How Much Damage Did Trump Cause in Helsinki?

[The Barbarian]

After U.S. President Donald Trump’s Helsinki debacle, it is time to take stock of what the substantive damage caused by his conduct might entail. This is not to gloss over the anger in response to his betrayal of the United States in front of one of its most dedicated adversaries. I share that anger, and as rich as the English language is, its syntactic menu of fulminations and imprecations has been taxed to the limit this week as voices across the political spectrum have denounced Trump. Suffice to say it was one of the most appalling moments in the annals of presidential history.

But what might its actual effects be going forward on our country and our national interests? A potential damage assessment must begin with understanding that it wasn’t just about that dreadful day in Helsinki—it was the entire week that led up to it. Trump’s trashing of the NATO alliance, calling the European Union a “foe” of the United States, insulting British Prime Minister Theresa May and further weakening her fragile coalition, and blaming the United States first for the frictions in its relationship with Russia. Taken together, it was a terrible week for the Western alliance, or what we not long ago called the free world.

It is impossible to tell at this juncture just how much harm Trump’s diplomatic malpractice did to the United States and its interests, but I will here pose a few speculations and places to watch for lingering fallout
...
(Lots of stuff)
...
That this category even needs mentioning shows what perilous straits we inhabit. Trump’s grotesque willingness to consider Putin’s demand for Russia to be able to interrogate some of his most effective critics, reiterated yesterday by the White House press secretary, has prompted justifiable outrage. Even entertaining the notion as Trump did, along with his muted reaction to Russia’s chemical assassination attempts against regime opponents, may further embolden Putin’s gangster behavior. It also puts at risk U.S. diplomats serving in repressive nations, as other governments see the president of the United States refusing to stand up for the people who serve under him.

We already know that Trump’s European misadventure was a disgrace. But just how much damage it actually did will become clear in the weeks and months to come

 

[intojoy]

What’s your IQ? Zero.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Foxfire]

After U.S. President Donald Trump’s Helsinki debacle, it is time to take stock of what the substantive damage caused by his conduct might entail. This is not to gloss over the anger in response to his betrayal of the United States in front of one of its most dedicated adversaries. I share that anger, and as rich as the English language is, its syntactic menu of fulminations and imprecations has been taxed to the limit this week as voices across the political spectrum have denounced Trump. Suffice to say it was one of the most appalling moments in the annals of presidential history.

But what might its actual effects be going forward on our country and our national interests? A potential damage assessment must begin with understanding that it wasn’t just about that dreadful day in Helsinki—it was the entire week that led up to it. Trump’s trashing of the NATO alliance, calling the European Union a “foe” of the United States, insulting British Prime Minister Theresa May and further weakening her fragile coalition, and blaming the United States first for the frictions in its relationship with Russia. Taken together, it was a terrible week for the Western alliance, or what we not long ago called the free world.

It is impossible to tell at this juncture just how much harm Trump’s diplomatic malpractice did to the United States and its interests, but I will here pose a few speculations and places to watch for lingering fallout
...
(Lots of stuff)
...
That this category even needs mentioning shows what perilous straits we inhabit. Trump’s grotesque willingness to consider Putin’s demand for Russia to be able to interrogate some of his most effective critics, reiterated yesterday by the White House press secretary, has prompted justifiable outrage. Even entertaining the notion as Trump did, along with his muted reaction to Russia’s chemical assassination attempts against regime opponents, may further embolden Putin’s gangster behavior. It also puts at risk U.S. diplomats serving in repressive nations, as other governments see the president of the United States refusing to stand up for the people who serve under him.

We already know that Trump’s European misadventure was a disgrace. But just how much damage it actually did will become clear in the weeks and months to come

We have no way of knowing what national security blunders befell Trump at the hands of a HIGHLY trained KGB agent for in excess of two hours.

 

[annabenedetti]

We have no way of knowing what national security blunders befell Trump at the hands of a HIGHLY trained KGB agent for in excess of two hours.

And... Devin Nunes and the GOP want to make sure it stays that way. They're in this up to their eyeballs.


WASHINGTON — Republicans on the House Intelligence Committee have blocked a move to subpoena the American translator from the Helsinki summit to testify about the private talks between President Donald Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin.

The panel’s top Democrat, Rep. Adam Schiff, said Thursday he wanted the translator, who works for the State Department, to appear in closed session, saying Congress must “find out what was said” during the two-hour meeting.

“It is incumbent on us, given what the president said publicly that was of such great concern to our country, to our NATO allies, that we find out what was said privately,” Schiff said.

The California lawmaker said he realizes it’s an “extraordinary” step to subpoena the interpreter, but added it’s also extraordinary for the president to meet alone with a U.S. adversary. . . .

Sen. Chuck Schumer of New York questioned Thursday if any top administration officials, including Secretary of State Mike Pompeo or Defense Secretary James Mattis, were given any of the details about the meeting or informed of any military or security agreements that were made between Trump and Putin.

