Bob and Tom Joseph Debate Arranged Marriage

[Jefferson]

Bob and Tom Joseph Debate Arranged Marriage

Wednesday November 16th, 2005. This is show # 227.

BEST QUOTES OF THE SHOW:

I think one of the most devastating influences on a future marriage is violating the marriage covenant even before it occurs by committing fornication.

People say how could you be committed to somebody you didn't choose? Well, you don't choose your parents and most of us love our parents. You don't choose your kids and you love your kids more than anybody in the world.

 

[Ninjashadow]

I have a problem with that last quote. First of all, you can choose whether or not you have kids. Therefore, in a way, you did choose your kids. Secondly, one has no choice as to whom they are born. However, one certainly does have a choice to whom one is married. There's a big difference.

 

[Jefferson]

I have a problem with that last quote. First of all, you can choose whether or not you have kids. Therefore, in a way, you did choose your kids.

But you did not choose their temperments, IQ's, morality, etc. You can try to mold those via good parenting but ultimately it's the child's choice as to what kind of person he or she will be and the parent is "stuck" (so to speak for the sake of argumet) with that child for at least 18 years.

 

[Granite]

I have a problem with that last quote. First of all, you can choose whether or not you have kids. Therefore, in a way, you did choose your kids. Secondly, one has no choice as to whom they are born. However, one certainly does have a choice to whom one is married. There's a big difference.

I think forcing a woman to marry the man who seduced her is pretty reprehensible. Punishing both parties for either an act of indiscretion, stupidity, romance, or foolishness is simply backward and absurd.

 

[Jefferson]

I think forcing a woman to marry the man who seduced her is pretty reprehensible. Punishing both parties for either an act of indiscretion, stupidity, romance, or foolishness is simply backward and absurd.

I think if guys knew in advance that they would be required to marry any girl they had sex with, there would be a HUGE percentage of males vowing to remain celebate until marriage.

 

[Ninjashadow]

But you did not choose their temperments, IQ's, morality, etc. You can try to mold those via good parenting but ultimately it's the child's choice as to what kind of person he or she will be and the parent is "stuck" (so to speak for the sake of argumet) with that child for at least 18 years.

Perhaps. However, if he has no say in how the child "turns out" why should a father get to have a say in who the child marries?

 

[Lucky]

Bob and Tom Joseph Debate Arranged Marriage

Good stuff.

 

[Granite]

I think if guys knew in advance that they would be required to marry any girl they had sex with, there would be a HUGE percentage of males vowing to remain celebate until marriage.

Would the rules be different if it's the girl/woman doing the seducing?

 

[Yorzhik]

Interesting

 

[Jefferson]

Would the rules be different if it's the girl/woman doing the seducing?

No. The Bible says that a couple that engages in premarital sex should be required to get married. It makes no exceptions as to which party does the seducing.

 

[Jefferson]

Perhaps. However, if he has no say in how the child "turns out" why should a father get to have a say in who the child marries?

You're missing the point of the quote which is that it is very easy to be committed to someone you did not choose.

 

[Ninjashadow]

You're missing the point of the quote which is that it is very easy to be committed to someone you did not choose.

I understand what he's saying, but I think that's a lousy defense for arranged marriage.

 

[Granite]

No. The Bible says that a couple that engages in premarital sex should be required to get married. It makes no exceptions as to which party does the seducing.

So if a twenty-year-old male is seduced by a forty-five-year-old woman, you'd favor them getting married.

Coercing people to spend their lives together because of an act of stupidity is simply absurd.

 

[Jefferson]

I understand what he's saying, but I think that's a lousy defense for arranged marriage.

Which method do you think would result in a lower divorce rate?

 

[Jefferson]

So if a twenty-year-old male is seduced by a forty-five-year-old woman, you'd favor them getting married.

Coercing people to spend their lives together because of an act of stupidity is simply absurd.

That's like saying, "Coercing people to spend time in jail for stealing because of that act of stupidity is simply absurd."

If they know the consequences of the law in advance then they don't have my sympathy. Besides, those consequences would greatly reduce the incidence of the premarital sex occuring in the first place which would greatly reduce the number of abortions, the number of divorces, the number of children growing up in homes without a father which would result in a lower crime rate, etc. The benefits to society just continues to snowball.

 

[erinmarie]

I think if guys knew in advance that they would be required to marry any girl they had sex with, there would be a HUGE percentage of males vowing to remain celebate until marriage.

They can 'vow' all they want. It's just like teens who do the 'Silver Ring Thing' and then have sex with their boyfriends/girlfriends. Some kids will just tell you want you want to hear.

Just like when you tell a guy that he has to marry the girl he has sex with out of marriage. "Yeah, sure I will, of course." Yeah right. And how do you enforce something like that?

 

[Granite]

That's like saying, "Coercing people to spend time in jail for stealing because of that act of stupidity is simply absurd."

If they know the consequences of the law in advance then they don't have my sympathy. Besides, those consequences would greatly reduce the incidence of the premarital sex occuring in the first place which would greatly reduce the number of abortions, the number of divorces, the number of children growing up in homes without a father which would result in a lower crime rate, etc. The benefits to society just continues to snowball.

If you're equating theft with sex, I'm not the one with the problem.:nono:

I think people would continue to have sex much as they've done throughout human history. The libido is notoriously difficult to impede. Christianity has been obsessed with doing so for a very long time with rather "iffy" results.

I would have to say that people who criticize sex and obsess over it...probably don't have it.

 

[Ninjashadow]

Which method do you think would result in a lower divorce rate?

You're probably going to say arranged marriage. If that works for you, or Bob, or whomever, that's great. But what I don't like is people (and I kind of got this impression from Bob and if I'm interpreting it wrong, I apologize) that say that arranged marriage is the only Christian way to go. It's what God wants. I find that very irritating. Like I said, if someone wants to do arranged marriage and the kids are all for it, then so be it. I just don't like someone saying that it's what everyone should do.

 

[Jefferson]

They can 'vow' all they want. It's just like teens who do the 'Silver Ring Thing' and then have sex with their boyfriends/girlfriends.

That's because there are no consequences. Not even a social stigma.

 

[Jefferson]

If you're equating theft with sex, I'm not the one with the problem.:nono:

No, I'm equating theft with sex outside of marriage.

I would have to say that people who criticize sex and obsess over it...probably don't have it.

Again, Christians don't criticize sex. They criticize sex outside of marriage.