in 2 Cor 2:10 , " Yo whom ye forgive any thing , I for gave also , for IF I forgave any thing , I forgave it , for your sakes forgave I IT IN THE PERSON OF CHRIST ".
When Paul forgave , Paul forgave in the Person of Christ , and do you know who ELSE could say This ??
We are "under" the law of Christ (1 Cor. 9:21), who is the mediator of a new covenant (Heb. 9:15). We are no longer strangers to the covenants (Eph. 2:12) which means we are no longer outsiders in relation to the covenants.
This is the one saving gospel:
Acts 26:17-23 ...Jewish people and...the Gentiles,...to open their eyes so that they may...receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance...by faith in Me [Christ Jesus]...at Jerusalem...and even to the Gentiles that they should repent...performing deeds appropriate to repentance. ...stating nothing but what the Prophets and Moses said...that the Christ was to suffer and by reason of his resurrection...he would...proclaim light to both the Jewish people and to the Gentiles.
The body of Christ partakes in the promise and blessing of the new covenant. The gospel that saves is for Jewish people and Gentile people that they would open their eyes and receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance (i.e. new covenant promise) by faith in Christ who died and was raised to life, and that they, both Jews and Gentiles, should repent, performing deeds appropriate to repentance.