“It is utterly amazing, utterly amazing, that no one knows what was said,” Schumer said. “This is a democracy. If your president makes agreements with one of our leading — if not our leading — adversary, his Cabinet has to know about it and so do the American people.”

​

 

[ok doser]

..“It is utterly amazing, utterly amazing, that no one knows what was said,” Schumer said.

meh :idunno:

prolly putin's still scratching his head trying to figger out what trump said

...our leading — if not our leading — adversary....

schumer's a retard

we're still at war in afghanistan, we're still at war in korea, we're still trying to put the lid on Iran's nuclear ambitions

we're not at war with russia

 

[Arthur Brain]

We have no way of knowing what national security blunders befell Trump at the hands of a HIGHLY trained KGB agent for in excess of two hours.

Dread to think, which seems to be natural for Trump as well...

lain:

 

[annabenedetti]

meh :idunno:

prolly putin's still scratching his head trying to figger out what trump said

Well, according to Russia's ambassador to the US, they made "important verbal agreements," and Putin made "specific and interesting proposals to Washington."

The American people deserve to know what those are.

(So do his intelligence, defense, and foreign affairs officials, who are apparently just as much in the dark.)

 

[MennoSota]

There is a Sovereign God who raises up nations and tears them down. There is nothing done by any government leader that God is not acutely aware of and using to accomplish His will.
Christians are told to pray for the peace of the city. May God guide leaders to bring peace and not war.

 

[meshak]

There is a Sovereign God who raises up nations and tears them down. There is nothing done by any government leader that God is not acutely aware of and using to accomplish His will.
Christians are told to pray for the peace of the city. May God guide leaders to bring peace and not war.

Well said, Christians should not get involved in the politics.

 

[Arthur Brain]

Well, according to Russia's ambassador to the US, they made "important verbal agreements," and Putin made "specific and interesting proposals to Washington."

The American people deserve to know what those are.

(So do his intelligence, defense, and foreign affairs officials, who are apparently just as much in the dark.)

Fat chance.

 

[annabenedetti]

Profanity at the link.

U.S. Officials ‘at a [redacted] Loss’ Over Latest Russia Sellout

During President Trump’s press conference with Vladimir Putin in Helsinki, Putin pivoted a question about extraditing the 12 Russian intelligence officers whom Robert Mueller has indicted into a quid pro quo for going after longtime betes noire currently beyond his reach.

Putin singled out Bill Browder, whose exposure of widespread Russian tax fraud led to the passage of a U.S. human rights sanctions law Putin hates. Standing next to Trump, the Russian president accused Browder of masterminding an illegal campaign contribution to Hillary Clinton and alleging vaguely that he had “solid reason to believe that some intelligence officers guided these transactions.” Should Trump permit the Russians to question people around Browder, Putin hinted, he will let Mueller’s people be “present at questioning” of the intelligence officers. . . .

On Wednesday, Russian prosecutors escalated the stakes. The prosecutor-general’s office said it wanted to interview Michael McFaul, the former U.S. ambassador to Russia, another Putin bete noire. McFaul—the Obama-era ambassador to Moscow—replied on Twitter that the Russians know well that he wasn’t even in Russia during the relevant time frame for any case against Browder.

At the White House, however, press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders declined to rule out permitting the Russians to question McFaul. Sanders said that there had been “some conversation” in Helsinki about the issue, though Trump made no “commitment.”

“The president is gonna meet with his team and we’ll let you know when we have an announcement on that,” Sanders said.

By contrast, State Department spokesperson Heather Nauert called the Russian request for McFaul “absolutely absurd”—which was closer in line with how former U.S. diplomats viewed Putin’s gambit.

“If the U.S. would make a former diplomat avail for questioning by a foreign government without evidence of wrongdoing, then that would be quite horrifying,” said Ron Neumann, a former ambassador to Afghanistan and current president of the American Academy of Diplomacy.

Susan Rice, the former U.S. ambassador to the United Nations and Barack Obama’s national security adviser, tweeted that the lack of commitment to protecting McFaul was “beyond outrageous. Amb. McFaul served our country honorably and with full diplomatic immunity. If the White House cannot defend and protect our diplomats, like our service members, they are serving a hostile foreign power not the American people. . . .”

Ned Price, a former CIA analyst and spokesman for the Obama National Security Council, said Sanders’ comments made Trump look “even weaker” than during Trump’s Monday press conference with Putin. “Trump has always been all too eager to cave to Putin, but, as far as we know, it’d been largely in the abstract. He sells out our intelligence community, attacks NATO, shelves our commitment to human rights. But Putin now has specific demands in the form of human beings—one of them formerly our designated representative to Russia,” Price said.

“By failing to reject the idea out of hand – immediately and forcefully – Trump signaled that absolutely nothing is off limits when it comes to Putin. And just as shocking, he’s willing to play Putin’s brand of ball, in which the world is purely transactional and lives are expendable.”

The current U.S. diplomat said the openness to turning over McFaul capped off a shocking week for U.S. geopolitics.

“The president has first and foremost his interests at the top of his mind, as opposed to the government’s. That’s very clear over the past week and a half, between [redacted] on our NATO allies and kissing Putin’s [redacted],” the diplomat said. “He cares more about himself than the nation and any of us who serve it.”

The diplomat continued: “Either he’s compromised by Putin or he’s a [redacted], in which case he should grab himself.”

 

[drbrumley]

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

The utter malevolence of our political class was dramatized in all its darkness by their reaction to the Helsinki summit: the “Treason summit” they dubbed it, with the Twitter hashtag going viral. That’s what they think of a meeting between the heads of two countries which have thousands of nuclear-tipped missiles aimed at each other.

The extinction of humankind – who cares? What really matters is appeasing Hillary Clinton’s sense of entitlement. Anything else is pure sedition.

 

[drbrumley]

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

I must be so out of touch, so distant from current cultural cues and memes, that I failed to pick up the ostensible reason for the outcry that greeted Trump’s performance in Helsinki. What specifically did he say that got them breathing so heavily? What the heck did he do?

As far as I can tell, Trump’s big sin was apparently engaging in the following exchange with some grandstanding “reporter”:

“Thank you. Mr. President, you tweeted this morning that it’s U.S. foolishness, stupidity, and the Mueller probe that is responsible for the decline in US relations with Russia. Do you hold Russia at all accountable or anything in particular? And if so, what would you what would you consider them that they are responsible for?

“TRUMP: Yes I do. I hold both countries responsible. I think that the United States has been foolish. I think we’ve all been foolish. We should have had this dialogue a long time ago, a long time frankly before I got to office. And I think we’re all to blame.”

 

[drbrumley]

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

The pundits are screeching about “moral equivalence” – how dare the President put Russia on the same moral plane as the pure-as-the-driven-snow United States of America! This is an argument we hear mostly from reflexive defenders of Israel, who claim that the Jewish state’s right to shoot unarmed Palestinian children in the back is derived from this “no moral equivalency” premise. It’s a nonsensical contention, one that sanctifies double standards and obviates the need for any sort of moral compass whatsoever – in short, it’s a perfect ethical framework for our amoral elites.

 

[drbrumley]

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

Ordinary people don’t think like that: this doctrine of exceptionalism is upheld by the political class, who are used to getting away with murder – literally. Trump, for his part doesn’t think that way: for all his rather obvious faults, he’s as close to a real human being as any President in modern times, and is therefore properly contemptuous of ruling class hubris that somehow exempts Washington from any and all blame. Remember “You think we’re so innocent?” That’s why he’s not afraid to say that both countries have indeed been responsible for the deterioration of relations — although I would say the US has been the really guilty party.

 

[drbrumley]

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

It started in 2003, when Richard Perle and the neocons close to the Bush II administration demanded that Russia be kicked out of the G-8 for arresting oligarch Mikheil Khodorkovsky, who was accused of crimes ranging from tax evasion to murder. Things escalated when Putin opposed the Iraq war and warned that it would be a disaster for the United States and the world.

 

[drbrumley]

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

Asked by reporters to repeat the Russia-gate mantra that Russia was responsible for “hacking” the 2016 presidential election, the President demurred but was later – in what Tucker Carlson called the “hostage video” – persuaded to reiterate the official US government line, backing up DNI Dan Coates’ contention that the Russians were behind it all. And yet Trump still demurred, ad libbing from a prepared statement that “it could be other people also.”

 

[drbrumley]

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

No wonder they want him out of there! They can’t control Trump, and they know it – which is precisely why he’s been targeted by the Deep State.

This summit really showed us who is an Establishment shill and who is speaking truth to power. The latter includes the heroic Tucker Carlson, Senator Rand Paul, and Trump’s hardcore supporters like Ann Coulter – in short, all the very best people. The former includes all the worst people imaginable, i.e., practically the entire political class, both the left and the right, who are still tirelessly denouncing this latest peace initiative by our ambitious and idealistic President.

 

[drbrumley]

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

Most modern American Presidents, starting with Franklin Delano Roosevelt, have met with their Russian counterparts: and certainly this has been an absolute necessity since the dawn of the nuclear era. It’s simply a safety feature of the world order. To not engage with Moscow is to abandon the chief (and I would argue the only) legitimate function of our federal government: protecting the physical safety of US citizens.

 

[drbrumley]

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

Trump’s ‘Treason’: Challenging the Empire Let that Helsinki in by Justin Raimondo

We are facing the prospect of another arms race with Russia and the growing possibility of a nuclear confrontation. With Democrats demanding that we declare a “state of war” exists between Washington and Moscow, and the neocon contingent in the GOP joining in, the President must appeal to the people who elected him to support his foreign policy of peaceful engagement with Russia. And there are many indications that this is just what’s happening: recent polls show a pluralilty of Republicans don’t consider Russia an enemy. While the anti-Russian demonization campaign has been going on for years, and is well advanced, given the intensity of the propaganda it’s had surprisingly little effect on ordinary Americans. The alleged “threat” from Russia is maybe number 100 on the list of threats real people think about.